SEARCH FINESCALE.COM

Enter keywords or a search phrase below:

Paint Quandary

748 views
19 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    April, 2018
  • From: Louisiana, USA
Paint Quandary
Posted by Spectre on Sunday, May 13, 2018 3:21 PM

Please help me sort this out. I'm in the midst of starting my first 2 builds after a long, long hiatus from the hobby and need to purchase paints. Acrylics rule  now as opposed to enamels back in the day. However, they are convenient for clean up, but seem awfully fussy going on and staying on. All of the acrylic primers are dodgy from my research, with the notable exception for the Badger Stynylrez?

Lawd, I need some basic colors, i.e. black, white, red, yellow, silver for brush painting along with AB paints for USN 1943 F6-3 Hellcat colors and P47D razorback painted color schemes, Not baremetal. I understand that is a booger out of the gate.

My understanding is that the Gunze is the top dawg for the solvent based paints and Tamiya is the "go to" for a lot of peeps. Then the Vallejo, AK, and Ammo by Mig?

Help me understand.

 

Thank you

 

  • Member since
    March, 2003
  • From: Towson MD
Posted by gregbale on Sunday, May 13, 2018 3:52 PM

Can't say as to the others, because I strictly use Tamiya. For me they've been trouble-free to use, forgiving of mistakes and durable enough for ordinary purposes. I always use their own thinner---which has retarder right in it---so no problems with too-quick drying or clogging of my AB.

Main 'downside' is lack of model-specific colors like RLM paints for the Luftwaffe, etc...though their RAF/FAA selection is getting better all the time. I mostly mix my own colors as I go, so that doesn't bother me.

Not smooth as silk to brush-paint with, though (in my experience) not quite the battle some would suggest, either. Just thin generously and don't try to re-work just-covered areas.

Hope it helps.

Greg

 George Lewis:

"Every time you correct me on my grammar I love you a little fewer."

 

"

  • Member since
    November, 2003
  • From: Newington CT
Posted by tempestjohnny on Sunday, May 13, 2018 6:29 PM
I was a Model Master enamel guy for 30 years. Now I use Tamiya for ease of use and they are found everywhere. Also buy Gunze Aqueous when I can. I always use the specific thinner for each

 

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Sunday, May 13, 2018 7:13 PM

I use a wide variety of acrylic brands - Model Master, Gunze, Tamiya, Pollyscale, Aeromaster, LifeColor, Badger, and Mission Model brand.

Mission Model has been getting a lot of positive reviews on their paint lines. Give them a try.

  • Member since
    October, 2016
  • From: Somewhere in Ohio...
Posted by DasBeav on Sunday, May 13, 2018 8:58 PM

You might want to check out Vallejo Model Color or Model Air on Amazon or other sites. They have 8 and 16 bottle sets that might suit your paint needs.

 Sooner Born...Buckeye Bred.

 

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Monday, May 14, 2018 10:58 AM

DasBeav

You might want to check out Vallejo Model Color or Model Air on Amazon or other sites. They have 8 and 16 bottle sets that might suit your paint needs.

 

 

The trouble with Vallejo is they're more troubke than they're worth. I've seen many folks have trouble with them for airbrushing. Used for handbrushing is great though. That's just my opinion. 

Mission Model holds more than Vallejo small dropper style bottles.

  • Member since
    August, 2017
Posted by laskdjn on Monday, May 14, 2018 12:43 PM

BlackSheepTwoOneFour

 

 
DasBeav

You might want to check out Vallejo Model Color or Model Air on Amazon or other sites. They have 8 and 16 bottle sets that might suit your paint needs.

 

 

 

 

The trouble with Vallejo is they're more troubke than they're worth. I've seen many folks have trouble with them for airbrushing. Used for handbrushing is great though. That's just my opinion. 

Mission Model holds more than Vallejo small dropper style bottles.

 

 

The problem with Vallejo is that they dry so darn fast.  The Model Color is good for brush painting, but you pretty much have to use a wet pallette with it.  The Model Air isn't terrible, but you have to use the flow improver, and I have to thin it beyond what it comes as, and then, the paint is really transparent.  But even then, it's a constant battle with dry tip.

 

Recently I've been experimenting with Mission Models and I must say I'm really liking them.  Their color selection seems lacking a little, though.

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Monday, May 14, 2018 7:45 PM

laskdjn

 

 
BlackSheepTwoOneFour

 

 
DasBeav

You might want to check out Vallejo Model Color or Model Air on Amazon or other sites. They have 8 and 16 bottle sets that might suit your paint needs.

 

 

 

 

The trouble with Vallejo is they're more troubke than they're worth. I've seen many folks have trouble with them for airbrushing. Used for handbrushing is great though. That's just my opinion. 

Mission Model holds more than Vallejo small dropper style bottles.

 

 

 

 

The problem with Vallejo is that they dry so darn fast.  The Model Color is good for brush painting, but you pretty much have to use a wet pallette with it.  The Model Air isn't terrible, but you have to use the flow improver, and I have to thin it beyond what it comes as, and then, the paint is really transparent.  But even then, it's a constant battle with dry tip.

 

Recently I've been experimenting with Mission Models and I must say I'm really liking them.  Their color selection seems lacking a little, though.

 

 

Color selection lacking? Think again. They have 116 colors to date and not counting the clearcoats, thinner, flow improver, primers (6 primer colors - black, white, red oxide, pink, tan,  & grey), 6 weathering coors and chrome as well as gloss base coat for chrome. 

Definitely more than what Tamiya has to offer.

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Monday, May 14, 2018 11:56 PM

Mission Models has a nice alowly expanding color selection, but it is mostly armor centric with a secondary area of certain air forces aircraft colors. And while I do like that they offer multiple versions of olive drab, Russian tank green, or dark yellow, if you’re not a tread head, many of their colors are no good to you. 

But they are another good option if they cover your preferred subject areas. 

Who or what says we must stick to one brand or paint type?

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    April, 2003
  • From: USA
Posted by keavdog on Tuesday, May 15, 2018 12:04 AM

Anyone try Mr Paint (MRP) out of Slovakia?  Sorry for the hijack, but might help. They have airbrush ready paints.  Whatch their chrome demo on Facebook. 

Thanks,

John

  • Member since
    July, 2014
  • From: Meridian, ID
Posted by modelcrazy on Tuesday, May 15, 2018 12:10 AM

I agree with Stick, I would like to try Mission but can't really justify the cost for the few tanks I do. I did talk with the owner on the phone about 2 years ago and he said they were planning on USN, IJN and KM colors 

Steve

ON THE BENCH

1/35 Hobby Boss Fieseler Storch
1/72 Hasegawa Nell
1/48 Tamiya Swordfish

In Que

1/350 Tamiya Prince of Wales
1/700 Tamiya King George V
1/72 Academy FW-190 A

 

  • Member since
    March, 2017
Posted by Gerg on Tuesday, May 15, 2018 1:19 AM

Spectre

However, they are convenient for clean up,.... 

I have to disagree with you here. Acrylic are much harder to clean. They dry so fast that whether it is your airbrush or hairy stick you can't clean them quick enough after you use them. They dry immediately. Often you have to clean your tool of choice in the middle of use. Enamels on the other hand are low stress in every way. Since trying them I have decided they are my paint of choice. I never have a dry clogged tip or paint brush that needs cleaning part way through a job. When the job is finished and it is time to clean the tool, the paint actual dissolves in the thinner. I rarely have to breakdown my airbrush or even remove the needle. Paint brushes are left clean and good as new.  Acrylics and the cleaners/thinners to clean them are hard on brushes, distorting the bristles. Mineral spirits on the other hand seem to condition the bristle.

My advice. Give enamels a hard look. Having come back to the hobby and hearing nothing but the virtues of acrylics I initial went that route. I didn't find a lot of positive info on enamels. I personal feel they have gotton a bad rap. They are superior in every respect but one. They are to some degree more unhealthy. But...acrylics are not as safe as the water base mentality would suggest. Each paint puts pigment into the air when sprayed. Each has chemical that aren't good for you. Each should be used with ventilation. If you are using a spray booth and/or respirator then the fact that enamels are to some degree more unhealthy really is a non-factor.

Many feel that enamel paint takes too long to dry. This rarely is a problem. If you are using an airbrush and a flat paint the model can be handled shortly after spraying. I have also masked within a day with no problem. If you are brush painting then it will take a long time to dry. On the other hand if you can wait, brush painting enamels is a pleasure. Hard to say that about acrylics. Gloss paint also takes longer to dry but unless you paint cars (in which case you probably should use laquer) this isn't a problem. For most models and genres, flat paint is used.

I use silver paint to check for flaws and rarely prime. I don't like thick layers on my models and see no reason (there are exceptions) to use a primer. With an enamel adhesion is not a problem. With an acrylics you can't get away with that.

Lastly, I really like painting. It is probably my favorite part of modeling. As I said before, enamels are low stress. Because I am not worried about paint drying on the needle tip I can relaxed and take my time. With acrylic there is always the thought that if you let off the trigger a dry tip is likely. So you find yourself rushing  and also blowing a lot of paint into the air rather than releasing it after a pass. With enamels I know I can set the airbrush down as often and as long as I want during a painting session without a problem. I can't say the same with acrylics. Once the cap is removed from the paint bottle it is a race. The timer is ticking. 

My reply is long, a rant, doesn't really address your question but it wasn't that long ago I was faced with all the paint choices and all that goes with that and I didnt give enamels any thought. Mostly because it seems that acrylics are a default choice. It really doesn't deserve such reverence as that. 

Gerg

  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Tuesday, May 15, 2018 8:59 AM

Gerg

 

 
Spectre

However, they are convenient for clean up,.... 

 

 

I have to disagree with you here. Acrylic are much harder to clean. They dry so fast that whether it is your airbrush or hairy stick you can't clean them quick enough after you use them. They dry immediately. Often you have to clean your tool of choice in the middle of use. Enamals on the other hand are low stress in every way. Since trying them I have decided they are my paint of choice. I never have a dry clogged tip or paint brush that needs cleaning part way through a job. When the job is finished and it is time to clean the tool, the paint actual dissolves in the thinner. I rarely have to breakdown my airbrush or even remove the needle. Paint brushes are left clean and good as new.  Acrylics and the cleaners/thinners to clean them are hard on brushes, distorting the bristles. Mineral spirits on the other hand seem to condition the bristle.

 

 

I concur.  I am very hesitant to use acrylics in my airbrush.  One time I had a long phone call while spraying acrylics in my airbrush.  Was not able to clean brush right away.  Boy, what a job that was when I got time.  I have also gotten distracted before cleaning small brushes.  That turns out to be a bother with any kind of paint.  People tell my to use retarder with the acrylics- I often cannot find it at hobby shops.

There is even the odor-free turpentine for cleanup. I will not use it for thinning, but it is fine for cleanup.

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Tuesday, May 15, 2018 12:07 PM

Very well said Gerg. I use both types, but still am a die hard enamel fan. Your run down of the virtues of enamels (yes enamels due have virtues) as opposed to the vices of acrylics (and yes acylics do have their vices) is well stated. I know the market nowadays is currently heavily slanted in favor of acrylics, with enamels slowly becoming harder to find. Paint lines are contracting or disappearing altogether. But as long as they are out there, I will be using enamels.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    December, 2010
  • From: Texas!
Posted by Patrick McCarthy on Tuesday, May 15, 2018 12:12 PM

keavdog

Anyone try Mr Paint (MRP) out of Slovakia?  Sorry for the hijack, but might help. They have airbrush ready paints.  Whatch their chrome demo on Facebook. 

 

I have almost completely switched from Model Master to Mr Paint. I love their line. No mixing, thinning, retarding, etc. Sprays beautiful every time. This is why I use it. It would be great to see their line lean more towards US military FS standard colors rather than Soviet/European colors but they do have several already. 

Downside is they don't have too many colors in their brush paints yet. Also there is only one distributor in the US.

  • Member since
    August, 2017
Posted by laskdjn on Tuesday, May 15, 2018 3:32 PM

BlackSheepTwoOneFour

Color selection lacking? Think again. They have 116 colors to date and not counting the clearcoats, thinner, flow improver, primers (6 primer colors - black, white, red oxide, pink, tan,  & grey), 6 weathering coors and chrome as well as gloss base coat for chrome. 

Definitely more than what Tamiya has to offer.

 

 

Excuse me for misspeaking.  By lacking, I meant not as extensive as Vallejo.

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Tuesday, May 15, 2018 5:13 PM

My own two bits. I use all kinds of paints. I like acrylics for low smell, but I don't find the colors I am looking for very often, in particular with Tamiya.

I haven't tried Vallejo or Mission yet.

I really miss the old Polly S and other Floquil acrylics.

I like my enamels, Humbrol is a favorite. I think the aircraft colors are usually accurate.

I like the Colorcoats that White Ensign models used to sell, and I think they can be found. I think that they have accurate naval colors.

I've never had any problems cleaning up after using enamels.

  • Member since
    June, 2014
Posted by bluenote on Wednesday, May 16, 2018 8:18 AM

I think it depends on what you model and how accurate you want to be.

My focus is cars, motorcycles, Star Wars, and the odd plane.  I use Tamiya acrylics for airbrushing and Tamiya enamels for brushpainting.  I also use ScaleFinishes for airbrushing car model bodies.

Yes, the colour range isn't the biggest, but for my needs, I have every colour I need in those ranges.  I like to keep my painting as simple as possible. 

  • Member since
    December, 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Wednesday, May 16, 2018 8:24 AM

keavdog

Anyone try Mr Paint (MRP) out of Slovakia?  Sorry for the hijack, but might help. They have airbrush ready paints.  Whatch their chrome demo on Facebook. 

 

I've used it once and really liked it, going to have a second trial on an armour kit this year. Main issue is it goes on so thin it does not fill any scratches in the surface, so prep has to be spot on.

''I am a Norfolk man, and i glory in being so''

 

On the bench: Rudel Stage 3

                     Academy 1/72nd Apache AH.1

  • Member since
    September, 2006
  • From: Bethlehem PA
Posted by the Baron on Wednesday, May 16, 2018 9:29 AM

Spectre

Please help me sort this out. I'm in the midst of starting my first 2 builds after a long, long hiatus from the hobby and need to purchase paints. Acrylics rule  now as opposed to enamels back in the day. However, they are convenient for clean up, but seem awfully fussy going on and staying on. All of the acrylic primers are dodgy from my research, with the notable exception for the Badger Stynylrez?

Lawd, I need some basic colors, i.e. black, white, red, yellow, silver for brush painting along with AB paints for USN 1943 F6-3 Hellcat colors and P47D razorback painted color schemes, Not baremetal. I understand that is a booger out of the gate.

My understanding is that the Gunze is the top dawg for the solvent based paints and Tamiya is the "go to" for a lot of peeps. Then the Vallejo, AK, and Ammo by Mig?

Help me understand.

Thank you

I use acrylics, enamels, and lacquers, without an intentional preference for the medium or for the manufacturer.  So, I'm not stuck when one or the other maker might go out of business and his line is no longer available.

I wound up with the mix I have because I buy for specific colors.  I don't like very much to mix colors; I'd rather use the closest match out of the bottle.

Having said that, I do have a lot of Tamiya acrylics.  I found that I get good results with them, using Tamiya's proprietary thinner.  I have had no problems running them through the airbrush, or cleaning it up afterwards.

I also have Andrea, Vallejo, Lifecolor, and craft store acrylics, but I use those for painting by hand, thinned with water.  I have airbrushed craft store acrylics, but I find their pigments to be a little too coarse for airbrushing, for my taste, at least for airplanes.  The finished surface had too much of a rough texture to it.

For enamels, it's mostly Model Master and Testor's, which I thin with mineral spirits for airbrushing.  Again, I've had no problems using them.

Lacquers are the smallest part of my paint box, but the ones I have are Gunze-Sangyo.  They make an orange yellow that is spot-on for the Navy's yellow for yellow wings subjects, at least to my eye.

Hope that helps!

Best regards,

Brad

The bigger the government, the smaller the citizen.

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v233/HansvonHammer/Humor/th_MonogramMafia.jpg?t=1296972087~original

JOIN OUR COMMUNITY!

Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.

SEARCH FORUMS

FREE NEWSLETTER
By signing up you may also receive reader surveys and occasional special offers. We do not sell, rent or trade our email lists. View our Privacy Policy.