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HK Models 1/32 Avro Lancaster Dambuster build

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  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Northern California
Posted by jeaton01 on Wednesday, September 18, 2019 11:51 PM

Very well done!  Nice details on the turrets, and the markings look great.

John

To see build logs of my models, go here: http://goldeneramodel.com/mymodels/mymodels.htm

  

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Wednesday, September 18, 2019 3:34 AM

TREYZX10R

Top shelf build for sure! Very nicely done Sir!

 

Thanks very much. Trey. At least someone appreciates the build And result!

  • Member since
    August 2009
  • From: Borlando Fla home of the rat
Posted by TREYZX10R on Monday, September 16, 2019 5:51 PM

Top shelf build for sure! Very nicely done Sir!

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Monday, September 16, 2019 7:12 AM

Here we go.

A mammoth build and the last few days have been remasking and painting and finishing off things plus pinching from the other Lancaster kit!









A leisurely lunch at our friends' Italian restaurant. He kindly let us use a table for 2 to display the Lancaster. It received plenty of attention from diners and even had all the kitchen staff coming out to have a look!

The build was no problem, although I would put the wings together a little differently and spend more time actually dry fitting. What took the time was the paint job, as you all know.

Top notch never did come through with the stencil serial numbers mask so I went in the end with some slightly modified custom masks from Maketar that I had ordered as a back up.

I do hope that you all have enjoyed following this and have had the opportunity to learn something new, maybe!

James

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Thursday, September 5, 2019 4:39 AM

No problems.

This, in fact, was the very first time I have done roundels etc with masks and so there has been much planning and thought on just how to tackle this.

I did a similar thing on both ZM Shinden and Nick builds and find that if done slowly and carefully the result looks just like the real thing.

with the Lancaster, some of the decals are so big that using them are going to cause issues and so painting them became a need.

the stencil lines are also included as decals but it is just as easy to measure them and then mask and paint them on!

my rules,

1. Know what the end result is going to look like.

2. Are there any sharp or raised surfaces that vinyl isn't going to flex in to or over?

3. Measure decals and mask whatever you can do first.

4. Remember to cover surfaces to catch overspray.

5. When ordering masks or masking sets, custom stuff etc, order more than you intend on using!

6. NEVER reuse a mask. It will have been pulled out of shape or be really stiff with paint. See 5.

7. Work to a plan that has added flexibility and be able to think on your feet during painting.

8. When placing masks, use thin tape to mark out the position of where the mask sits. This then provides the accuracy when using multiple masks to create outlines etc.

9. Be flexible enough to mix vinyl and Kabuki tape masks on the same area if needed.

10. Be prepared to alter masks to fit if needed Or not to overlap adjoining mask areas to be painted.

11. Never rush. Work slowly and take frequent breaks.

12. Clean airbrush BEFORE removing masks. This gives the paint a little chance to settle. Always leave alignment tape etc in place if possible Until finished.

13. Multiple colour insignia takes much longer. Allow 24 hours for each colour to cure fully before covering etc. Nobody said that this was a quick process!

14. Confidence in techniques is everything. Get lots of masks and practice first on something that doesn't matter.

15. Have a container with a vast amount of different masking tape sizes. You will get through a lot of the stuff, but the end result is just great!

  • Member since
    August 2009
  • From: Borlando Fla home of the rat
Posted by TREYZX10R on Tuesday, September 3, 2019 9:36 PM

James thank You so much for taking the time to post up the tips, I'm so saving this for future reference!

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Tuesday, September 3, 2019 4:16 AM

You will get through a lot of masking tape so make sure to have plenty in!

one of the things you need to consider is just what you want to do, and then figure out how to do it.

start with a really simple line. Take a plastic spoon and put some 1mm tape across it. Then put on rather side some wider tape to catch overspray and then remove the 1mm tape and that is your very first really simple mask. Spray some paint to get your line, clean the airbrush and remove the tape. Instant line, no decals!

vinyl masks are good but are not flexible enough to get into corners for raised or inset detail. Kabuki tape has as I have shown on this thread.

However, Kabuki tape goes stiff once painted and is best as a one use mask, so if using Kabuki tape, always order more masks than you need. They store for much longer than vinyl and are not prone to heat and other factors that vinyl is.

Vinyl masks are best used almost at once. They are prone to temperature changes etc. Which causes shrinkage and other issues which I did have to cope with during the wing roundel painting.

Maketar gives you a choice for both mask sets and custom stuff with Vinyl and Kabuki paper. Although slightly more expensive I will go with Kabuki as my first choice as it is the more flexible of the two.

on this build I have used masks from Top Notch (vinyl, no other option) for the camo. I did have issues, but Top notch helped me work it out. The Lancaster set is a generic 1/72, 1/48, 1/32 set and I ended up using kabuki tape to finish off before painting.

DN Models' sets for canopy masking and marking sets (vinyl, no choice). I had issue with shrinkage or a bad cut that left gaps in the wing and fuselage roundels along with vinyls' inability to flex to get into and around the sharp corners of the raised plate on the fuselage caused bleeds and overspray.

custom Masks from Maketar were ordered for the squadron codes and fuselage roundels to redo them to correct the bleeds etc. In Kabuki tape. Thanks to an issue with Alclad clear flat one wing roundel and tail fin markings will have to be done again. Maketar doesn't have the correct size tail fin marking, so I will order another marking set from DN Models and I will be able to correct some slight wonkyness of the tail fins!

This is probably the longest way round. Decals are easier but I never really mastered the process and always for some reason have issues with clear coats so painting is better for me!

Always think this through. Always plan and add flexibility to the plan and get more stuff than you actually need. For the squadron codes, AJG I ordered 6 of each! I will probably use them in various ways!

 

James

  • Member since
    August 2009
  • From: Borlando Fla home of the rat
Posted by TREYZX10R on Monday, September 2, 2019 7:42 PM

That looks really awesome, well worth it from the results you got. I've been reluctant to do the mask and paint instead of decals but this is really making it hard to not try it!

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Monday, September 2, 2019 6:15 AM

Here is another update.

Using Maketar Kabuki Masks the roundel and squadron codes are done. There is some tidying up work to be done and I am just waiting for the aircraft serial number to arrive from Top Notch! :pray:

In picture form this is how it's been done!

While waiting for the white to dry and cure, I did the stencil lines un the underside of the tail planes

I had an issue with the mask(s) on the port side. the outside mask was placed slightly out and so I had to improvise with the masks as they no longer fitted exactly into the circle.

but you can't tell!

You can see from the letter positioning that the exterior mask of the roundel is a bit out of place! Something to note for next time!

Just to make sure that the bottom of the letters are the same depth below the raised plate, a base line is needed.

You get through lots of masking tape with this method and it is probably slower because you have to let colours cure and dry properly before continuing, but the end result is worth it in my opinion. You also spend extra money on masks (always order MORE than you need just in case...).

Sometimes with a kit, decals just or won't do it justice, or you are going to have issues with the physical size or the place where they are going to go and this is where masks come in to play. think about where the insignia is going to go and the surface. If there are lots of ridges or sharp corners then vinyl won't get in there as it is less flexible than yellow Kabuki tape. be inventive and think outside the box.

I have contacted HGW to see if they can do wet transfers for the stencil text rather than me using the decals. once those are on they will look painted on too!

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Northern California
Posted by jeaton01 on Friday, August 30, 2019 10:05 PM

Odd about the Alclad II flat doing that.  I have had excellent luck with it.  I do shake the bottle severely before use.

John

To see build logs of my models, go here: http://goldeneramodel.com/mymodels/mymodels.htm

  

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Friday, August 30, 2019 5:58 PM

The wings are designed to be removeable. this greatly helps with storage options. I am going to have a go at building a storage box soon!

I am also planning a large display cabinet which should, I hope be able to show off many large aircraft etc!

  • Member since
    June 2014
  • From: New Braunfels , Texas
Posted by Tanker - Builder on Friday, August 30, 2019 12:17 PM

Yikes !!

    Have you built a room addition for this BIG Bird ? LOL.LOL. Looking Good My Friend ! T.B.

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: SW Virginia
Posted by Gamera on Friday, August 30, 2019 10:45 AM

Lol, I normally stick in one of my collection of terrible movies while modeling. Don't laugh but somehow 'Robot Monster' motivates me! 

Or used to anyhow, things have been so crazy lately I haven't gotten much done. Hopefully; it will straighten out before too long. 

"I dream in fire but work in clay." -Arthur Machen

 

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Friday, August 30, 2019 4:21 AM

Don't invest, YouTube, Alexa etc.

Alexa, play Mozart Magic Flute Overture. Then get cracking with some spoons, tape and airbrush!

just play about like that with the music in the background and see what happens!

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: SW Virginia
Posted by Gamera on Thursday, August 29, 2019 11:20 AM

That looks great! Guess I need to invest in some Mozart! Yes

"I dream in fire but work in clay." -Arthur Machen

 

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Thursday, August 29, 2019 6:36 AM

Right.... Here we go.

First off there has been an accident!

During painting, the fuselage slipped and the bottle of MRP's Marking Red went flying. Fortunately not over the model, but me and the floor. I managed to save just enough to finish what I was doing, and other bottle has been ordered today.

Also, to try and knock back the shine from the MRP paints I sprayed one of the wing roundels with a recommended flat, from Alclad. This is the result:

Clearly seen white bloom. NOT what I want. so I shall order some more masks. I will have to repaint the tail fins too! I just wanted to knock the shine back, not make it look faded! I will have to live with the shine from the paint, or ask MRP to make a totally flat version!

The break in the weather allowed me to do some work and I cracked on with the squadron codes. Here is an instructional on how I did it for those thinking about painting on what would normally be on the decal sheets.

Using period photos and the kit instructions I first place the actual letter(s) with their spacing from the masking sheets. These are from Maketar and are custom done from their website in Kabuki paper. My first attempt with the roundel didn't go so well as vinyl is not flexible enough  for sharp corners, but Kabuki tape is...

I place the actual letters according to period photos of this aircraft and the kit instructions

These are separately printed and so the outline mask will be altered spacing wise.

You can see that the Kabuki tape fits over the bomb bay strengthening plate with no issues as it is more flexible than the vinyl so there will be no bleeds.

The actual mask is then placed using the letter with cuts around the trailing edge to fit the mask.

The letter is then removed and placed back onto the sheet for re-use if needed later.


Now, my new camera has arrived, so back to a quality camera with proper lenses although I have a new learning curve to master!

Maketar custom masks come as individual letters etc and so with the squadron code placed with proper spacing you have to be creative with the outline mask... and careful so a brand new SHARP blade is needed.

 

remove the letters and put back on the sheet for re-use for touching up the black.

catching overspray. can never be too careful!

MRP RAF Marking Red applied to full depth

Same on the other side!

remove the mask... this is why you keep the letter, you can see overspray which is why you should never re-use tape!

Some scratches to be fixed from removing the tape. letter masks to be re-used.

As you can see, the Kabuki Tape fitted into the edges and prevented bleed from the paint. the edges of the letters are sharp!

Lesson:

Vinyl is fine on totally flat surfaces and gentle curves etc. When it comes to ridges etc, Kabuki gets in there! Never be afraid to mix and match!

Next time the fuselage roundel is redone!!!

For Gamera,

It takes time to do this and some close up accurate work, so just put some Mozart on as it will help you to concentrate. The results speak for themselves!

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Friday, August 23, 2019 4:36 AM

Gamera

That looks sooooooo neat! 

Guess I need to try painting insignia etc some day. Only thing is decals normally aren't a problem for me but masking gives me fits. 

 

 

Thanks, Gamera. It is just practice and determination. You can't make these slide around until the position is right so I start off using kit landmarks, panel lines, rivet lines etc. Also period photographs etc which helps with locating etc. Also in this case MAP painting orders which gives size and location measurements.

It can take time to position so put some Mozart on and dig in! I think that the results are great!

  • Member since
    March 2015
Posted by JohnnyK on Thursday, August 22, 2019 3:06 PM

Nice! Nice! Nice! I love big bombers.

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: SW Virginia
Posted by Gamera on Thursday, August 22, 2019 11:44 AM

That looks sooooooo neat! 

Guess I need to try painting insignia etc some day. Only thing is decals normally aren't a problem for me but masking gives me fits. 

"I dream in fire but work in clay." -Arthur Machen

 

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Thursday, August 22, 2019 10:40 AM

Not being happy with the way the vinyl roundels went on the fuselage side, I have ordered custom ones from Maketar Masks in Slovenia along with squadron and aicraft codes as the Kabuki tape will be more flexible than the vinyl ones are and should stick properly into the tight corners with a little help from a cocktail stick.

I will paint over the roundels as I have ordered the closest size to the actual 54 inch roundel and 48 inch squadron codes that were used (to scale, of course) I think that there is 0.1-0.2mm difference and I don't know just how much there is between the ones coming and DN Models' set so it makes sense to start again!

Also, Kabuki tape is less vunerable to being stretched out of shape too.

I hope Top Notch's masks get her soon!

James

  • Member since
    February 2012
  • From: Olmsted Township, Ohio
Posted by lawdog114 on Wednesday, August 21, 2019 4:14 AM
Coming along nicely. I paint on just about all of my markings as well. It’s so much more realistic than decals.

 "Can you fly this plane and land it?...Surely you can't be serious....I am serious, and don't call me Shirley"

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Wednesday, August 21, 2019 4:02 AM

Thanks Trey.

I don't think that doing the masking and painting process is tedious at all.

It is just a case of having space, plenty of different sizes of tape to hand and either a movie or some uplifting music on.

There is extra cost involved doing it this way but I have always had issues with getting decals to actually lay down and to look as if they have been painted on.

looking at this and other big kits and the size of the decals then painting is the better way, especially with the huge wing roundels.

In reality it is the placement of the templates that take the time, the filling in to catch overspray, not as much!

All the painting has been done with Vallejo apart from the insignia and underside stencil lines. These are MRP (Mr. Paint) from Slovakia and are, Marking Red, Marking Yellow and BS 105 Oxford Blue. Their Marking Blue is not the correct shade.

The only decals will be the stencil text. It is too small to have stencils actually made.

Every model should challenge us in some way and with this it was always going to be the upper surface painting.

Generic 1/32 camo masks from Top Notch were used and modified to fit the lower demarcation line used on these Lancasters and matched to blueprint and MAP camo drawings and painting orders As well as photos of the recent repainted of the BBMF Lancaster.

Extra work and all that, but with these projects and the fame that the aircraft has then you just have to go that extra mile!

  • Member since
    August 2009
  • From: Borlando Fla home of the rat
Posted by TREYZX10R on Tuesday, August 20, 2019 7:34 PM

The tedious task of masking has really paid off , that looks a lot better than decals! The Blue looks ok to me but RAF colors are a bit out of my wheel house. Given that computer screens and cameras can change the actual hue of the colors its subjective anyway, if you are happy with , roll with it I say. The build is looking great, eagerly awaiting the next update, cheers Trey

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Tuesday, August 20, 2019 10:15 AM

Thanks for the comments guys.

Sometimes vinyl masks cause more work and that is because they don't have the flexibility that is actually claimed. I am going to have to have some Kabuki tape masks made for the fuselage as the vinyl ones just can't flex and fit into tight angles as Kabuki can. Also Vinyl is easily stretched out of shape and be affected by humidity and temperature change.

I have been working on insignia. The inability of the Vinyl masks to flex into corners and stick has caused overspray etc. Some work has to be redone and remedial painting to fix overspray.

On this photo you can see that because of the vinyl's inability to go into corners and stick it has let bleeds and demarcation lines not as sharp over the bracing piece. This will have to wait to be fixed until I can get Masks from Maketar made. I will also get some RAF squadron codes done in Kabuki as the Top Notch ones when they come will be Vinyl and will have the same problem!

Again, there is some overspray caused by the vinyl. I did try and mask around all the aileron mounts but the paint found a way through!

There you go. Once the painting is corrected and done then I think it actually looks better than the decals!

I would like to know what you think to the blue I have used

  • Member since
    August 2009
  • From: Borlando Fla home of the rat
Posted by TREYZX10R on Saturday, August 17, 2019 8:11 PM

Looking awesome! You might need to push 2 tables together for this build when its done!

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Saturday, August 17, 2019 4:16 PM

I usually take my finished builds up to a friends restaurant and put it on our table while we eat. They are usually a draw to all the boys and men there and I told our friend that we will be up after their holiday and with this thing... and I will need a bigger table!

He's seriously worried as I told him that it is bigger than the 1/16 Jagdtiger I took up which impressed everyone with it's paint job and full interior!

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: USA
Posted by keavdog on Saturday, August 17, 2019 3:37 PM

Nice!  Cant get over the size of that kit.

Thanks,

John

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Saturday, August 17, 2019 2:37 PM

Sean, the owner of Top Notch helpen me alot over a phone call and I was able to sort out the wing etc.

These masks are generic and are just a guide and so referencing the MAP and blueprints along with a couple of photos I was able to sort everything out and adding some making tape to fill in the blanks... so to speak I am happy with the upper surface camo scheme!

DN models' masking set arrived today and so I was able to get further along.

I am still trying to nail down the blue for the insignia. I may just go with the BS 381c 105 Oxford Blue and have done with it!


Some of the stencilling will have to be masked over so I can re-paint the black!

Just need Top Notch to come up with the codes and serial number for Gibsons aircraft.

I think that I might rob parts from the other lancaster box and replace when the parts arrive from China!

 

Comment and questions welcomed

 

 

James

  • Member since
    November 2004
Posted by snapdragonxxx on Tuesday, August 13, 2019 4:44 PM

Here's an update.


I have been preparing for a lot of masking and painting and the base painting is done and will probably have to be patched at a later date!!!

Top Notch 1/32 camo masks have arrived and I have spent the last 2 days applying them carefully referencing both blueprint, MAP paint orders and contemporary photos for the fuselage demarkation line.


I have sent an email with these photos with some questions...


Now unless I have got the placement horribly wrong then it is me, otherwise there's some fixing to be done!

Either way.. this has messed up some major progress. I have DN models's insignia set etc coming!

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