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"Greenhouse" masking question

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  • Member since
    September, 2003
  • From: Chesapeake VA
"Greenhouse" masking question
Posted by out04 on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 12:24 PM

I've completed two kits recently, one canopy masked with BMF (foil), the other with Tamiya tape.  Both materials took some of the frame paint away when they were removed.  Acrylic paint was used for both, canopies washed but not futured.

Is it mandatory to trace around the masks with a blade before removal?

Does the problem go away if enamels are used?

I've got a Dauntless and a P-38 in the pipeline so.....

  • Member since
    December, 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 2:02 PM

I get the same issue with enamels, thats whether i am useing Tamiya tape or Euard masks.

''I am a Norfolk man, and i glory in being so''

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Phantom FG.1

  • Member since
    December, 2013
  • From: Orlando Florida
Posted by route62 on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 2:16 PM

I always give a light trace with a sharp razor prior to peeling the mask since there are usually several layers of paint and clear coats.  

  • Member since
    August, 2012
Posted by JMorgan on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 1:38 AM

It is a good idea, once the frames are painted, to immediately remove the mask. This prevents chipping, especially for glosses.

  • Member since
    September, 2003
  • From: Chesapeake VA
Posted by out04 on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 8:29 AM

Can't pull it immediately when I have to layer two colors and weather to match the airframe.

  • Member since
    July, 2010
Posted by roony on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 10:29 AM

route62

I always give a light trace with a sharp razor prior to peeling the mask since there are usually several layers of paint and clear coats.  

 

I agree with route62.  It will be tiring on a SBD.

  • Member since
    June, 2017
  • From: Winter Park, FL
Posted by fotofrank on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 12:22 PM

I'm finishing up an LT-6 at the moment. It took half a day to mask the canopy. I'd sure hate to screw up a paint job trying to peel off the masking. I also have an A-24 getting ready for paint. Haven't masked the canopy yet.

OK. On the bench:

Way too much to build in one lifetime...

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 6:56 PM

out04

Can't pull it immediately when I have to layer two colors and weather to match the airframe.

 

Exactly. I usually paint with the canopies in place, even if I plan to have it open on the finished build. The masked closed canopy protects the cockpit. So it's dip in Future, allow to dry, mask canopy, glue/tack glue in place, paint, gloss, flat, and finally remove mask and open up canopy. I have literally had canopies masked for years on some shelf queens.

 

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LSM

 

  • Member since
    January, 2009
  • From: hamburg michigan
Posted by fermis on Friday, August 25, 2017 8:38 PM

I haven't had a problem, using enamels.

I use Tamiya tape...unless it's an Eduard kit, that comes with masks. Even after the masking has been in place for weeks, I still haven't had any issues with it peeling up more than it should.

  • Member since
    November, 2008
  • From: Central Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Saturday, August 26, 2017 2:54 PM

The only way I see that happening is if too much paint was sprayed. For dark colors I spray a light coat of black first. This thin translucent black coat will cut down on the final paint color coats eliminating paint buildup. For light colors I shoot a light or medium grey first.

It's  a good idea to remove the masking asap but sometimes due to certain situations, the masking will remain in place for weeks at a time. So far, I've  had no issues in doing so.

 GIFMaker.org_jy_Ayj_O

 

 

Too many models to build, not enough time in a lifetime!!

  • Member since
    December, 2017
Posted by WWII_AC on Sunday, December 03, 2017 8:02 PM

I just got through masking a Tamiya F4U-1A canopy and front windscreen. Tamiya was kind enough to supply the masking tape. Smile

But, the whole time I was applying the mask I kept wondering why do manufacturers still mold the canopy glass and the canopy frame as a one piece clear part anyway? Given the improvements and advancements in the manufacturing process over the last 4 decades you would think they (someone) would have found a way to mold the clear glass separate from the frame - using a recess to allow the glass to sit flush with the frame once glass is applied. This whole masking tape thing just feels so...1970's!

  • Member since
    November, 2008
  • From: Central Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Wednesday, December 06, 2017 6:00 PM

WWII_AC

I just got through masking a Tamiya F4U-1A canopy and front windscreen. Tamiya was kind enough to supply the masking tape. Smile

But, the whole time I was applying the mask I kept wondering why do manufacturers still mold the canopy glass and the canopy frame as a one piece clear part anyway? Given the improvements and advancements in the manufacturing process over the last 4 decades you would think they (someone) would have found a way to mold the clear glass separate from the frame - using a recess to allow the glass to sit flush with the frame once glass is applied. This whole masking tape thing just feels so...1970's!

 

Sounds good in theory but try assembling a complex greenhouse like a Val, Judy, etc. will be quite a project. I rather use commercially made paint masks when available to make it an easier task.

 GIFMaker.org_jy_Ayj_O

 

 

Too many models to build, not enough time in a lifetime!!

  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Thursday, December 07, 2017 8:49 AM

Whether I need to use hobby knife to outline tape or mask edges depends on how many coats of paint I put on.  For just a coat or two, I usually don't.  However, if some problems occur that require more coats than that on airframe, then I find I must use the knife.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    March, 2015
Posted by JohnnyK on Thursday, December 07, 2017 4:17 PM

I use Eduards masks and Tamyia Silver Plate. I have never had a problem. I also mask the back side of the greehouse with blue tape. This is the greenhouse for a 1/48 B-29. Masking this by hand would not work for me.

  • Member since
    January, 2014
Posted by Silver on Monday, February 05, 2018 2:29 PM

Try “MonoTex Canopy masks”

  • Member since
    February, 2016
Posted by fritzthefox on Sunday, February 25, 2018 9:25 PM

I think water-based acrylic paints have poor adhesion in general, which can create masking problems. Water-based acryic relies on polymerization for adhesion, so it is less inclined to stick to surfaces and more inclined to stick to itself. Consequently, it likes to peel off in chunks. You will likely need a very low tack tape for masking them, and the longer you leave the tape on, the greater the chance of a problem. I rarely have a problem with lacquer based acrylics, which bite into the surface and will tolerate masking better. I've used bare metal foil with them, and the only nuisance is getting the foil off. 

A good lacquer primer may help, or roughing the painting surface a little before applying the paint. Clear plastic has very little tooth for paint to grab onto.

  • Member since
    November, 2008
  • From: Central Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Monday, February 26, 2018 6:24 AM

fritzthefox

I think water-based acrylic paints have poor adhesion in general, which can create masking problems. Water-based acryic relies on polymerization for adhesion, so it is less inclined to stick to surfaces and more inclined to stick to itself. Consequently, it likes to peel off in chunks. You will likely need a very low tack tape for masking them, and the longer you leave the tape on, the greater the chance of a problem. I rarely have a problem with lacquer based acrylics, which bite into the surface and will tolerate masking better. I've used bare metal foil with them, and the only nuisance is getting the foil off. 

A good lacquer primer may help, or roughing the painting surface a little before applying the paint. Clear plastic has very little tooth for paint to grab onto.

 

 

 

Like u said, a solvent primer ensures proper adhesion when using acrylics. MM Acryl will peel right off if no solvent primer is used and heard of the same with Vallejo.

Tamiya acrylics can be thinned with LT and are not water based so they adhere very well as is with no primer.

It gets a bit confusing with water based and solvent based acrylics.

 GIFMaker.org_jy_Ayj_O

 

 

Too many models to build, not enough time in a lifetime!!

  • Member since
    January, 2014
Posted by Silver on Monday, February 26, 2018 2:57 PM

Try “Monotrx Masks”. 99.9% good quality.

  • Member since
    March, 2013
Posted by patrick206 on Tuesday, February 27, 2018 10:09 PM

Just my own experience, whether enamel, acrylic or anything else, I airbrush the paint really thinned in multiple/several layers. Rough mix ratio, 3 parts paint, to   5 parts thinner, adjusted as deemed required. This seems to be a fix for the issue of thick paint not releasing from the mask, it's been a very long time since I've experienced a ragged mask line on any surface.

Also, I've had some surfaces masked for a long time and still no mask line or lifting problems. My most used masking is with Tamiya tape, commercial masks or Frisket paper.

Patrick

  • Member since
    September, 2006
  • From: Bethlehem PA
Posted by the Baron on Wednesday, February 28, 2018 3:02 PM

plasticjunkie

...It gets a bit confusing with water based and solvent based acrylics.

To say nothing of the old Pactra line of water-based acrylic enamels Big Smile

The bigger the government, the smaller the citizen.

 

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  • Member since
    November, 2008
  • From: Central Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Wednesday, February 28, 2018 5:25 PM

the Baron

 

 
plasticjunkie

...It gets a bit confusing with water based and solvent based acrylics.

 

 

To say nothing of the old Pactra line of water-based acrylic enamels Big Smile

 

Oh yes fogot those. Just went to Hobby Lobby today and saw water based oil paints in tubes. Surprise  

 GIFMaker.org_jy_Ayj_O

 

 

Too many models to build, not enough time in a lifetime!!

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