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My first build

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  • Member since
    November, 2010
My first build
Posted by STL DALE on Thursday, November 18, 2010 7:19 AM

So with a suggestion from rjkplasticmod over in my "hello'' post I have decided to buil a 1/48 P-51B Mustang in the OD over NG colors.

Here come the questions.

Wich rattle can paints are easiest for a beginner to work with? Acrylic's or Laquer's?

Also should I spay these on dull and then overcoat them in gloss or spray them directly on as a gloss?

  • Member since
    April, 2010
  • From: Yuma, AZ
Posted by Ripcord on Thursday, November 18, 2010 7:27 AM

i would think enamel in light coats in flat or semi flat.  Gloss or Future for decals.  Then spray dull coat.  I have a 51 in the future so ill be following this one if you dont mind.  Smile  Rattle cans are difficult and fustrating to get the finish one is looking for....just my opinion.  I guess anything can be fix with time and patience.  Stick out tongue

Mike

  • Member since
    March, 2003
  • From: Northern New Jersey
Posted by Tojo72 on Thursday, November 18, 2010 7:27 AM

welcome to the forum,Tamiya makes a nice line of spray paints,also I would recommend spraying flat paint and adding the gloss coat for decals    post pics of your build

  • Member since
    February, 2003
  • From: Green Bay, WI USA
Posted by echolmberg on Thursday, November 18, 2010 7:42 AM

Welcome Dale!

Heck I don't know if olive drab or neutral grey even exist in gloss aerosol form.  If they do, could someone please let me know.  That being said, I think you will have no other recourse but to use flats, apply a gloss topcoat, place your decals, then apply a flat topcoat on top of all that.

REMEMBER!  The rule of thumb when using paints is the "LEA" method.  By that I mean, if you're going to use various paints/finishes, never apply a lacquer over an enamel.  It can be done but only in thin coats or else it will eat right through the paint.  LEA stands for 1)Lacquer 2)Enamel and 3)Acrylics.  That's the order you should keep in mind when applying the layers.  If you start with an enamel, then it's safe to apply acrylics over it.

Right now I'm finishing a model with a lacquer flat coat over my Testors Model Master enamels.  I'm doing it in only the thinnest of coats!!!  I applied a light mist coat last night.  I'll apply another light mist coat tonight and maybe another one this weekend.  I've ruined too many finishes by trying to apply it all in one heavier coat.

Best wishes!

Eric

  • Member since
    December, 2009
  • From: Endicott, Va.
Posted by Bomber Boy on Thursday, November 18, 2010 7:51 AM

Welcome Dale, as Eric said, spray the Matt finish then a Gloss for decals, here's were I differ in that I apply another gloss coat over the decals, then spray the Dull coat. I have found in the past that over time if you don't "Seal" the decals the dull coat will curl and peel from the decals.

Good Luck, Have FUN!!!

James

James Herndon II __-_-_/"\_-_-__

Endicott ,Va

beandawgartworks.com

  • Member since
    November, 2010
Posted by STL DALE on Thursday, November 18, 2010 9:32 AM

So I should use flat spray enamels?

  • Member since
    March, 2003
  • From: Northern New Jersey
Posted by Tojo72 on Thursday, November 18, 2010 9:35 AM

yes they cover nicely

  • Member since
    November, 2010
Posted by STL DALE on Thursday, November 18, 2010 9:48 AM

So then the order is:

Flat rattle can enamels, apply decals,gloss enamel coat, then a enamel flat coat?

  • Member since
    February, 2003
  • From: Green Bay, WI USA
Posted by echolmberg on Thursday, November 18, 2010 10:01 AM

Bomber Boy

I have found in the past that over time if you don't "Seal" the decals the dull coat will curl and peel from the decals.

Very interesting James!  I never heard of that happening but I'll have to give that a try.  Also, something in the back of my mind is telling me that I heard somewhere that if you apply an additional gloss coat on top of the decals, that'll help blend them in better.  Then after that you can apply the flat clear coat.

Eric

  • Member since
    December, 2009
  • From: Endicott, Va.
Posted by Bomber Boy on Thursday, November 18, 2010 10:27 AM

STL DALE

So then the order is:

Flat rattle can enamels, apply decals,gloss enamel coat, then a enamel flat coat?

It should go, Flat rattle can, gloss enamel, apply decals, gloss enamel, dull coat/ flat coat !

James

James Herndon II __-_-_/"\_-_-__

Endicott ,Va

beandawgartworks.com

  • Member since
    December, 2002
  • From: NYC, USA
Posted by waikong on Thursday, November 18, 2010 1:46 PM

Do what James said about adding the gloss coat BEFORE the decals. Decals needs a nice even surface to go on, otherwise, trapped pockets of air will cause 'silvering', that is little white spots on the decals.  A flat coat of paint is flat because of the uneven nature of the paint as it dries, refleciting light in all different ways, which gives it the 'flat' quality. Gloss coat is reflecting the the light back at you together, thus it looks shiny.

  • Member since
    February, 2003
  • From: Green Bay, WI USA
Posted by echolmberg on Thursday, November 18, 2010 3:03 PM

STL DALE

So I should use flat spray enamels?

As far as I know, when it comes to olive drab and neutral grey, they can ONLY be found as flats.  I do not believe they exist as gloss.  I wish they did.

So, by default, when it comes to those colors, using flats is your one and only option.  So don't make yourself flustered by trying to search high and low for those colors in a gloss format.  Sadly, they don't exist.

Eric

PS.  I highly recommend using the Testors Model Master rattle cans when it comes to the olive drab!!!  Tamiya makes an O.D. but the color is just way off for some reason.

  • Member since
    November, 2010
Posted by STL DALE on Thursday, November 18, 2010 3:33 PM

Wow!

Thanks for all this great advise folks!

  • Member since
    August, 2009
  • From: Toledo Area OH
Posted by Sparrowhyperion on Thursday, November 18, 2010 4:25 PM

Use Enamels for the primary paints.  Use the Testor's Model Master cans.  They are the easiest rattle cans to work with.

Always use a Gloss for the main coat.  You can flat it out after you decal, but you do not want to put decals on a mmatt (flat) finish.  They will silver if you do.  Also, use Microscale Micro Set and Micro Sol as instructed.  It helps the decals bond better and afterward, they will look painted on.  So do your painting in Gloss OD, as well as any Camo you might decide to do.  then let it dry, then put on a small amount of Micro Set where a Decal is to go.  Quickly put on the decal.  Do the Set and Decal for all of your decals one at a time.  Let them all dry and then apply a coat of Micro Sol on top of the decals.   When you are completely done, you can put on a coat of future floor wax and let that dry (not necessary, but it protects the decals and paint more.)  Finally, if you want, you can spray on some Clear Model Master Dullcoat.

Laquers can be very aggressive to the plastic, which is why most people don't use it on plastic models unless they have to.  Technically the Dullcoat is a laquer, but its a bit different than laquer paint.  It's not quite as aggressive, and it will not eat through the future.  A note, if you use a single particular brand of enamels like Model Master (recommended), then use Model Master Dullcoat.  Model Master products are designed to work with each other for the best possible results. 

Eventually you might want to get an airbrush.  They usually give you better results than a spray can (trust me, I just started using one and the difference in the paint is noticeable), and you can use standard Model Master enamel jar paint in them, which is cheaper than buying cans and you don't have a tenth the amount of wasted paint.

Another trick I just tried is to decant spray paint from a can into a jar to use in an airbrush.  It gave me very good results.  I use old baby food jars to store the paint in and it works great.

I hope this helps.

Rich

 

STL DALE

So with a suggestion from rjkplasticmod over in my "hello'' post I have decided to buil a 1/48 P-51B Mustang in the OD over NG colors.

Here come the questions.

Wich rattle can paints are easiest for a beginner to work with? Acrylic's or Laquer's?

Also should I spay these on dull and then overcoat them in gloss or spray them directly on as a gloss?

In the Hangar: 1/48 Hobby Boss F/A-18D RAAF Hornet,

On the Tarmac:  F4U-1D RNZAF Corsair 1/48 Scale.

  • Member since
    April, 2005
  • From: Monster Island-but vacationing in So. Fla
Posted by carsanab on Thursday, November 18, 2010 4:53 PM

Dale...

Again...welcome!!Welcome Sign

one quick warning with those rattle cans...careful with the coverage/buildup.....since there is no adjusting the pressure you can get a lot of paint build up real quick...so try and control...light coats and build up....watch your distance from the nozzle to the surface....do some test runs first...

 

Good luck and lets see some pics!!!

 Photobucket

  • Member since
    November, 2010
Posted by STL DALE on Thursday, November 18, 2010 5:16 PM

Well I havent even started  and things have changed.

A coworker brought in a 1/48 Revell P-40B and gave it to me!

I know its paint scheme is a camofluage and will be more difficult for me to do but I am going to try it.

Can anyone give me the names of the colors I should use?

I am still going to use the spray cans for the painting though.

  • Member since
    August, 2009
  • From: Toledo Area OH
Posted by Sparrowhyperion on Thursday, November 18, 2010 5:34 PM

Colors vary by the particular kit and markings you choose to use.  Some are OD, some are a camo pattern.  I even saw aP40 at an air show which was all natural metal.  When you open the kit, the instructions usually have a list of the colors you will need.  Like I said, stick to the Model Master cans and jars.  If you do some searches here and on the net in general, you will find a lot of good tutorials on Camo paintinng if that is what your kit calls for.  The best advice I have for you is take it slow.  Be patient and methodical.  Read the entire instructions a few times over and sort of build up a mental picture of what you want it to look like when finished and the best way to get that result.  Work on one sub assembly at a time.  It is always better to paint internal stuff like cockpit instrument panels, throttles, even the pilot seat before assembly when possible.  By possible I mean you need to make sure that you can paint it first without interfering in the physical points of contact between two or more parts.  As an example...  I usually assemble most of the cockpit detail before I paint it, that way, when I do paint it, it will cover any seam lines or discolorations.  Also I paint the inside of fuselage halves where they need to be painted before installing the cockpit subassembly when possible after dry fitting and carefully marking where I should not paint because it is where the cockpit module needs to be glued.  Remember, glue will NOT hold properly on paint of any kind.  I hope this helps.

 

STL DALE

Well I havent even started  and things have changed.

A coworker brought in a 1/48 Revell P-40B and gave it to me!

I know its paint scheme is a camofluage and will be more difficult for me to do but I am going to try it.

Can anyone give me the names of the colors I should use?

I am still going to use the spray cans for the painting though.

In the Hangar: 1/48 Hobby Boss F/A-18D RAAF Hornet,

On the Tarmac:  F4U-1D RNZAF Corsair 1/48 Scale.

  • Member since
    February, 2003
  • From: Green Bay, WI USA
Posted by echolmberg on Friday, November 19, 2010 7:48 AM

Dale, one thing I think we all forgot to mention (and please forgive me if i missed it) is to start with the lighter colors first.  In the case of your Mustang, that means start with painting the neutral grey on the bottom.  Don't worry too much if you get overspray (where you paint more the plane than you anticipated).  If your grey goes further up the side or like on the tail, don't sweat it because the olive drab which you will paint next will cover it up.  But always do the lightest colors first and then work your way to the darker colors last.  To give you an extreme example, it's always easier to cover white with black than black with white.

In the case of the camoflaged P-40, you'll be starting with the grey bottom (or possibly a blueish hue depending on the scheme), then the tan, then the greens.

Lastly, Rich (Sparrow) mentioned using a gloss olive drab enamel.  Rich, what company makes a gloss O.D.?  I don't think Testors/MM does.  If you know of one, please share!  I'd love to have a supply of gloss O.D.!  Stick out tongue

Eric

  • Member since
    August, 2009
  • From: Toledo Area OH
Posted by Sparrowhyperion on Friday, November 19, 2010 9:05 AM

Sorry,  my Bad.  I thought Model Masters made it in a gloss enamel.  Well, then just put on a coat of glosscote over the OD before decaling it. :)

Rich

 

echolmberg

Lastly, Rich (Sparrow) mentioned using a gloss olive drab enamel.  Rich, what company makes a gloss O.D.?  I don't think Testors/MM does.  If you know of one, please share!  I'd love to have a supply of gloss O.D.!  Stick out tongue

Eric

In the Hangar: 1/48 Hobby Boss F/A-18D RAAF Hornet,

On the Tarmac:  F4U-1D RNZAF Corsair 1/48 Scale.

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