So I don't know how it will fit into your scenario that you have worked out, but if this does turn into a group build, I may have to go with my home state hear and do a Bear Flag Republic plane. That could have interesting potential as well.

SLW 45

A very cool concept and build . The jet looks great.

Thanks for the kind words!  I'm glad you like it.

Hans, gray works for me.  Seems the ROT has one pilot already, lol.

Gary

A very cool concept and build . The jet looks great.

Sweet, Hans! 

Texgunner

Here it is.  What do ya'll think?

Familiar desing, lol... What about grey flight suits?

MAJ Mike

Would be perfect aircraft or vehicle marking!

How would that look on a Gloster Gladiator?  I have the old Lindberg kit lurking in the locker.  ROTAF or RTAF?  Which "rolls off the tongue" better?

Like the relationship that Great Britain had with the actual CSA, the British also had a great interest in Texas itself.  In fact, the first railroad built in Texas ran up the Brazos River (El Rio de los Brazos del Dios) valley toward Waco. It was built to haul cotton grown in the Brazos bottoms.  It was built with British money by British investors.

Gary

I love it!!  It looks like part of a cover from "Texas Monthly" that was a modification of the Full Metal Jacket movie logo.  Would be perfect aircraft or vehicle marking!

Oh like it!

Still like your 'low-viz' 'stars and bars' better though. Took me a minute to figure out what they were and then 'duh' gave way to 'wow, neat idea'!

Here it is.  What do ya'll think?

I can imagine the CSA developing some industrial base, after all, it is a region with lot's of resources.  I think the short-sightedness of the South's insistence on clinging to "King Cotton" would've become quite apparent , and I'm sure it did in the actual course of the Civil War. 

My "what if" Confederacy finds its needs met by imported warplanes for the most part (of course, this makes modeling those fictional planes easier as we don't have to invent a wholly new type)  Viggens and Gripens would be an awesome choice for either entity, CSA or ROT! 

 I have a pic saved of my projected ROT roundel on my home pc.  I'll download it when I get home from work.  It's more of colorful design, circa 30s or 40s rather than the more modern "low viz" markings on my F-1.  I'm thinking it would sure look cool on a Hurricane or Spit, maybe even a classic inter-war era biplane like a Hawker Fury or Fiat Cr.32?  Let's work on this idea of a "what if" GB.  I think there are lot's of great ideas floating around.

Gary

Doogs: Good point, I forgot about the Wright brothers being from Ohio, that could really change the invention of the airplane.

Vance: Cool, count me in! When the gentleman posted a 'what if' Mexican AF F-117 some months back there was some discussion of a 'WTF' GB which I was disappointed never went though. I'm on board for this. May not be CSS but I'll have something. 

Also been thinking that beyond the British and Frence the Swedes have a thriving avation industry. A CAF or ROTAF Viggen or Gripen would be pretty cool too.

Hans von Hammer

I reckon that during the Second War though, we'da got aircraft on Lend-Lease from the North, since we likely threw in wit' them Yankees... Heck, I figger the Yanks woulda lost the Second War without allies like England and Texas...

DoogsATX

Pretty cool scenario and alt-history scheme there! 

One thing though - and if you've read the Turtledove novels this'll already be apparent - but it's extremely likely that an independent CSA would have led to continuing war in America, and various overseas alliances (I really liked Turtledove's idea of the CSA with the Brits and French, and USA with Germany). 

In that case, I think it's very likely the CSA would've developed at least some industrial capacity. Maybe not on par with the Yanks, but it'd be there. I mean...even the Italians had a decent aviation industry in WWII.

Now...I could totally see the CSA being a junior partner to France and the UK, and thus buying a lot of their stuff the way most of NATO flies F-16s or F/A-18s today, so a CSA Mirage or Tornado wouldn't be out of the question at all.

Of course, with a divided country, who's to say how aviation would have unfolded in the first place. The Wright Brothers were from Ohio, but the first flight took place in North Carolina...across what would have been a border. 

Well, sure. I agree that the Turtledove scenario was good.  I read the entire series.  However, we can make our own scenario.  A reasonable back story would work.  Ever read The Ayes of Texas?  Texas suceeds from the Union because we don't want a Soviet fleet to visit Houston.  Its a very fun read in that it involes a high tech rebuild of the U.S.S. Texas.  Alternate history can be anything (almost) we want.

Opps.  Stated the obvious again.  Sorry.

Pretty cool scenario and alt-history scheme there! 

One thing though - and if you've read the Turtledove novels this'll already be apparent - but it's extremely likely that an independent CSA would have led to continuing war in America, and various overseas alliances (I really liked Turtledove's idea of the CSA with the Brits and French, and USA with Germany). 

In that case, I think it's very likely the CSA would've developed at least some industrial capacity. Maybe not on par with the Yanks, but it'd be there. I mean...even the Italians had a decent aviation industry in WWII.

Now...I could totally see the CSA being a junior partner to France and the UK, and thus buying a lot of their stuff the way most of NATO flies F-16s or F/A-18s today, so a CSA Mirage or Tornado wouldn't be out of the question at all.

Of course, with a divided country, who's to say how aviation would have unfolded in the first place. The Wright Brothers were from Ohio, but the first flight took place in North Carolina...across what would have been a border. 

Very nicely done! I've got a what-if in mind for later this year, assuming I get my GB commitments caught up.

Hans von Hammer

Yeah, the Republic of Texas insignia will be tough.. Them Yankees stole th' "Lone Star" way back...

Not necessarily.  U.S. planes used a roundal during The Great War.  The story line could have Texas using a "lone" white star and the U.S. using something else like and eage with arrows grasped in its claws.  The Harry Turtledove series had Federal insignia with an eagle holding a saber.

I'll definitely do a Republic of Texas armored vehicle in the near future.

Yeah, the Republic of Texas insignia will be tough.. Them Yankees stole th' "Lone Star" way back...

Hans von Hammer

I reckon that during the Second War though, we'da got aircraft on Lend-Lease from the North, since we likely threw in wit' them Yankees... Heck, I figger the Yanks woulda lost the Second War without allies like England and Texas...

I agree Hans.  I believe the CSA would've joined the Allies too, and prolly the Republic of Texas as well.  Those roots run deep ya know...Man, I gotta start working on a Repub. o' Texas 'plane soon.  I have a 1/48 Monogram F-4C Phantom(w/ PE parts) in the stash.  Hmmm,  surplussed from the USAF, sold to the ROT.  I have an idea already for the roundels.  "Don't Mess With Texas" indeed.

Gary

Hans von Hammer

I reckon that during the Second War though, we'da got aircraft on Lend-Lease from the North, since we likely threw in wit' them Yankees... Heck, I figger the Yanks woulda lost the Second War without allies like England and Texas...

Don't forget the Irish.

I reckon that during the Second War though, we'da got aircraft on Lend-Lease from the North, since we likely threw in wit' them Yankees... Heck, I figger the Yanks woulda lost the Second War without allies like England and Texas...

troublemaker66

You Southern Boys` just can`t let it go...can ya ?  

Watch yer mouth, Blue-belly... THIS Grey-back ain't  "Southern", I'm  Texan...

MAJ Mike

As I recall, LTV (Ling Tempco Vaught) had a plant in the Dallas area in the 1960's.  I think they built the Navy's Corsair II.

Well they did build the F4u1 Corsair and the A-7 Corsair II as the F4u1 was a Vaught product in the 1940's.

Gamera

Gary:

I like the idea of a CSN Harrier, that would be a cool looking a/c indeed.

And though I'm assuming it doesn't track with your 'what if' scenerio I've been thinking what if several of the more powerful plains Indian tribes had took advantage of the chaos to form their own nation somewhere in the southwest? An Indian Federation 'Crazy Horse Squadron' F-5 would be cool...

  I like that!  No doubt, the Federation would want some Apache gunships too.  Oh the possibilities really are only limited by one's imagination...

Gary:

I like the idea of a CSN Harrier, that would be a cool looking a/c indeed.

And though I'm assuming it doesn't track with your 'what if' scenerio I've been thinking what if several of the more powerful plains Indian tribes had took advantage of the chaos to form their own nation somewhere in the southwest? An Indian Federation 'Crazy Horse Squadron' F-5 would be cool...

Vit13

Bonjour Gary ,

Very funny to see a Mirage F-1 in these colours.

Your "what-if" model is very good.

 Merci beaucoup monsieur!

Gary

Bonjour Gary ,

Very funny to see a Mirage F-1 in these colours.

Your "what-if" model is very good.

Thanks for the kind words!  The plane was finished for several weeks while I waited for the wind to stop blowing so hard around here.  No kidding, I tried last week but the Mirage was just too light.   I was afraid that a gust would send it flying so I went home.  Sunday, out of desperation really, lol, I parked my Isuzu Trooper as a wind break and set up the photo table beside it.  There was only one close call with the wind.

I guess I might flesh out my what if scenario a bit.  A negotiated cease-fire, and subsequent, somewhat uneasy peace, left the United States and the Confederacy sharing what had been the USA.  A continuing reliance on agriculture still retarded economic growth and manufacturing technology in the CSA.  Faced with a long coastline to defend, the Confederacy, with its new capital in Atlanta, turned wary eyes seaward and made maritime vigilance both a priority and a tradition.

Texas seceded from the Confederacy in the early 20th century over economic issues and concerns about the intrusive reach of the Confederate government.  I'm still working out how this event plays out geographically, with current possibilities including Texas "annexation" of Oklahoma and possibly a Republic of Texas reach for Pacific ports (and all that that might entail).

Confederate forces have been involved in several incidences in the recent past.  These would include clashes with Venezuela and Cuba in the Gulf and Caribbean as well as joint missions conducted with Republic of Texas forces against insurgents/narco-terrorists in Mexico.  The Maritime Air Stations share defense of the coast and other airbases throughout the interior of the South maintain bomber and interceptor squadrons.  The choice of the Mirage F-1 for the role shown here was based on economy, simplicity and of course availability.   France had been a supporter of the Confederacy from its beginning and provided various models for purchase by the CSA.  The United Kingdom is the other major aircraft supplier for Confederate needs, having sold Hawker Hunters to the South as their first high-performance jet fighter.

It's fun to play these "what if" games with history.  I've found that concocting these silly scenarios does really open up the creativity for me.  I like to build one of these fictional planes from time to time and I hope these pics, and story might persuade someone else to do one too.

Gary

That is probably the most thought out and creative "what-if" build I have ever seen! I love it! I think your Confederate what-if scenario would be an awesome group build, but it would have to wait a while before I could do it. Hope to see more builds like this!

troublemaker66

You Southern Boys` just can`t let it go...can ya ?  

Yeah, we in Texas missed our chance in 1991.  Ft. Hood was a ghost town with all III Corps deployed to the sandbox.  Ft. Bliss had deployed the 3rd ACR and all their MLRS and Patriot batteries -- the Luftwaffe AAA school wouldn't have been a problem and that Bundeswher Leopard battalion would've only added to our inventory of weapons..  Ft. Sam Houston was just docs and MP's.  We could'a taken over while all the Yankee Occupation forces were in Saudi.

(sigh) Timing is everything.