The Official F-4 Phantom II Group Build 2011

Ken -- jeez, bad luck, mate. All that work and still to be stuck on the same detail... The more I hear about AM parts, the more I think it's better to close the lid and have done... The number of projects that have gone on the rocks at the cockpit and intakes stage is considerable. At least when instrument decals are too big for the panels, it's easy to shave away the excess when they're dry. Sure, they aren't in the same league as the PE, but by the same token they also cost nothing...

M/TB379

Here's the bright side Ken;

We got great tips from you as you learned to detail the photo etch.....lol

Bockscar

Ouch!

Remind me not to get an Aires resin cockpit set..... 

Yes, I am now wondering about the fit when installed in the kit.  I am going to check that out next before I get too much farther along.  Does anyone have any experience with the Aires cockpit for the 1/48 Hasegawa F-4E?

Ken

Ouch!

Remind me not to get an Aires resin cockpit set..... 

Hi Everyone,

Well, I am pissed off.    After finding that the color photo-etch that I had purchased was a little out of scale with the Aires cockpit I decided to go through the trouble of painting the non colored photo etch that came with the Aires cockpit.  I just took it for granted that photo-etch that came with the Aires cockpit would be the correct scale.  Wrong!  Apparently the Aires resin piece is the problem.  And I have a second Aires cockpit so I checked it.  It is the same size as the first.  All that time and effort just to end up with the same problem.    Time to drink beer and take a break.  I will deal with it tomorrow.

Ken

Greetings everyone,

Tonight I talked with Berny.  He told me he hasn't been here for the last few days because of a combination of nasty weather (he lives close to the lightning capitol of the world) and bad headaches.  He unplugs his computer when there is bad storms (a very smart move).  But he said he is doing better today.  He asked about what has been going on the last few days in this group build and I gave him a brief overview.

I touched up the photo-etch instrument panel and I am very happy with how it turned out.  I also painted the last coat of white on the resin piece for the background of the instrument dials.  I can't wait to put it all together to see the end result.  Here is a picture of the photo-etch:

Ken

Omar;

You can't possibly be building slower than me man.

I know, you are like me, a rivet specialist, so just work in an hour or so a week...lol...

Try and keep up to me pal, I may sprint in a year or two....lol....

Yeah, I had to skip a few weeks...lol...

Besides, it wouldn't be fair to deny us your updates man,...you just cannot drop out and go away....lol...my people will knock on your door at 2:00 am....lol....

Some assembly required -- you sure can, the Rhino Wing is always recruiting! I'll update p1 with your details. As I recall, VF-102 Diamondbacks transitioned from the -B to the -J and kept their markings in the process -- I can't swear to that without checking my references. I have the Hasegawa -J in their markings on its way, but I'm positive the old Revell kit wore that scheme and was officially a -B... Still, your kit is the -C/D, which is neither!

Omar -- sorry you're having such a hard go. I'm sure there's be a Rhinos III at some point, so if you wanted to put them away for the future...? That said, I hope you keep going!

Cheers, M/TB379

Hey some assembly,

Thanks for the encouragement.  I'll keep on keepin' on with these.  It just feels good to mitch and boan about it once in a while, ya know?  Anyway, I'll plug along in hopes of getting them done before the deadline. 

I don't know if I'm a masochist or crazy...or both!

-O

ortiz, hang in there man. you are one of the reasons i joined this GB. the J you did last time really stoked me to do one myself .Saying, that i made a mistake on my entry-- its not a b/c but a c/d.  sigh.... and...I cant use my afytermarket decals becuse they go to a J. the kit has some nice decals so ill just use them. but boy i want a diamond back phantom!! This my entry

Hey everyone,

I'm really having a tough go with this GB.  The first Phantom GB was a breeze compared to this one.  I did two Hase Phantoms and a Revellogram -J for the last one, and those three went so much smoother than these two.  I picked up the Revellogram -C hoping for a quick and easy build to distract me from the Hase -C, but man, the Revellogram -C's just as much work, if not more, than the scribe and rivet job on my Hase -C! 

The comparison between the Revellogram -J from last year and this Revellogram -C is interesting.  The Revellogram -C fuse is warped.  All the parts have thick flash, and the sprue attachment points are as thick as the sprue themselves!  Lets not even talk about parts fit.  The intake to fuse joint is terrible.  And in regards to fit issues, a quick dry-fit of the fuse halves and cockpit tub reveals the fit problems at the rear of the 'pit tub where the rear deck's supposed to make up part of the spine where the rear canopy attaches. 

With all the prep work involved (rivets and scribing on the Hase, and clean up on fit on the -C) I haven't even had the chance to spray any paint.  I tried to paint the tubs last week, but for some reason the paint never dried on the Hase tub, so I had to strip it.  I ended up stripping both, just in case it was a problem with my batch of paint. 

I'll try again later...if I don't decide to throw in the towel first.  The only thing that's keeping me motivated is the great work that's being posted here.  Guys, there is some nice stuff being shown.  I'm enjoying the builds!  Keep up the great work! 

Cheers,

-O

TB/379 i was wondering if i can jump in with an accurate min. 1/72 f4 b/c? ive just recieved aftermarket decals from aeromaster # 72-206. i cant wait to crack plastic, you all are just amazing.

Here's my Sunday Summary:

What it looked like:

Today's advance ('progress' is now a dirty word):

Once I get the J-79's done, I can glue the wing section in and shore up those nasty intake ducts......

Stay tuned, same scratch hour, same scratch channel....

Thunderbolt379

Ken -- remarkable technique! It looks amazing!

M/TB379

Thank you Mike, I appreciate the compliment!

Ken

Ken -- remarkable technique! It looks amazing!

M/TB379

Bockscar

Ladders - I managed to cut out and shape the last fuselage bulkhead in preparation for the J-79 scratch. I'll post a shot when I get the cans placed a little later.

Snakes - I had real difficulty shaping the intake ducts, I mentioned the thin plastic snapped and so I'm back to the snakes part of the game.

Hi Dom,

Sorry to hear about the intake ducts.  You were moving quite well on those.

Ken

Ladders - I managed to cut out and shape the last fuselage bulkhead in preparation for the J-79 scratch. I'll post a shot when I get the cans placed a little later.

Snakes - I had real difficulty shaping the intake ducts, I mentioned the thin plastic snapped and so I'm back to the snakes part of the game.

Thanks for the pointers Ken, saves a lot of experimentation. That is a nice little link too, very helpful.

One other note.  When I went to use the spreader to remove the grey from the raised detail, I taped the photo-etch directly to a hard surface without the paper towel underneath.  I don't know if that would make a difference, but I figured the hard surface was better to keep the photo-etch flat.

Ken

jimbot58

Ken, just looking at that makes my head hurt! I have some older kits with unpainted PE stuff in it and have put it off because of this. Don't know if I could master this or not!

Thank you for the compliments everyone.  Jim, I would give it a try.  If it doesn't look good when you are done, you can always strip the paint all the way off and try again.

Here is a picture of the glazing spreader I used:

And here is a picture of how I held it wrapped with the handkerchief damp with mineral spirits:

Just take your time and check it out as you go to see the progress.  This was my first try at it.  Also be sure to let the paint dry thoroughly between coats.  In the link I posted Robert did his in only two sessions, but I used different paint for the acrylic.  I wanted the clear to be completely cured to be sure it would hold up to the mineral spirits.

Ken

Hey Jim....practice on a few less worthy kits.....lol.....

Ken, just looking at that makes my head hurt! I have some older kits with unpainted PE stuff in it and have put it off because of this. Don't know if I could master this or not!

Ken:

Very persnickity work, but your patience has payed off, that looks great! -Thanks for the link and tips on the detailing.

Hi Everyone,

It is not finished, requires a little touch up, but it turned out so well that I just have to show it.  If you remember, I was taking a non-color photo-etch of the rear cockpit's front panel, and adding color.  Namely, grey and black.  The panel is supposed to be grey (FS36231), and the bezels around the gauges are supposed to be black.  I followed the instructions posted by Robert Kwikkel (http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/tnt1/001-100/TNT033_PE-Painting_Kwikkel/tnt033.htm).  First I cleaned the photo-etch using laquer thinner then masked off the panel that I was working with.  Then I applied Model Master Acryl flat black.  Here is a picture:

I let that dry for a couple of days, then I sprayed Model Master Acryl gloss clear.  I waited a couple more days for that to dry then I applied a second coat of clear.  Here is a picture:

After I let the second coat dry a couple of days, I sprayed the Xtracolor enamel FS16231 grey.  After a couple of days I sprayed a second coat of grey.  Here is a picture:

Then after letting that dry a couple of days, I took a small flat glazing spreader, wrapped a very light cotton handkerchief damp with mineral spirits, and began carefully scraping it across the photo etch.  It took a few strokes, but it finally took the grey paint off of the raised areas, exposing the black underneath.  Here is a picture:

The strip at the bottom of the panel had a large area without any instruments, so the grey was removed exposing the black where it should still be grey.  But I expected that since it was a large area without detail.  I will touch it up with some grey.  But check out how clean the gauge bezels look!  This is a great technique if you have the patience for such detail.

Ken

Ken: Wow! Good score on those journals! I hold a massive collection of 4 of those! Volumes 14, 15, 17, and 19. Wish I could have afforded more of those, but couldn't at the time!

Mike: Looking good! I can't seem to find the time to sit down at the desk these last few days! When I do, I seem to get very little done! You are a monster!

Wow TB379, that is some sharp work alright !! I should have waited a bit before I started my S, some good ideas I've seen on this Forum like painting the NMF before attaching the stabilizers etc. Would make masking easier. Once the S is done I might look into a larger scale

Some phabulous work on the honour wall too guys, not to mention the WIP's.

Not much to report on from here. No progress since my last post although I have a new office / hobby room which will make life easier ( the lock on the door will be great to keep the ankle biters out )

Ken:

You're a lucky guy! I have a pile of of weapons journals from the 80's, I'll see if I can dig them out.

Mike:

Single handedly re-opened the F-4 assembly line! Hey that cockpit looks far too neat & tidy.

Hi MIke,

Looks like you are full speed ahead with your assembly line.  Looking very nice so far! 

Ken

Ken -- you lucky sonofa... Enjoy those volumes, I salivate at the thought!

Today's progress:

I pressed on with the cockpit of the Hasegawa RF-4B, here she is mostly together:

The seats are just resting in place for the shot, they need some tape harnesses installing and their ejection pull rings painted and installed. The Hasegawa cockpit seems to have the same affliction as the earlier-tool Fujimi inasmuch as that the GIB has no eyeline over the cockpit sill, he is effectively 'down in the hole.' Ah well, there's less play in the parts in this one, the most I could do would be to shim the fit under the seat, and I'd need to be sure of the seat clearing the canopy to do that. Luckily the seats can go in from the top last thing before the canopy goes on, so I have that option.

I took another crack at the NMF areas, I sanded away the worst of the acrylic splotches and was about to go with enamels when I spotted the Talon acrylic I bought last year. Non-toxic, no thinning... I gave it another go. The result was almost as bad as last time, but now I have five sets of stabilators to sand back to bare plastic (the distributors decided not to bring Mr. Levelling Thinner into this country... GRRR). I turned up an ancient bottle of MM Chrome Silver, found a bit of sludge left in the bottom and was going to bin it, but thought what the hey, give it a go... Tamiya X-20 brought it back to life no questions asked, and it flowed onto the tail areas of five models (there's a Has -C that's not in this pic and which might become my sixth for this GB) with a smoothness that makes me lament the toxicity of these paints. See my blog for a full write-up...

Next -- I can start masking for the second metallic shade around the tails of at least some of these birds, and hopefully clean up the stabiliators for another pass with enamels. I'll get the cockpit into place on the RF, clean up the joints and attach the clear part of the recon nose. Then onto the intakes, and build up the body... I'll still put priority on the Fujimi -K, that one is closest the finish line and I would like to see her done in the quite near future.

Cheers, Mike

Hi Everyone,

I can't believe it.  I was just given the complete set of "World Air Power Journal" issues 1-43 including the indices.  In addition, I was also given the first 11 issues of "International Air Power Review".  I have only had a chance to scan a few pages so far, but there is a lot of color photographs along with detailed information.  Very, very cool.  The person that gave them to me is a member of the local chapter of IPMS.

Ken