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The group build to end all group builds - THE GREAT WAR

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  • Member since
    February 2010
  • From: Berkeley CA/St. Paul MN
Posted by EBergerud on Wednesday, March 14, 2012 1:30 AM

You're sitting in the same position I was before I did an Academy Sopwith Camel last summer: fist biplane etc. (I've got the WingNut Pflaz III so I'll be watching how you handle things.) Just in case you've missed it, there is an incredible resource for bipes at http://www.ww1aircraftmodels.com/index.html . This site is a real labor of love and is run by an extraordinary Aussie modeler named Des Delatorre: it includes extremely detailed photo builds of perhaps 20 bipes along with tutorials on all kinds of subjects, including the WNW Pflaz VIII which is marred by that horrid late war German camo. Methinks you'll find that the rigging is actually quite manageable. And you'll find that the rigging does what it's supposed to do - it makes the kit stronger. I have heretical views on this subject. Depending upon what you're after, you might want to go scale plus on rigging. I did mine with very light mono (Des' weapon of choice, although fly tying thread is a good option.) What you'll find, however, is that unless someone is viewing from close range, the rigging becomes extremely indistinct - it would be invisible if you used some of the very fine thread favored by some folk. I might try 4lb mono on another Academy kit I have (want to warm up for the WGN): if that works, I'll use the same approach when rigging ships. I think this is a major matter because biplanes are terrific display items (as are elaborately rigged ships) - the Camel is always the plane people first notice even though it's far from my best work. Obviously stuff like position and lighting make a big difference. The real fun and games might be setting the wings. On my next bipe I'm going to employ my new best friend for ship PE - Aleene's Tacky Craft Glue. (Comes in super tacky and fast drying also: cheap and found in any craft store and probably most hardware stores.) As the name implies the stuff has astounding "grab" but will let you fiddle around for a while while you get things set. Wipe off the excess when things look good. Goes very nicely with a little dab of CA.

Eric

 

A model boat is much cheaper than a real one and won't sink with you in it.

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Wednesday, March 14, 2012 12:20 AM

Yeah John, I'm hoping Marc gets back into it as well. His builds IMO have to rank among the absolute best I've seen on this forum (or any other for that matter). Regardless of subject, his works are always top-notch - he has no 'comfort zone' - IOW, he can build anything and make it look great, a rare talent, and he'd be missed.

As for your well-earned badge, what I do is upload the image to a hosting site like photobucket and paste the image link into your profile.

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Piscataway,NJ
Posted by jtrace214 on Tuesday, March 13, 2012 10:37 PM

You don't think you'll get back into it?? I hope you do.. My Mk.IV was made by Ehmar in 1/35th scale,If you have anything I might like let me know before you e-bay it...Also how do I add the group badge?

 

John

 

the pic to the left is my weekend condo lol

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Tuesday, March 13, 2012 2:43 PM

Mike, sorry, can't explain that at allWhistling

 

John the work you put into that shows.  Sure don't need anything fork MCon.  Probably gonna be EBaying some kits that I know I will never build... even if I do start up again.  BTW, I added your model to the completed builds on my site..  What kit was that?

Marc  

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Piscataway,NJ
Posted by jtrace214 on Monday, March 12, 2012 9:42 PM

Thanks Marc,good to hear from you... I worked long and hard on that bugger a whole lotta putty,lol.... Gee, my first win and my first group build badge,I am honored.... Stay in touch,hope to see ya soon,I know your not building right now but let me know if you want anything from Mosquitocon.

John

the pic to the left is my weekend condo lol

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Monday, March 12, 2012 7:30 PM

Good to see ya Marc! (....and now please explain this image stuck in my head of Randy Quaid, an FA-18, and a big alien space ship !) Stick out tongue

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Monday, March 12, 2012 3:58 PM

Hello Boys, I 'm baaAaack!

 

Been 10 days thought it was time to check in.   Having a heck of a time kicking this modelling funk I am in.  Have not been away from the bench this long since getting back into the hobby in '05.

 

John... A HUGE congrats of the Empire Night win.  So now do you believe me when I tell you that you're a tread head?  And no worries about not knowing aboutthe GB.  I do beileve we talked about it before you finished that beast.So grab a badge.

Mike, well what can I say.  Too sweet looking>  That is gonna be the poo when it's done.

Ernest, no surprise you are ending up adding s0em scratched bit.  I had a feeling you might.

Marc  

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Monday, March 12, 2012 9:38 AM

John, that's a great-looking build ya have there! Thanks for sharing it with us! Yes

Ernest, I'm glad you decided to beef up the 'pit. It's gonna be a vast improvement over the kit parts. The trick to rigging these birds is to plan well ahead, making sure your attachment points are drilled and ready before final assembly, and knowing which rigging medium you plan on using. The fact that you chose a bipe as your first aircraft speaks volumes. If you can build and rig one of these puppies, anything else with wings should be a breeze. Wink

The gear struts are on the DR.1 - a lot easier than first anticipated. Eduard engineered this kit well. Even after I shortened them to lower the stance a bit, they still fit like a dream. The engine was painted with Alclad II dark aluminum and given a black pin wash to pop the detail. Grime was added with the help of Tamiya weathering powders. I am nearing the home stretch on this one. More pics soon.

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Piscataway,NJ
Posted by jtrace214 on Monday, March 12, 2012 6:58 AM

Thanks Buffle,its built oob (Ehmar) except for the anti ditching log..... Needed alot of putty on the sponsons but a good fun build..

John

the pic to the left is my weekend condo lol

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: San Francisco Bay Area
Posted by bufflehead on Monday, March 12, 2012 12:21 AM

Yeah jtrace!!  That's a nice Mark IV Male tank!!  Thanks for posting the pics!

Work has started on the Pfalz D.III.  The Glencoe kit is seriously underdetailed so, with Mike's encouragement, I've started detailing.   The cockpit. is up first and the only part provided is the seat, which I cleaned up, sanded down to fit better and thinned out to a more scale thickness.  I added some seatbelts made from wine bottle lead oil and buckles from an Aber PE set.  Probably not accurate but that's all I have to work with and I'm just trying to "suggest" some cockpit detail and accuracy.  Then using the Eduard Pfalz D.III kit as a guide I started scratchbuilding some of the pit using Evergreen stryrene sheet, strip and rod. 

This is all I've manage to do as most of today was spent researching and studying the two kits to determine a game plan.

I also added a brace (?) to both fuselage walls which I now can add some gauges and controls to!  I'll clean up the excess glue when its solidly dry tomorrow.

That's it.  More pics and updates in a couple of days.

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Piscataway,NJ
Posted by jtrace214 on Sunday, March 11, 2012 5:19 PM

URL=http://s479.photobucket.com/albums/rr153/jtrace/?action=view&current=GEDC0117.jpg][/URL]

I hope this works....

the pic to the left is my weekend condo lol

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: San Francisco Bay Area
Posted by bufflehead on Sunday, March 11, 2012 3:59 PM

Dang Mike, that's looking SO GOOD!!Surprise  That streak camo looks AMAZING!  So does the engine....you need to share how you painted it, it looks quite real!  One thing I've learned from this GB is how you guys go about building and painting these bi and triplanes.  Its interesting how you keep parts like the wings and tail assemblies separate and join them AFTER the painting is complete.  I don't know how you keep all the struts and supports aligned during this!!  Huh?  I guess I'll need to do the same thing with the Pfalz, but I'm eager to figure it all out!  The one thing I'm dreading is doing the rigging which I've never done before...ever!  But I'll give it my best shot! 

BTW, I've decided to do some detailing so I'm going to use the Eduard Pfalz as the basis for doing the Glencoe interior, plus the Wingnut Wings site that you so thoughtfully directed me to!  THANKS!!

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Sunday, March 11, 2012 1:12 PM

John, I think you should post some pics. We have a lot of tread heads in here, as well as guys who appreciate a great build. I say go for it.

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Piscataway,NJ
Posted by jtrace214 on Sunday, March 11, 2012 7:42 AM

Thanks Ruddratt,I'm not sure if I should post a pic. because I built it not knowing Marc was running this group build....

John

the pic to the left is my weekend condo lol

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Sunday, March 11, 2012 4:04 AM

OK guys, I know I've been a bit lax on posting pics, but believe me, I've been at this guy on a regular basis. Got all the markings on and most of the main sub-assemblies have been weathered as well. It'll be a short while before I hit the home stretch, though.

Tonight I was able to get some paint on the main gear and cabane struts and should be installing them soon. The gear struts will be tricky - small attachment points and each strut is an individual piece, so I'll be working with eight attachment points at once. Gotta say I'm dreading this step just a bit. Also started work on the Spandau guns. The Master PE/brass detail set for these guys is nothing short of amazing. I'm taking my time with these suckers.

Anyway, hope you enjoy the pics.

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Saturday, March 10, 2012 11:57 PM

Jack, great write-up on the streaked camo. Lots of good info in there that I was not aware of. Thanks for posting that!

John, congrats on the award! Yes A well-deserved win.

Ernest, thanks buddy! I am eagerly anticipating this build. From the looks of it, it's a perfect candidate for a little scratchbuilding on the interior. You should check out the Wingnut Wings site and look at some of the details of their Pfalz. Some great reference pics, as well as a good place to check out some of the interior detail they incorporated into their kit. Knowing your skill level, with a little styrene stock, you could bang out a serious 'pit for that bird. It'll also be a good test bed to try a few weathering and rigging techniques too.

As for my Fokker, all the markings are on and most of the sub-assemblies have been weathered. I should have a few more pics up tonight, as well as some progress on those neat little Spandau guns.

(...and it's nice to see this GB still goin' on!) Yes

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: San Francisco Bay Area
Posted by bufflehead on Saturday, March 10, 2012 10:58 PM

What the heck, I decided to take a pic of the parts......all 22 of them!!

This is DEFINITELY the least amount of kit parts I've ever encountered!  Don't know if that means a quck build or alot of scratchbuilding!!  The interior consists of the pilot's seat...that's it!  

So I'm not sure how to build this.  Since its my first AC, should I just build it OOB and concentrate on the painting and markings, waiting to build a better kit with the Eduard D.III I picked up last month?  Or do I try to make some improvements, with hardly any reference material to help?

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: San Francisco Bay Area
Posted by bufflehead on Saturday, March 10, 2012 9:41 PM

 OK, the Bronco A13 British tank is done so I'm back and ready to get crackin' on the Pfalz D.III!!  I'll start posting pics probably tomorrow, but first I spent a little time getting caught up on the GB happenings:

Mike - very nice work on the streaked camo!!  The oil paint seems to have provided the effect you've wanted and that's always a good thing!  And the interior is DA BOMB!!  Really, its excellent, I'm very impressed!  Also, thanks to you and Paul for the tip on the Ultracast Spandau MG sets!!  Those are very nice and I 'm going to have to get me set for the Fokker!!

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Piscataway,NJ
Posted by jtrace214 on Friday, March 9, 2012 11:15 PM

Hey Marc,I took first place tonight for "Empire Night" with my Mk.IV I was totally suprised when Martin called my name I won a $25 gift cert. for Avenel.I will post pics when I get a chance...

 

John

the pic to the left is my weekend condo lol

  • Member since
    April 2006
  • From: ON, Canada
Posted by jgeratic on Friday, March 2, 2012 11:12 AM

Mike - that streaking looks really good, nice technique there.

I'm no WW1 expert, but have spent more than a few nights reading some of the plethora of threads at the Aerodrome forum on Fokker streaking.  There is a lot written there, much discussion and sometimes very hotly debated opinions.

  Of what is certain is the streaking was applied by hand brush at the factory.  Some have suggested an 8 inch wide brush, but I forget how they came to this conclusion.  There is a photo from a factory of a worker with a number of fokker wings on a rack, drying perhaps.  There seems to be a conscious effort that the applied wing surface streaking was at an angle of about one to one and one half ribs apart.

What is hotly debated is the surface colour before applied streaking.  Most seem to be of the opinion it was either plain or treated canvas (but not coloured). 

The colour of the streaking is another proverbially can of worms.   There are three proposed methods I have read about. 
The simplest is the olive(?) was stroked on with a back and forth motion till the paint ran out, then the brush was reloaded and contined from the last applied stroke. 
Second method was to have three buckets of the same paint colour, but each one was thinned more than the previous. 
Thirdly, there was two or even three colours of paint used.

regards,

Jack

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: NYC, USA
Posted by waikong on Friday, March 2, 2012 8:25 AM

Mike, great looking streaking.  Thanks for your compliments - but here's what I didn't like about my streaking, the lines were too 'distinct' - a factor of my using acrylic paints throughout. Perhaps if I laid in an overall misting coat at the end.  I think your using oil definitely created a more 'blended' effect that I like a bit better.  I guess the real plane had the camo dyed on the linen before it was mounted on the plane? Or were they field applied with paint brushes? Perhaps someone who knows more about WW1 subjects than I knows the answer.

My website: http://waihobbies.wkhc.net

   

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Friday, March 2, 2012 4:33 AM

OK fellas, here's a few shots of the streak camo on my DR.I. Gotta say I'm pleased with how it turned out. The base coat was MM RLM65 with a coat of Future. I then layed in the random streaks of white, raw umber, and my OD (a mix of yellow ochre, black, and a little violet to cut the green a bit). Mixing each color with a little japan dryer really gave the oils a nice consistancy to work with, making the blending process a breeze as well as cutting the cure time to about a day and a half.

Waikong, I went back and took another look at your DR.I and man was I blown away. I think you did a super job on the streaked camo, and I agree with your statement 100% about the many ways this pattern can be interpreted based on period photos.

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: NYC, USA
Posted by waikong on Thursday, March 1, 2012 9:19 AM

ahhhh, no offense Marc, but PLEASE dont post pictures of your streaking...Surprise

My website: http://waihobbies.wkhc.net

   

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Wednesday, February 29, 2012 2:58 PM

waikong

Can't wait to see your streaking. 

I was streaking at Ohio State in 1973Embarrassed  I am glad you are referring to Mike's plane.Stick out tongue

Marc  

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: NYC, USA
Posted by waikong on Wednesday, February 29, 2012 10:02 AM

Can't wait to see your streaking.  I had to redo mine a few times and at the end still wasn't completely happy with the effect. One problem is the availability of only B/W pictures to go by, it's difficult to tell what it really looked like. As different color profiles looks different depending on the aritist.

My website: http://waihobbies.wkhc.net

   

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Wednesday, February 29, 2012 9:22 AM

No worries Marc. I'm still having a blast here. Between my work schedule lately and spending time with the wife, I haven't had much much time to post further pics on the DR.I, but I was able to finish all the streak camo on the wings and fuselage sunday afternoon - very happy with how it turned out. I'm anticipating another session at the bench thursday evening and hopefully I can get some pics up then. Yes

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Wednesday, February 29, 2012 7:39 AM

Looking forward to seeing some more progress Mike.  Always love your builds.  I know it tough when it looks like there isn't anyone watching... but we are here.  Even with my self imposed moratorium I am lurking and will never be completely gone

Marc  

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Friday, February 24, 2012 7:28 PM

Got a swack of painting done on the DR.I today with all 4 main colors being applied (OD, white, Nato Black, and RLM 65 for the light blue). A while back I'd mistakenly purchased some Tamiya enamel thinner instead of the acrylic stuff, but today I found out that it thins MM enamels beautifully. The OD and the RLM 65, both MM enamels, went on without a hitch. Got to let it all cure up overnight for tomorrow night's session, which will be a generous gloss coat followed by the streaked camo on the wings and fuselage. I'll definitely be posting some pics (it's looking pretty good so far).

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Wednesday, February 22, 2012 8:04 PM

Fun, definitely (they're a blast!!), but easier, that's where I may tend to differ. In fact, one of the main reasons I build them almost exclusively is because of the lack of a challenge (for me) with the single wing stuff (which is what I'll build when I need something less demanding). For example, getting the proper dihedral on one wing can be tricky, but two or three? The struts sometimes need modification as well in regards to their length, and then you're talking about nailing the fit of an upper wing that can have as many as 12 attachment points (and I ain't even got to the rigging yet). They're beautiful aircraft (as much so as their single wing counterparts), so my belief in the fact that so few show up on model forums has more to do with the degree of difficulty and less with aesthetics.

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    April 2008
  • From: Philadelphia PA
Posted by smeagol the vile on Wednesday, February 22, 2012 5:01 AM

I always wanted to try my hand at Bi-planes.  I'm rubbish at normal planes but bi/tri-planes look fun and a bit simpler... to bad my first experience with them was a horrible one.  Its a shame to, I do like painting the cockpits

 

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