Revell Yacht America

Markus- the photo you posted most recently is a problem for a subject as a model. See where the rake of the masts have been eliminated.

As I mentioned earlier though, my BJ plans have neither sections nor lines, so building a model from those would not work. They were afler all part of a kit.

Gentlemen,

thanks a lot for your answers... and sorry for kind of hijacking your thread. Your build is so inspiring.

concerning Mr. Campbell: he is getting more and more interesting. Thanks for your hints and explainations. Here - as everywherer else in this world - it is of great help to have a more precise picture of the facts. I love to dive into such details - even if the are of indirect connection to the ships themself.

GM you are absolutly right. The ship in 1887 will be quite a challange. Looking at the longer stern I fear it will be very tricky to try to change the Revell plastic hull in a way to hide the seam... But with the information in the beautiful book (rhe low black schooner) I now found, it seems the change in length was done with chages of bow and stern only, so her lines did maybe not change too much. But since the additional length in deck added 1875 by McKay (ups - here comes history again - the famous successful creator of world class clippers!) was about 12 foot (which would - compared with the measurement of my compare-man on deck of the photo - result in about 1,8 m... quite possible... and then there is also the inaccurancy of my "measurement") I think a reconstruction of her in this stage should be possible..

She also got a new keel so she could have ballast lower down to allow the more sails we see.. The details? Unknown.

I am again thinking about trying to learn how to reconstruct a ship with the help of CAD tools.. I believe this ship, together with those excellent photos could be a good starting point. I will try to get the BJ plans .. got answer by them already. Oh I am looking forward to get them.

The lines of the hull I would be able to get via Revells hull. Here in my hometown is a company which offers a 3D laserscan service. O.k. that is a strange basis for "real" reconstruction, but as a starter At least above the waterline a reconstruction seems thinkable.

At the other side: the ships most famous time of course is the time of THE race - and its very special design in this time... while her 1887 times she was not the same ship any more ... becoming more a "toy" of a rich guy, who used her in a very special way ... Again on the other side: HE took care of her.

GM, I love what you do with the model!

I just placed an order tonight with Syren for the line I will need. I am laying out he BJ blocks and deadeyes for painting. There will be some progress this wekend,

GM - the wood decking you did really makes this model 'pop'. You mentioned the wood strips used came from Blue Jacket. Do remember what dimensions the strips were? Your attention to details on this kit are very well done! Thanks for sharing this post to me. ;)

GM said:

"There will be some progress this wekend,"

That was some time ago - I wonder, GM, how things have progressed since then?

Way off topic :

Looking back in this thread to some very interesting commentary by professor Tilley I noticed the use of the phrase "under weigh" (See page 4 of this thread for the full discourse). The specific paragraph is:

"The second shot is even more interesting. The ship seems to be in the process of getting under weigh*.The photo clearly shows the configuration of the sails when they're being unfurled. (Or maybe I've got it backwards; maybe the ship is coming to anchor, and the sails are being furled.)"

*Note: My Italics, underscoring, and bold lettering. 1943Mike

That got me wondering about its meaning and whether or not the raising up of an anchor is associated with the phrase. At any rate, since I've nothing much to do until I head to the gym in a short time, I made some cursory explorations into the terminology. Here's what I found:

http://www.grammarphobia.com/blog/2015/12/under-weigh.html

1943mike - Great post! As a longtime admirer of the OED, I'll yield to its expertise and quit typing "under weigh."

John, I hope you know that what I wrote was strickly an etymological discursion and nothing more. As far as I'm concerned the phrases in question are now considered - by lexographers - as variants in spelling and you should go on writing whichever form seems apropos at that moment.

I've always enjoyed your comments and erudition on things nautical and on the craft of model making and I know that this site would be so much poorer without your knowledgable, helpful voice. It's your wealth of information on the subjects about which many of us are interested and your ability to write clearly on them that I for one (of many I'm sure) am profoundly grateful.

Mr. Morrison,

I’m about to start  the Revell America— any chance you can fix some of those broken photobucket links in this thread?  (I know what a PITA this is— I had to fix a bunch of links in my build threads over in the scale boats forum on regroups.com....)

-Bill

Sure, I'd be happy to.

Shave stanchions from inside of bulwarks. They are too few and too flat.

Sand down grain and copper detail on hull.

Remove deck furniture for planking.

This is a little hard to explain. Pair of strips in the bilge are to step the masts. It doesn't set fore-aft but it sets side-to-side.

Also removed ledge cast for deck so it can be lowered a little on new supports, to allow for wood thickness.

Glue curved pieces on underside of deck to give it some camber.

New waterways around edge of installed deck. New stanchions. rough copings for deck houses, which will overlap. Mark locations of deck plank ends, which match frames, and stanchions. Start to lay deck, working back from grub beam at deck break. Base for skylight. New grating in bottom of cockpit.

Make cap rails by rubbing pattern on trace, which I use to cut curved pieces out of thin wood panel.

Bowsprit.

And copper.

Last of all, a new skylight.

And masts.

Now I'm motivated to finish!

Thanks for sharing these pics!

Did I understand correctly that you used gold leaf on the raised detail?  That sounds like a great idea— Any tips on doing that?

-Bill

Also, you mentioned way back at the start that you didn’t use the soft sails from your old edition of the kit.  Do you still have them?  If yes, would you be interested in selling them? (I’d use them on another RC conversion build.....)

Hi Bill,

I think the sails are history at this point, but I'll look around.

The gold leaf was roundly critiqued by Tilley, and it was so-so.

I am pretty familiar with it. Blick sells a kit, it's not gold. I happen to have a supply of real leaf. You apply size, which is like white glue, with a brush wherever you want leaf to be.

Then you apply little pieces of leaf on the end of a Q tip or such. When it's all dry, brush it and the non-adhered parts come off.

Bill

So GM, can we expect more WIP text and images from you on this build?

I, for one, am very interested in your continuing to work on her. She's such a beautiful ship and to model her well, as I know you can and will, is a delight to watch. It's also a thread from which, if my skills are up to it, I may use some of your techniques and building know how. In other words, I selfishly want you to continue the project so I might learn a bit more about how a skilled modeler builds a model of a gorgeous sailing vessel.

Fright- It's 1/16" x 1/16' from Blue Jacket. Thats 4" at 1/64 scale. Small for a ship but as far as I can tell, correct for this yacht. There aren't really good drawings of the deck itself.

I have a micro table saw that can make small sections, but making that kind of thing is just too laborous.

So my wife put you up to this, didn't she? I had to get the model down from the SoD and it's now on the bench...

GM - LOL in a way that's a good thing - she is pretty to look at! Thanks for your reply. I guessed the BJ referred to Blue Jacket and my guestament on the strips was round 1/16" x 1/32". Close but no cigar  Thanks again and say hello to that City by the Bay - Cheers!

Actually, I think you are right! I don't have easy access to my wood storage, but I looked at the rough opening where the masts insert, and it does look to be 1/32" x 1/16". Good call.

The most important thing is to mark where the ends of the planks occur on the sub deck. Those are over deck beams, and this allowed them to be lined up with the bulwark stanchions which are attached to the ends of the frames. All of this looks better when it's organized.

I don't know anything about how wood deck planking was laid on steel decks..

I'm interested to see your project.

Bill

GMorrison

about how wood deck planking was laid on steel decks

If US capital ships are any guide, the metal deck plates are overlaid with "Z" or "C" channels arranged to drain to the scuppers.  The sleepers have gaps in their lines, which are staggered in alternating rows--again, to allow for drainage.

Typically, the sleepers (which are circa 1.5" to 2.5"/30-50mm tall) are set with threaded studs.  The wooden planks are then drilled to fit over the studs, with a counter-bore for the washer and nut, over which a bung is truck to hide the fastener.

Some of the early ships used sleepers which were bored, then tapped, so threaded bolts could be passed through the planking.

US ships used planks of about 3.5 x 3.5" (88-99mm square) often as long as 24' (7.3m) laid with a 1:4 stagger (each plank started a frame/sleeper aft of the first until the fourth, then the butt end moved forward even with the first).

There's a whole subcategory for that stagger. According to Longridge, Nelson stagger had start/ 1 back/ 2 forward/ 3 back.

I stagger one step forward and two steps back after a couple of shots of Shackelton. Good whiskey BTW.

I did a little reading after I posed the ?. What you describe is what would make sense, esp. over an armored deck which certainly isn't something anyone could drill holes through. Those "hat" channels could be welded to the deck.

Ships in the composite era had iron deck beams which included a wide top flange that had pre-drilled holes. Those were a guide through which the bolt hole was drilled from below, and countersunk on top for the washer/ nut and the plug.

The woodie builders attach an underlayment like 3/4" plywood over the beams and screw the planks to that.

And one article described how Titanic had clear yellow pine for the passenger decks, pitch pine for the heavy traffic areas and teak on the anchor deck.

My understanding is that the USN screwed down steel plates over the wood planking on the Essex ships, covered that with non-skid; when the jets came. Full circle.

CapnMac82

US ships used planks of about 3.5 x 3.5" (88-99mm square) often as long as 24' (7.3m) laid with a 1:4 stagger (each plank started a frame/sleeper aft of the first until the fourth, then the butt end moved forward even with the first).

 

GMorrison

I stagger one step forward and two steps back after a couple of shots of Shackelton. Good whiskey BTW. 

GM:   

+1 on the Shackleton!  I really like it.

Hey ;

 Watch it ! I do have a small sliver from the wood underlayment on the Hornet though . 

GMorrison

 

Tanker Builder has his piece from the Maine, he was an OPO.

 

I have a piece from the ESSEX that was saved when she was being cut up. An association member that lived in New Jersey noticed her being cut at the breakers yard and made arrangements to obtain some of the flight deck planking. He also took progressive pictures of her as she was being cut up. I have copies of those too. She was decommissioned 4 years after I served on her and was cut up a couple years later. We made displays of them and issued them to shipmates at our reunions.

 I had trouble photographing this as it's mounted in a glass case. The plank piece is a rectangle shape, about 3/4 in thick, mounted on a decorative piece with the cutout routed corners.

I'm very glad to have it.

EJ

GMorrison - the work that you are doing on this kit is to be admired. Great job and look forward to future posts on your build. Thanks for posting!

gmorrison only just caught up with this build , really nice work , your a talented scratch builder , keep the pic's coming please .

steve5