Decal printing

If I could make a suggestion?

Perhaps an ALPS printer is the answer to the problem here. Back in the early 2000's, the company introduced a dry print system that advertised directly to the modelling community. The printers are capable of printing a wide variety of colors (including white!) and metallic finishes. The company went out of business, but there have been a number of other firms which have stepped in to fill the vacuum by offering reconditioned printers and ink refills for the system.

A lot of "cottage industry" decal manufacturers use the exact same technology (Don's Light and Magic and Fireball immediately come to mind) to print aftermarket decal sheets. The price on these reconditioned units isn't necessarily cheap, but it's pretty much on the same scale as what I paid for my Canon ink jet printer. The ink refills are almost identical in price to what I pay to refill my printer.

You can find them on e-Bay regularly, but alps-printer.com appears to be pretty much a "one stop shop" for reconditioned printers, ink, and information on what these machines can do for water transfer decals.

Because paper is white...

Pressure sensitive vinyl film comes in white.

Making a decal to include white just is not hard to do.

About the only glitch I have had is that if the art has white, it often prints as a gray tone on clear film. That just means adjusting the color density.

I've done screwy stuff too. Like for a white star on armor, print the star on the back of the film, cut out with a razor blade and bingo a white star with no outline.

Thanks for the investigative work! Certainly sounds like that one would not work. Too bad there seems to be little market for an affordable printer that can print white. 

I took the liberty in contacting Okidata website and inquired about white toner for decals and did in fact, get a response.

This is the response from Okidata representative concerning whether or not the white toner can be used for making your own decals:

_________________________________________________________

Thank you for your inquiry.

There is no documentation showing you could or couldn't print on decal
paper.  With this said, When printing on any media there are rules that
apply:
There are some basic rules to follow regarding these types of calls.


  -  Print media must be able to withstand 446°F (230°C) for 0.2 second.

- 20 psi(pounds per square inch)

- Check with the media company for the proper media settings.

- OKIDATA does not know what the long term effects could be using
specialized media.
    These type of media could compromise the fuser and/or drums

I would suggest you contact the manufacture company of the decal for best
white toner printer to use.


Thank you, OKIDATA Rubyann

_____________________________________________________

No surprise here. It's clearly states it must withstand high temps so this tells me it's more for t-shirt decals not water slide decals. I said it once and I'll say it again. I had my doubts and knew it couldn't possibly work.

In reponse to Liquid Magma's finding on the OKI printer and white toner, I've done a bit of research. OKI is actually an Okidata printer used for businesses. It is expensive - $3000 - $22,000 depending on what you want. I cannot find anything regarding whether or not it will work on decal paper. However, the reviews is here:

https://www.betterbuys.com/office-equipment/reviews/oki-c900-family-review/

As you can see, it's mainly for graphic arts and publishing but not for office uses. It does have its uses for making homemade iron-on transfers since the toner needs to be heated. It can be used on other surfaces such as metal, wood, and glass. However, it doesn't specify for uses on plastic - considering no one has tried it on plastic since plastic can melt in high temps - let alone low temps.

As I said before, I have my doubts whether this printer with white toner can work on decal paper or not.

Not to mention the question whether that printer is for everyday printing. Oh yeah, imagine how much it would cost you to replace white toner. I wouldn't be surprised they're $500 a pop. Heck, even some HP laser toners run anywhere from $200 - $400 a pop depending on the printer. I'm not talking about entry level laser printers either.

I think iron-on transfers are risky for use on a model.  The temp of the iron has to be fairly hot for those.  Seems like you risk burning or charring the paint, and maybe even melting or warping small parts.

So many questions regarding that particular printer. Looks to me it'll work only on special paper for iron-on transfers, not decal paper. But is it really for home uses? What about the toner? It could contain different chemicals compared to toner ink for home laser printers. How is it different than regular laser printer toner? I know it's a laser printer and you need decal paper for specifically for laser printers. So many variables compared to laser printer for home uses. I have my doubts though whether it'll work for decals. Again, we don't know if it's doable for decal paper.

The only way to find out is buy it yourself and see if it can work on decal paper.

GMorrison

First making decals that include white in the art is perfectly doable with clear film if the model itself is white.

At least for one of my current appications I have exactly that...I started working a 1:48 NASA T-38A using the Sword kit before there were any NASA T-38 decals out there (Trumpeter now makes a T-38C kit in NASA markings). Since the aircraft are all white, those decals are not a problem.

It won't work for every situation, but for now I'll live with having to use some white paint or go to the profesionnals if the situation gets too complicated.

That printer is not very high res.  Might be okay for 1:32, but I find I need pretty high res for smaller scales.  Remember, printer resolution is not the same as image resolution because of the way half-toning is done on a digital printer.  Also, wonder how many colors of toner it uses. May have reduced color gamut compared to inkjets with five or six ink colors.

I think this is silly.

First making decals that include white in the art is perfectly doable with clear film if the model itself is white.

Second; ure, CMYW-W now exists, and no doubt at some point will make its way to desktop printing. For now though, a $ 3,500.00 printer that makes T-shirt transfers isn't the right application for the subject being discussed.

Here is an example video of a newer OKI printer that does white

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3yOiybGQQs

Well, there are definately printers out there that can do white, but the cost is very high and they are not designed for household use. If you want to start your own printing business, then a $20k printer is a reasonable expense, but obviously too much for my hobby work. Just checking to see if anyone was aware of any cheaper units available. I'm not too concerned with price if it is less than $1k. I'll probably go with a good photo printer to support my other hobby anyway. 

Sure... if you can find white ink cartridges, make sure to let us know.

It's always funny when folks think they can print white when making your own decals. What's it gonna take to make people realize there's no such thing as white ink cartridges. It's impossible. The only way to do white is use white DECAL PAPER, not clear decal paper.

Any old printer is fine, and no there are not white printers, even a CMYK won't do that.

Your options are white decal film, or my preference is to paint the area of the decal white. I do that anyways for most larger solid kit decals, it helps make them pop. Then you can print on clear. Seal.

It's super easy to do. Photocopy the decal or print your art, tape it down on a cutting matt over a strip, or strips of tape larger than it. Cut out the outline, only just a bit smaller. Spray that area of the aircraft white (I use white primer for this reason). Put the decal mask on and go about the process of finish coats, leaving the mask on. Peal it off, apply decal, weather, done.

There's no such ink cartridges that print in white for a printer for home uses. As far as a new printer goes, as long as it's an inkjet printer. Read the reviews for any inkjet printer and choose what you can afford.

I have yet tried printing my own decals but I did buy some Try your own decal paper set from Micro Mark a year or so ago for laser printers. It comes with decal paper samples and spray adhesive. 

To to the poster who saw you can make your own decals using hairspray? I find it unbelievable and impossible to achieve. As Don had asked, what did they use for adhesive? Hairspray can wash off and I can't imagine the process does even works.

On a related note, has anyone tried printing their own decals? I have a couple sheets of the Testor's white and clear sheets for inkjets, but my printer is on the fritz...any suggestions for a new printer that does well for decals?

Biggest concern with most decals is that standard printers do not print white. The white decal sheets can help, but then you need to trim right the printed edge of your decal when cutting, which limits the utility for complex shapes. There are a few CMYW printers out there, but not sure how well they work or how well the black comes out. CMYKW printers seem very expensive (designed for print shops).

I'll check out the other options listed above, but having a home printer that can do the job would be nice since I seem to regularly wish I could make my own.

Kardar2

I am a newbie so I  might be a miss guided child LOL I was watching a video (yotube) where you can make your own   using hairspray. Looked really interesting. You can resize it to. What ever size you want.  I got to try it

 

What is the adhesive?

I am a newbie so I  might be a miss guided child LOL I was watching a video (yotube) where you can make your own   using hairspray. Looked really interesting. You can resize it to. What ever size you want.  I got to try it

Pawel

Nezih, you might also try Decalprint: http://www.decalprint.de/index.php/de/

They are closed for Christmas, but when they open, shipping to Istanbul should be a little cheaper. I also ordered from them and got nice decals, also with silver details. Good luck with your builds and have a nice day

Paweł

 

Nezih

Nezih, you might also try Decalprint: http://www.decalprint.de/index.php/de/

They are closed for Christmas, but when they open, shipping to Istanbul should be a little cheaper. I also ordered from them and got nice decals, also with silver details. Good luck with your builds and have a nice day

Paweł

Don Stauffer

Draw Decals has done some custom stuff.

 

Draw Decals has done some custom stuff.