Starting to use Acrylic paint after a life of Enamals...Any tips, suggestions, or warnings? Acrylics seem more complicated.

Hey, Jhawk -

I began using acrylics some time ago, a bit of a struggle at first, now it's second nature. Tip dry can be a pain, but easily manageable with experience. Mostly I think it's about the reducing agents used, additives take care of most of the drying problems.

I have used Vallejo Model Air, only used Model Color once for airbrushing, it's OK but needs lot's of thinning to work compared to Model Air. 

Model Air laid down nicely with a very smooth finish, but needed a good bit more time for a full dry compared to Tamiya. I might have over thinned it with Vallejo thinner, the additives can cause increased drying times.

One MAJOR caution, do NOT use alcohol for any purpose while painting or cleaning while using Vallejo. It will react and create a really thick mess, cleaning the airbrush of this residue is a real chore.

Cleaning the airbrush after use with acrylics is quite easy, I use paint store lacquer thinner or acetone. Some of the best modelers here at the forums use acrylics as their primary choice, the results speak for themselves.

Strictly as a personal choice, I use Tamiya acrylics almost exclusively. Some of the reasons are:

1. It's what my LHS stocks, otherwise it's on line purchasing for me.

2. It's user friendly.

3. It seems very consistent from batch to batch, not all brands are, in my experience.

4. It provides a tough finish, no problems with masks lifting it off.

For Vallejo I recommend using their branded thinner, I believe it has flow assistance additives. I also use a drop or two of Liquitex Flow Aid, it gives me a nice finish and I believe it helps to prevent tip dry.

For thinning Model Color I rely on an initial mix of 3:1, paint to thinner, then try spraying a bit to see what I have. Make adjustments until you like the results.

I know Vallejo says to just roll the bottle between your hands for preparation, I strongly disagree. After doing that I lifted the top of the bottle off by tipping it to the side, then with a finger nail under the opposite side it came free.

With a small stirring stick, I found lot's of thick unblended paint solids at the bottom. Once that was stirred to a smooth consistency I replaced the top and shook the heck out of the bottle, then it sprayed so much better and with much improved coverage.

I consider Vallejo's recommended "roll it between your hands" procedure to be ill advised, at least from my experience with it.

I hope you'll find good results using it, and I also recommend you use a prime coat under the final finish. Let us know how it goes for you.

Patrick 

In my experience, enamels are certainly easier. There is a definite learning curve with acrylics. And what works for one brand of acrylics does not work with another. BUt with time, trial and error, you will find whagt works and does not work for you with them, and probably master them as well. I am no Vallejo fan, like many folks here are, but I would advise to stick with their product line (paints, thinners, flow agent, retarders, etc.) to get consistent results.

Some guys swear by acrylics but I swear at them. I get better ab control with my enamels than acrylics but that's just me. My only exception will be with Tamiya acrylics which seem to spray very good, almost like the enamels.

I use tamiya acrylics mostly because of the quick drying times . I also use oil based paints ( model master ). Tamiya paints are limited paint shades .I'll mix with isp alcohol get the color (shade ) that I need . enamels take time to dry ...thus my booth doubles as a heat box ..for drying . Never tryed vallejo yet . May try it out. But right now I'll stay with tamiya. I thin with alcohol cuss it's cheap. .cheaper than buying tamiya thinner. .also clean my AB. Afterwards with Iso alcohol 99%.

5-high 

My 2 cents is IMO it's too bad you are starting out by spraying Model Color on your acrylic/Vallejo test.

As mentioned above, Model Color, with proper thinning, can be sprayed but it really isn't intended to be.

As Stik mentioned, Vallejo, like any new paint, is going to take some getting used to and I'm just afraid that by starting with Model Color you are going to become frustrated and in turn give up on Vallejo.

Nobody addressed your PSI question. In my experience Vallejo likes to be sprayed at a slightly higher PSI than other paints. Try 15-22 PSI for general coverage. That probably sounds high.

I love both paints equally haha. But the beauty of acrylics is how much easier they are to work with, imo. No toxic smell, clean off your hands with soap & water. You can easily remove paint from parts with rubbing alcohol and a cotton swab.

I thin with plain, old, tap water. Acrylics are a bit runnier if you over dilute, and as someone mentioned, tip dry can be an issue. What i usually do is turn my psi up until it clears, then set it back down. But because they are a bit thinner, it doesnt glob up on your hands or parts. 

Enamel washes are much easier to work with, since paint thinner/spirits doesnt effect acrylics.

Oh, and the best part of all..the entire acrylics section of your arts and crafts store is now at your disposal. At between 60 cents and 3 bucks a bottle, with 3x the amount, its quite a benefit!

If you do go check them out, beware that technically acrylics and oils are enamel paints. Ive only seen enamel used as specifically oil, in the modeling world. So if you see enamel bottle in the acrylic section, it will probably say acrylic somewhere on the bottle too, which means its just acrylic.

Chuck

Yes . Gregs right on the PSI .it will depend on what works for you ..I generally spray at 15 to 20 PSI.....I found that 15 PSI good in between pressure. Oil enamel paints like model master I generally spray at 20 PSI IMO. If I'm spraying say life color which is water based aryclics as is the pollyscale aryclics. ..10PSi will do .

5-high 

Something that just came to mind...from my limited experience, acrylic has a hard time sticking to plastic. You can scuff it up, use a primer, or lay a coat of enamel down as a base coat. I scuff and lay grey enamel down to solve the issue, plus the grey helps me see defects better.

Something to definitely keep in mind tho, imo.

"The paint dried before hitting the model and also clogged the tip."

Try holding the airbrush closer to the model. Also, the Vallejo Airbrush Flow Improver and Vallejo Retarder Medium are good. I find tip clog can be helped by keeping the air pressure flowing on the airbrush even when not spraying paint.

 

I'll go ahead and throw my  into this thread. I started out using enamels when I was a kid, long before acrylics were very popular. Then Testors came out with their acrylics and I thought that it was pretty cool that they had acrylic paint that could be cleaned up with water and not so nasty. I was strictly a brush painter at that time. I soon discovered that painting acrylics with a brush was a losing battle, at least with Testors brand.

I had been out of the modeling world for about 15 years and got back into it a few years ago. When I did, I stayed away completely from acrylics as my earlier experiences had shown them to be "sub-par".

As I got into the hobby more and more, and I read several guides and tips about how to use acrylics, I decided to give it a go. I purchased an airbrush and started playing around a bit. I found I still did not like the performance of Testors/Model Master products (granted they had almost any color you could imagine). I then gave Vallejo Model Color a try, thankfully, I didnt put it through the airbrush. I had read all of the horror stories about how perfect the thinning ratio had to be and what to not use to thin the stuff with or you'd end up with a snot-like substance in your AB.

I finally moved to AK and Ammo of Mig products and after learning how to spray them, I love these products. I also picked up some Tamiya and Humbrol products. The Tamiya is probably my next go to for acrylic paints. I was not impressed by Humbrol, maybe I got bad paint pots, I dont know, but when I opened them, they were thick and gooey, almost like what happens when you mix Vallejo and the wrong thinner.

I have now switched to mainly using AK, Ammo, Tamiya and Mr. Color. Unfortunately, I cannot purchase any of these locally and they have to be ordered online. I have also started using UMP products and Badger Stynylrez Primer. I will occasionally use an enamel or lacquer as a base primer coat for some toothiness with the plastic, but not always. I'm finding that a light sanding of the plastic after washing is enough to give some of the other primers the bite needed for good adhesion.

I can't imagine switching from enamels to acrylic paint.  I can't see a single advantage or plus in their use.  I know how to use enamels and have great results with them.  If you're a die-hard acrylic user, then you likely feel the same.

Gary

This is such an interesting topic. I always thought everyone used both. In my mind, while they both can cover the same things, ive always felt that there were pros & cons to both. And you used the better of the options per the situation.

I cant imagine giving up either. Theres just too much to lose if you gove up 1. But...you guys got me wondering, if i had to pick, which would it be...haha

Some very well stated additional points made. 

1. Pressure: I use Iwata and Badger AB's, with Tamiya acrylics. With a properly thinned mix I begin with a pressure of 15-18 psi, then adjust as I proceed, changing as needed, almost always upward to as high as 20-22. I know it sounds like a sloppy method, but I find with airbrushing paints you just "do what seems to work."

2. The suggestion to clear tip dry with an increased pressure blast is spot on, at the rare times I experience it I can quickly clear it with a 25-30 psi spray. But still, once in a while I'll use a cotton bud and lacquer thinner, to wipe the needle off. Maybe more out of habit than anything else.

3. I find in many circumstances it is a better practice to stick with the manufacturers thinners and additives, it seems likely they will have done the experimenting needed to ensure full compatibility and function. As stated, in the case of Vallejo, alcohol is a definate nope. For Tamiya I use and like X-20A, but I also have used distilled water, alcohol and lacquer thinner with no negative results. Of them, I prefer X-20A. The large bottle lasts a very long time.

4. For best adhesion, I find it a requirement to prime first. I use Tamiya gray primer, have tried Model Master gray enamel with lacquer thinner for a good plastic bite, also Tamiya gray acrylic with lacquer thinner as a primer. I think there may be many options for this point.

5. For AB maintenance after spraying anything, but especially acrylics, I think it's best to do a dis-assembly for full cleaning. At the very least, take it apart back to the needle bearing. Acrylic paint that has been allowed to dry inside the AB can still be removed, but you'll be at it for a while. The little interdental brushes from the drug store and lacquer thinner work really well for this. Strongly recommend a good look at "Don Wheelers Airbrush" website, he explains so clearly in text and photos about this and other AB subjects.

6. Gary,(Texgunner,) nails it to the wall, we all like what we like. As much as I enjoy Tamiya acrylics, there are several jobs I will only use Model Master enamel for. It just plain works, I'm used to it and I know in advance what the results will be. My best full gloss finishes are done only with it.

7. Not to run the Model Color down, but I agree with Greg, too bad your first use with Vallejo is that choice. I'd recommend looking at on line hobby dealers or ebay for paint purchases, then get something actually intended for airbrushing. I have used Scale Hobbyist, with excellent service for some time. In any event, Vallejo would not be my first choice, based solely on my personal experience. I find it to be a bit touchy and unpredictable, but I'm not trying to insult those that do prefer Vallejo.

8. Member "Bick" got me sold on craft acrylics from the art stores, they work very well for me in many applications. For some large surface area jobs, they are of good finish quality and dirt cheap, compared with hobby shop branded paints. Of late my favorite is "Craftsmart," from Michael's, 2 ounces for a buck and some change. Compatible with alcohol and lacquer thinner, LT gives a good bite for plastic adhesion.

At the end, after you gain your own comfort level based on experience, you will have determined what works for you.

Patrick 

 

Thank you all very much for your advice and thoughts. I didn't expect so many replies! Because of what I've read I decided to return the Model Color paints I bought and buy some Vallejo Model Air paints from Sprue Brothers (I really like them). As many have said, if I'm going to give acrylics a try I might as well use acrylics specifically designed from airbrushing. I was thinking of just skipping acrylics and going back to enamels, but I want to try something new and develop my modeling skills...so I'll give acrylics a shot. There are other techniques I want to try with this Jagdtiger: use of filters, chipping via painting or hairspray method, using powders more than I have in the past, etc. Things like colour modulation are way beyond my current skill set (I really don't even know what colour modulation is), but I might learn that stuff at some point. Thanks again for all you help!

There are advantages to using differing mediums of paint. Especially in the weathering stages, when dissimilar types will not react badly to one another.

Ok - a lot of replies, but none of them have the same scope as the other. Here's what I know about acrylics, enamels, and other paints that I normally use on models.

 

Acrylic - usually these are made with water. Unless it says otherwise acrylics are water based, and once applied must be brushed along the surface quickly before they cure. Once dry to the surface some brands will eat their way into the surface of the plastic. This makes it almost impossible to remove without sanding. I wouldn't suggest using any type of paint thinner, or acetone to promote adhesion. This isn't necessary to get this stuff to stick to the surface of your model kit. Make sure that what you're using is the proper paint for your project - some may damage the surface as I said before. If it doesn't damage the surface it may be impossible to remove if you paint it too thick. As you've already read some paints will eat into the surface if you remove most of it there may be a staining effect to it, and you'll have to paint over it to hide this.

 

Some acrylic paints are made from enamel, or solvent bases that are meant to be sprayed - water based paints aren't meant to be sprayed, but brushed onto the models' surface. Some acrylics are completely solvent based, and have no enamel, or water in them. These are considered to be lacquer based even though there is NO lacquer in them whatsoever! They are simply high solvents and therefore are made with a more durable formulation than what mineral spirits. You can use mineral spirits in your paint - DO NOT USE FUTURE! This is a floor polish, and is NOT meant for models as it can damage the surface of certain plastics, or yellow them, and the decals with disasterous results. 

 

I use 10 - 15 LBS. when spraying. You might want to practice on either an old junky model, or on polystyrene scrap. Your milage may vary, so work at your own pace, and trust nothing to be perfect, or to work the first time around. This will be more trial, and error as no one can hold the airbrush for you, or make it more comfortable, or tell you how far away from the model you'll need to be, etc. Try watching youtube for some tips on how to do this more effectively.

 

~ Cobra Chris

Yup! Just to expand on this point. Im doing some bucket seats right now. I had originally done them with an enamel flat black. After applying a semi gloss clear coat i thought they still looked dull. So i spreayed some semi gloss black acrylic over them, then a couple more coats of clear.

I am so glad i did this, because im painting a silver trim around the edges of the seats, and its enamel. I have messed up and restarted over a dozen times now. The spirits i use to cleam the silver back off isnt affecting the layers below it.

Now, whether I'll ever get these lines down right, is anothet story haha.

Chuck

Airbrushing using acrylic isn't all that complicated everyone makes it sounds. Just thin to consistency of skim milk and practice on a junk kit. Experiment using different psi pressures until you find the comfortable pressure it works with. Once you get the hang of it, it's really not all that hard.