Colour photo Hornet

That does not look like a real photo. Looks more like some sort of painting or digital artwork.

Blowing it up, there is a signature on the lower left area... definitely some sort of artwork.

Here are some actual official USN color photos of USS Hornet in summer 1942. You can see what the limitations of color film of the era are.

sharkbait

Found this colour photo of Hornet leaving San Fran with the Doolittle Raiders  on deck. .Posting link .

https://www.facebook.com/safetyatseainfo/photos/pb.879856928775620.-2207520000.1554081207./2192368610857772/?type=3&theater

 

That is not a color photo but an artist painting. You can tell that’s a painting.

It's a painting by William S. Philips titled " Approaching the Gate to Destiny."

http://www.greenwichworkshop.com/phillips/approachingthegate.asp

I used to drive across that bridge twice a day, when I didn't take the ferry.

Kind of a lovely painting, although I would question the types and locations of aircraft. 

Anyhow, a nice painting of a great moment. April 2 will be here in a couple of days.

I think it is a great post actually. It gives me a chill to think about it.

As I said, I've driven over the bridge probably 8,000 times. Before the base closures, it would be very common to see submarines headed for Mare Island and carriers headed for Hunter's Point and Alameda.

I for one learned something from your post. I had no idea that B-25's were launched from carriers. Bad on me.

GMorrison

I used to drive across that bridge twice a day, when I didn't take the ferry.

So, I was going to be critical of the artist for painted the bridge out of level, then I looked some more....

Is the bridge really that much uphill/downhill? I didn't pay much attention a couple years back when we crossed it both ways.

According to the Bridge District website, the difference between the elevations of the South abutment and midspan is a little over 84 feet.

Greg

I for one learned something from your post. I had no idea that B-25's were launched from carriers.

 

These are a couple of photos from the same locale, pre war, showing probably the best actual work color photos could do from an aircraft at that time...

GMorrison

According to the Bridge District website, the difference between the elevations of the South abutment and midspan is a little over 84 feet.

That's pretty substantial grade, thanks. I guess the artist had it right and I jumped to a bad conclusion.

stikpusher

Really? You’ve never read or seen “Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo”? I think I was 8 or 9 the first time that I read that book.

No, and being such a  poor student of history and especially war history becomes an occasional embarrassment for me here. But I'm slowing learning some stuff from all of you.

stikpusher

It is a lovely painting. I can only imagine what the Bay area was like at that time. So much history there.

Yes, it is. And so are the pictures you posted above. It always fascinates me when an image can invoke feelings of nostagia for a time when I didn't even exist yet.

"Thirty Seconds Over Toyko" is the classic book to start with. It was written by Ted Lawson, who flew the seventh bomber to take off; "Ruptured Duck". It was also a pretty good movie.

Follow with "The First heroes: The Extraordinary Story of the Doolittle Raid". And Doolittle's autobiography "I Could Never Be So Lucky Again", which IMO (see also Boyington, Fosse) illustrates the point that it's hard to be good at more than one thing at a time.

It's a long and complicated story, what the painting shows is the USS Hornet, CV-8 which was a Yorktown Class carrier (along with Yorktown and Enterprise), leaving San Francisco Bay at 8.30 in the morning on April 2, 1942 enroute on the mission.

The ship in the background is an escort, I suppose USS Nashville. Actual photos taken while under way show the sixteen bombers, as well as a group of Wildcats up at the bow.

The bridge was flat on May 24th 1987, the 50th Birthday Party. I was there and am in the crowd somewhere between the last concrete abutment and the south tower in the foreground.

GMorrison

The ship in the background is an escort, I suppose USS Nashville. Actual photos taken while under way show the sixteen bombers, as well as a group of Wildcats up at the bow.

 

There were also SBDs spotted aft at some points of the journey

Except the Yorktown and Enterprise were busy in different areas of the Pacific, and Enterprise made a mid ocean rondevous for the final runin to the launch point.

Poor grammar on my part. Yorktown and Enterprise were sisters in the class, not in the group that sailed from Alameda and as you said, Enterprise joined them while underway.

There are a couple things I don't quite understand. 

With all those bombers on the deck how was there enough room to get to speed for takeoff? 

If the answer is somehow that they "put" some down below deck (not sure what else the answer could be), why not leave port that way?  

I would imagine such a sight, bombers crammed on a carrier, would be quite noteworthy to anyone observing- say, someone on the Japanese payroll. Seems like a good way to blow your cover. 

I understand there was no internet but I imagine a message could get back to Japan faster than a carrier.  ALERT!  Something looks fishy over here! 

I'm sure the google machine has the answer but figured I'd ask here instead. 

T e d

Leading up to launch the bombers were farther back. All 16 were on deck the entire trip. Originally one was supposed to fly off and land back on land, but Doolittle decided to keep all 16 for the Raid.

They launched from about even with the island, every plane taxied up to the same point. I don't remember but it was something like 480 feet of takeoff on an 800 some flight deck. 

Stiks SBD always fascinated me. Did it come up on the aft elevator? Probably. All of Hornets air group was below when the Raid was launched. Hornet had a hangar level catapult, but it wouldn't be something to launch an air group with. That was Enterprises role.

Hornet did bring the planes up once the bombers were gone. I've never seen any pictures of that. Frankly it's kind of unusual that we have so many photos taken up to the launch.

Ted4321

There are a couple things I don't quite understand. 

With all those bombers on the deck how was there enough room to get to speed for takeoff? 

If the answer is somehow that they "put" some down below deck (not sure what else the answer could be), why not leave port that way?  

I would imagine such a sight, bombers crammed on a carrier, would be quite noteworthy to anyone observing- say, someone on the Japanese payroll. Seems like a good way to blow your cover. 

I understand there was no internet but I imagine a message could get back to Japan faster than a carrier.  ALERT!  Something looks fishy over here! 

I'm sure the google machine has the answer but figured I'd ask here instead. 

T e d

 

Ted... and Greg... please read up on this mission. It is one of the most daring stories of WWII. It has been portrayed in writing and on screen historically and fictionally. And due to its’ circumstances, fairly well documented. 

Long story short, a group,of Army aviators we’re trained to take off a B-25 in about 400some odd feat from a standing start. B-25s were stripped off excess weight and given extra fuel for range. They were to be shipped to within a certain distance of Japan aboard USS Hornet while USS Enterprise rode shotgun, launched in the late afternoon and fly a night strike on Japan, then land in friendly held areas of China the next morning. Things went wrong. The task force was discovered at dawn on the day of launch by a picket boat (quickly sunk) hundreds of miles short of the launch point. The raid was launched early, and the results are now history.

As far as shipping out of San Francisco in the morning in broad daylight... well the internment of all those of Japanese descent, American citizens or not, put a crimp in that network. And shiploads of aircraft had departed from the ports of both coasts for the war zones since Pearl Harbor, so that was not completely out of place. And pretty much, the Japanese did not expect medium bombers to be launched from carriers. They expected, if anything, standard USN carrier planes of the time with their known radius of action.

stikpusher

... please read up on this mission. 

I will be doing so.  Thanks a lot for taking the time to respond, Stik.  Absolutely fascinating. 

T e d

It does look like a ferry trip. 

A friend of mines grandfather was the copilot on TNT.  Griffith P. William's.  His memoirs were a fascinating read.  

GM.. I caught your meaning on a second read.  Sorry.  I know you know Pacific history somewhat better than I do.

GMorrison

Frankly it's kind of unusual that we have so many photos taken up to the launch.

 

I think that the powers that be in the War Deartment (today’s DoD) recognized both the historical and propaganda value of the mission and documenting it. (similar photos of the Iran Hostage Eagle Claw Raid onboard USS Nimitz have come to light since that mission) Had more of the B-25s survived, I  suspect that more photos of the raid itself would have survived. Hollywood director John Ford was on board USS Hornet filming the launch. On her journey immediately afterwards to Coral Sea and then back to Pearl Harbor after the raid he filmed many activities on board including what would be scenes of the ill fated Torpedo Squadron 8 that he provided to their families after Midway. After USS Hornet returned to Pearl Harbor Ford was sent to Midway island to film the upcoming battle there. He caught a piece of shrapnel in his shoulder during the Japanese bombing raid on Midway on the morning of June 4.

... and to further close the loop,  in announcing the attack on the Japanese mainland,  President Roosevelt was asked where the attack came from.   He said Shangri La,  which was the name of a popular 1933 novel about a mythical kingdom high in the Himalayas.  The reference to the novel was widely understood, and is the source of the aircraft carrier named seemingly out of place among the names of former ships and battles.  USS Shangri La.  

Edit:  and one more thing about the launch,   By steaming at flank speed into the wind the wind over the deck was increased to 40-50 knots making the short take off easier.   Film of Doolittle’s #1 launch show the aircraft seeming to jump off the deck and climb rapidly.  

 Dolittle circled the carrier once and struck out alone.   There was no joining up and flying a massed formation.  This was an stream of individual aircraft attacking separate locations

It's also an interesting moment, as up to that point our fleet carrier force was completely intact. In May, Lexington was lost, followed by Yorktown in June, Wasp in September and finally Hornet herself in October.

EdGrune

 

... and to further close the loop,  in announcing the attack on the Japanese mainland,  President Roosevelt was asked where the attack came from.   He said Shangri La,  which was the name of a popular 1933 novel about a mythical kingdom high in the Himalayas.  The reference to the novel was widely understood, and is the source of the aircraft carrier named seemingly out of place among the names of former ships and battles.  USS Shangri La.  

 

Edit:  and one more thing about the launch,   By steaming at flank speed into the wind the wind over the deck was increased to 40-50 knots making the short take off easier.   Film of Doolittle’s #1 launch show the aircraft seeming to jump off the deck and climb rapidly.  

 Dolittle circled the carrier once and struck out alone.   There was no joining up and flying a massed formation.  This was an stream of individual aircraft attacking separate locations

 

EdGrune

 

... and to further close the loop,  in announcing the attack on the Japanese mainland,  President Roosevelt was asked where the attack came from.   He said Shangri La,  which was the name of a popular 1933 novel about a mythical kingdom high in the Himalayas.  The reference to the novel was widely understood, and is the source of the aircraft carrier named seemingly out of place among the names of former ships and battles.  USS Shangri La.  

 

Edit:  and one more thing about the launch,   By steaming at flank speed into the wind the wind over the deck was increased to 40-50 knots making the short take off easier.   Film of Doolittle’s #1 launch show the aircraft seeming to jump off the deck and climb rapidly.  

 Dolittle circled the carrier once and struck out alone.   There was no joining up and flying a massed formation.  This was an stream of individual aircraft attacking separate locations

 

To add a little....the launch officer waving them off would wait to give the signal until the end of the flightdeck would be at it's highest point when they reached it with the pitching to give them every inch of altitude they could get.

GMorrison

It's also an interesting moment, as up to that point our fleet carrier force was completely intact. In May, Lexington was lost, followed by Yorktown in June, Wasp in September and finally Hornet herself in October.

 

Aside from Saratoga being torpedoed by a submarine in January, being repaired, coming back into the fight in summer, and then being torpedoed by a submarine again in September. 

Yes, maybe not intact, but floating.