Airfix's new 1/100 HMS Victory

Vapochilled - not having actually built the Heller Victory I'm afraid I can't help much. I did spot the mixed up numbers on the deck beams. That made me wonder what other typographical errors might lurk in those instructions.

I'm a little confused by your references to priming. Primer isn't necessary to make modern, high-quality hobby paint stick to styrene plastic. (It is, though, a good idea to wash all the parts in soap and water, to remove any residual mold release.) The Heller Victory that I got was molded in several garish colors - some of them downright irrational. (E.g. - black gun carriages that were to be painted yellow, and a bright red rudder.) If I were building the thing I'd probably give those gun carriage components a sprayed or airbrushed coat of grey to provide a good base for the yellow, but I wouldn't regard it as necessary to prime everything.

My biggest color-related criticism of that kit concerned the rigging line, which was a peculiar, nauseous shade of green. But I recommend discarding any kit-supplied thread in any case.

Drawde - I'm pretty sure the Airfix Kriegsmarine set consists of reissued Heller kits. About thirty years ago Heller did quite a series of 1/400 German warships. They aren't bad kits - though not quite as detailed as the best of the Heller French ships. (The old Richelieu is a beauty.) My guess is that the kits in the set are good bases for serious scale models, but probably would take some work. There are some good 1/400 photo-etched metal part sets out there.

Vapochilled,

Contact of off BB and I'll shoot you some pictures of my Victory.

jbgroby@cox.net

Jake in La.

JT- it is a great idea to wash parts-especially resin, and priming may start to obscure detail-like wood grain. LPIB*

*less paint is better, ;-)

All the large surfave areas, I am priming so I can see any missed sanding, before the top coat goes on. Yes the red rudder and black canon carridges, started on those last night! The thread in this kit is white! I need to give a good stiff cup of coffee before use. why do you not use the thread? what do you use instead?
Big jake, mail sent, thanks

I have a IMAI 1/80 scale Japanese wood kit "cut model" that I purchased a number of years ago in Japan. It's a slice of the Victory at the Main Mast, from top to keelson. All of the instructions are in Japanese!!!!

Revan-i've seen that kit recently-maybe a european re-issue. i Googled and couldn't find it. But all you Victory fans, hear this: Verlinden makes a gun deck cutway with 1 cannon-would make a great compliment to your model. They also make a Lord Nelson figure to match-but he's not in a cask of rum.

Vapochilled - there's a lot of room for discussion about rigging materials. The stuff that comes with plastic kits usually is pretty sorry stuff - some sort of flabby cotton mix that shrinks and expands with changes in the humidity. Most kit-supplied line is also far too heavy for the scale. I don't know what Heller is packing with its kits these days, but I'd be reluctant to use it.

Different modelers have different ideas on this score. My personal preference is silk, but it's hard to find these days. Lots of experienced modelers prefer linen. It's good, durable stuff, but hard to find in small diameters - and if you do find small enough linen it's likely to have lumps in it. If you use either silk or linen, you'll find it's only available in a few diameters. That means that in order to rig the model to scale you'll need to build a "rope making machine," which is a bit of a project. (Making the gadget in itself doesn't take long, but spinning the rigging line yourself does.)

Model Shipways (via Model Expo: www.modelexpo-online.com ) sells some stuff it describes as a "cotton/poly" mix that's given me pretty good results lately. I like the color of it, and the lay of it looks like genuine rope.

Here are links to pictures of three of my models. The Bounty and Hancock have silk rigging; for the Phantom I used some silk (I'm running out of the stuff I bought twenty years ago) and some of the Model Shipways line. On a larger, more complex model I'd be a little worried about mixing materials, but for this little schooner I think it will be ok.

http://gallery.drydockmodels.com/album194

http://gallery.drydockmodels.com/album195

http://gallery.drydockmodels.com/album207


One tip: whatever you use for the rigging, don't use coffee or tea to color it. Both contain acids that are highly destructive to fibers; your rigging is likely to start falling apart in a few years. Your first choice should be to buy thread of the right color in the first place. If you can't find the right color, use a fabric dye that's made for the purpose.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Drawde I was also looking forward to the release of the new Airfix Kriegsmarine set (which includes a destroyer and various minesweepers, U-boats and S-boats, all in 1/400) until I discovered that the price is going to be £45.99. This also seems very high (I was expecting it to be somewhere around £20-25) - apart from the destroyer, most of the models in this set must be tiny, and the destroyer can't be -that- big (a 1/600 one is pretty small) Anyone know if this is also a re-issue? I've never seen these for sale before, individually or as a set, but I'm not exactly an expert. If they are actually new mouldings, the high price is more forgivable.

QUOTE: Originally posted by jtilley Drawde - I'm pretty sure the Airfix Kriegsmarine set consists of reissued Heller kits. About thirty years ago Heller did quite a series of 1/400 German warships. They aren't bad kits - though not quite as detailed as the best of the Heller French ships. (The old Richelieu is a beauty.) My guess is that the kits in the set are good bases for serious scale models, but probably would take some work. There are some good 1/400 photo-etched metal part sets out there.

Tilley - you're right about the Airfix set; except that it seems to be back in Heller's 2005 catalogue as well (kit #81091). I haven't seem the Airfix set but I'm almost sure it is the same one as the Heller. I haven't bought it though, so I don't know about the quality.

Drawde - You get at least 1 submarine, 1 E-Boat, and 3 destroyer-sized ships (1 Torpedoboot, 1 Zerstorer, 1 unidentified ship); but some sources state that you actually get more than those 5 ships: 1 submarine, 1 Torpedoboot, 1 Zerstorer, 2 mine-laying ships, and 6 E-Boat (see http://kitbox.free.fr/news/HELLER2005_P/). According to Heller, the sub is 168mm long, the Torpedoboot 255mm and the Zerstoerer 315mm - all are 1/400 scale. You can get the U-Boat, the Zerstorer and Torpedoboot individually from Heller (provided you find a shop on the web, but this shouldn't be too hard). The price you mentioned seems to be a little harsh: I found out the Heller kit sells for about 40€ in Europe (about 27£)
For photoetched parts, this might help you a bit: http://www.steelnavy.com/WEM400GermanAA.htm

If you consider getting the submarine separately, I would recommend you get Mirage's subs instead. They have an incredible range of U-Boats in that same 1/400 scale, which allow you to build not only the different tower conversion (and AA guns development) but also three different types (to be more precise: type II A-B-C-D, type VII B-C-C/41 and type IX A-B-C-C/40-D/1-D/2).
I never got Heller's U-Boat in my hands but heard it was less accurate and detailed than Mirage's one (see the flooding holes at http://modelstories.free.fr/analyses/avions/MS2004_2P/HELR_VIIC/index.html ; there are numerous reviews on the web for Mirage's U-Boats - make sure to find the ones with the PE parts on the kit). Another advantage for Mirage is that they produced detailled photoetched kits for almost every U-Boat kit (except type IX D).

I am in the process of building my own fleet of 16 little U-Boats, with different tower configuration and colour paints, and have to say I'm quite pleased with the result (one of my biggest satisfaction being to put the tiny type II next to the long type IXD).

One last hint: go to http://www.ibg.com.pl . They have the largest stock of Mirage PE parts (I had to send tens of email queries until I finally found this shop)

Jtilley, your hired,lol when can you start?
I'll look into those links
Looking at the 4 lines supplied, they look like they might be polyester, they are white so will need dipping.
I'm going to host some pics of the build on my site, once I get them up, I'l leave a link.
Did I mention, I hate canons!!! doing the 24LB lower deck guns, it's just a huge amount of hours, and you don't even see them properly,lol

Vapochilled - it will be a long, long time before you really need to worry much about rigging line. My suggestion, though, is to toss the stuff that came with the kit and buy some line that's made for ship modeling. Dying thread - and getting a nice, even color into it - is far more complicated than simply dipping it. I decided a long time ago that dying thread wasn't worth the trouble. Appropriately-colored thread doesn't cost much, and the stuff MS sells (or that a modeler spins up on a rope-making machine) looks far more like real rope. Besides, far more than four diameters of line will be needed to do even a halfway-decent job of rigging a model like that. If you spend a little extra money on decent line, the improvement in the finished model's appearance will be quite significant.

I'll google for places to get the lines from, I guess I need to get the books out to try and figure the correct Dia for them all.

The two most convenient web sources for rigging line are Model Expo ( www.modelexpo-online.com ) and Bluejacket ( www.bluejacketinc.com ). Bluejacket carries cotton (not recommended), nylon (ok for the finest lines, but not very good for bigger ones), and linen (great stuff, but it would have to be dyed - and expensive in the necessary quantities). Model Expo, under the Model Shipways label, sells that nice "cotton-poly mix" that - on the basis of limited experience with it - I rather like. I particularly like the "hemp" color and the texture of it; it really does look like rope.

The best (and most expensive) model rope available probably is the material called "Admiralty Brand" linen. It's quite expensive, and the firm that sells it is currently evading my senile memory. I'm inclined to recommend the Model Shipways stuff.

Bluejacket and Model Expo are also good sources for some fittings that you're probably going to want to buy eventually. The blocks and deadeyes that come with the kit really need to be discarded. Styrene plastic is a wonderful, versatile material, but there are some parts to which it just isn't suited. A rigid mold cannot produce a block or deadeye with holes through it and a groove around it. The Heller designers came up with some clever dodges to get around the problem, but they don't really work.

Again, this is a problem that's a long way in the future, but you'll probably want to buy replacement deadeyes and blocks. Some modelers like the wood ones available from Model Expo; my own personal favorites are Bluejacket's cast britannia metal blocks and deadeyes. They aren't cheap, but the expense can, if you like, be spread out over a long period. (You only have to order a dozen at a time.) Yesterday I included links to some pictures of my models; they're rigged with Bluejacket blocks and deadeyes. If you play around a little with that site ( www.drydockmodels.com ) you'll encounter plenty of pictures of models rigged with wood blocks and deadeyes. Take your pick - but the plastic ones in the kit are just about useless.

The Longridge and McKay books probably contain enough info to establish the diameters of line you'll need. The best source on such topics, though, is The Masting and Rigging of British Warships, by James Lees. The diagrams and verbal descriptions in that book are, I think, about the clearest description of the topic in print. Another book that belongs in your library is Seamanship in the Age of Sail, by John Harland. It doesn't contain as much precise data as the others, but it's a wonderful treatise on how old sailing ships actually worked. And the illustrations are spectacular.

Hope this helps a little. Good luck.