The Official F-4 Phantom II Group Build 2011

Just a bit of progress the last few days, cleaned up a few blemishes on the "G" and then I put all the cockpit decals (Yeah, I know....DECALS! Remember it is an OOB build here....) in place on the "F". Also managed to paint the seat frames for it as well, but haven't done anything to the seat cushions yet.

I do have some questions concerning Navy Rhinos. I saw a bit of "Hanoi Hilton" and during the opening sequence they were showing the launching of a Phantom from the deck of a carrier. I know that they are launched using a kind of "sling" hooked to the plane's underside. When it launched, the sling could be clearly be seen flinging out over the sea. Were one of these lost during every Phantom launch?

Also they were attaching a tether to the back of the plane, which makes sense to me as you would need to keep tension on that sling or it would go slack and unhook when the pilot powered up and the plane would obviously roll forward. I was curious as to how this tether was released in coordination with the cat. Is it lost as well or what? It wasn't clear as to where the tether would hook up.

[View:/themes/fsm/utility/:550:0]Nothing wrong with decals Jimbot5, I'm nearly done with my pit, may add seatbelts but seats wont be going in 'til last. Carpet monster got one of the ejector pull loops? so I had to scratch one out of fine fishing line. [View:/themes/fsm/utility/:550:0]

Any suggestions before I lock it away in the fuselage ?

Man, I gotta work on my photography !

Last post for a while, got 24 ton of firewood logs being dropped of in the morning.

No play 'til the works done, besides I've never got a steady hand after a day on the chainsaw.

RAG

jimbot58

I do have some questions concerning Navy Rhinos. I saw a bit of "Hanoi Hilton" and during the opening sequence they were showing the launching of a Phantom from the deck of a carrier. I know that they are launched using a kind of "sling" hooked to the plane's underside. When it launched, the sling could be clearly be seen flinging out over the sea. Were one of these lost during every Phantom launch?

Also they were attaching a tether to the back of the plane, which makes sense to me as you would need to keep tension on that sling or it would go slack and unhook when the pilot powered up and the plane would obviously roll forward. I was curious as to how this tether was released in coordination with the cat. Is it lost as well or what? It wasn't clear as to where the tether would hook up.

The launch cable connected to notches in the shuttle launch.  It is connected to hooks under the F-4, located under the fuselage just aft and inboard of the intakes.  On launch, the launch cable would be caught by nets located forward, off of the bow of the ship.  Some people assume the nets are ramps used as a sort of jump ramp for takeoff. 

The hold back cable was hooked to the nose gear hold back ring.  Slack would be taken out of the launch cable with the hold back cable keeping the jet in position.  After powering up for launch with both cables tight, the cat would fire.  A bolt on the hold back cable would shear, seperating it from the nose gear.  The hold back cable could then be used over and over, just by replacing the shear bolt. 

Were the office decals included in the kit or did you pick them up AM?  Looks fantastic.

Rough as guts

[View:/themes/fsm/utility/:550:0]Nothing wrong with decals Jimbot5, I'm nearly done with my pit, may add seatbelts but seats wont be going in 'til last. Carpet monster got one of the ejector pull loops? so I had to scratch one out of fine fishing line. [View:/themes/fsm/utility/:550:0]

Any suggestions before I lock it away in the fuselage ?

Man, I gotta work on my photography !

Last post for a while, got 24 ton of firewood logs being dropped of in the morning.

No play 'til the works done, besides I've never got a steady hand after a day on the chainsaw.

RAG

 

Rough as guts

 

Any suggestions before I lock it away in the fuselage ?

Man, I gotta work on my photography !

RAG

 

Repaint the Drogue Chute OD or Olive Green.  It should not be red.  The drogue chute housing should be black, again not red.  You might want to consider adding the lower eject ring on the seats if you will have the canopies open. 

those bridles are pretty complicated, for a simple system, that is

when an early jet like the Phantom and Skyhawk, etc, are all hooked up ready for launch, they look almost like they are tied down to the deck for storage

the Bridle attached as Bernie said, each end on a heavy hook on the aircraft,,,,,looped over the Cat Shuttle,,,,,then there is a tether attached to each Bridle,,,,,,,with the hold back cable attached with it's aircraft specific shear bolt,,,,,,,,at launch, the shear bolt breaks, leaving that cable behind for the deck crew to remove from the slot it's attached to next to the Cat Track,,,,,,a new one is used each launch, and each is inspected before another use,,,,,,,the Bridle falls away from the aircraft, and is caught around the Van Velm Bridle Arrestor (those horns at the front of the carrier),,,,the netting is for catching a crewman that may fall, just like around the rest of the flight deck,,,,,the Bridle is then picked up, and also set aside,,,,,a different Bridle used for the next launch

we used to poke fun at the "dumb lil Dixie Cup  yellow shirts",,,,,,but, those kids had to hook the hold back into the correct slot, with the correct bolt,,,,,and hook the Bridle and tether up,,,,,,,and retrieve everything, and sort those out for inspection and re use,,,,,,,,,for every different aircraft and launch combination,,,,,,,all while the ship steams into the wind at 30+ knots, with jets and props all over the place to hurt them in one way or another,,,,,,,oh, and with all the people yelling info to them as they went about their business,,,,,,,,only one or two years out of high school

nothing but respect for those kids from me (and the poor little hook runners, also),,,,,,,they had guts, that's for sure

Tommy did a write up on some of this during a similar convo on another site

http://thanlont.blogspot.com/

Rex

Thanks Rex.  You explained it much better than I did.  I have been told by many Navy deck crewmen that the most dangerious job on the flight deck is the man that unhooks the arresting cable from the hook after landing.  A very close friend of mine told me he saw a cable break and cut the deck man in half. 

I think everyone involved in NavAir either knew a hook runner that got injured or knows someone that knew one

one of the worst jobs I can think of,,,,,,,done by kids,,,,,,,and just look at where McDonnell put the hook, geeez

as a card carrying Auld Phart, I am now the most soft spoken Jarhead you'd ever meet in person, and I try to be that way on the message boards too,,,,,,,,,,I have about 10,000 insults to try and make up for from my "Lance General" days, lol,,,,I didn't really mature until I hit E-4

yup, still gonna make Air Farce jokes, call Swabbies names like Dixie Cups, etc, etc,,,,,,but, all in fun nowadays, knowing that all of you have nicknames for Marines, too,,,,,,,Anne was SSgt in the Army, her son is a career bubblehead in the Navy,,,,,,,my brother was Air Force at George and Luke (or the other way around, I forget),,,,,,,,,lots of teasing to give and to receive,,,,,,but all in fun now

back to modeling, though,,,,,,,,,,,I have almost decided which thin wing aircraft to build from those different moldings,,,,,,been plugging away at cockpits for them,,,,,,,and coming up with a way to do some painting indoors during the winter,,,,,,I think I have a method that will work to get all 6 cockpits done without sending Anne to the hospital from fumes

I'll post a pic when I get to a good point with them

REx

I know what you mean Rex.  I have taken a lot of jokes being a retired Air Farce Force E-8.  As long as it is done in fun, I don't mind.  What gets to me is someone that has never worn a uniform that cut us down.  As far as I am concerned, if you wore the uniform, it gives you the right to joke about the other service members.  As one Marine told me, "We may call each other names, but we will always stand shoulder to shoulder in a fight".

A name we had for the Navy was "Anchor Clanker". 

OBTW, I am working on my kit.  Right now I am soaking all the resin parts in dish washing liquid and hot water.   

here's a little in progress that hopefully will make some of you laugh,,,,,,I know I did, at myself

I know, not funny yet,,,,,,except,,,,,the "in focus" top shot of the Monogram 1/72 cockpit that I "steal" for my "lessor moldings" is after one coat of Aleene's tacky glue mixed with water to give the craft paint something to adhere to, and one coat of Americana Slate Grey mixed with Testors Acrylic thinner and a drop of Anita's Extender, to give more working time

that Slate Grey is just a tad lighter than MM's Dk Gull Grey Acrylic,,,,,cool, eh?

but, argggggg,,,,,,,the blurry second photo is the unpainted plastic in the F-4J kit,,,,,,,,two coats of "stuff",,,,,and it's the same exact color as the kit plastic

the other photo is one from a very old Reader's Digest showing an F-4 running a heart to a transplant hospital

I broke my new year's resolution already,,,,,promised out 15 Skyhawks by the Omaha Nats, a side by side review of all 1/72 F-8 moldings,,,,started a resto on my first model (F4U, ancient Revell),,,,,,,and joined this Phantom Group Build, with 6 models,,,,,,,,all while trying to come up with a paint combo that won't make Anne get headaches

lol, I'll learn someday

Rex

oh, that will not be the way I end up doing them,,,,,,,I'll assemble all 6 before I use them,,,,,,,I just had to use something for paint adhesion tests, and chose that to do it with

I'm going to do them "like an 8 year old",,,,glue them all together, and then do the "glue wash", then the Dk Gull Gray, then the detail colors

then I can pop them into the modified fuselages, after trimming the various kits,,,,,,and get on with the sealing and sanding, etc,,,,,stuff I can do while I wait for it to warm up here

and yes, it does look a whole lot like the modern Haze Gray that the Little Rock is painted,,,,something else to keep in mind for whenever I get back to finishing up a bunch of my tiny 1/700 ship fleet

Rex

Hi everyone ;

I ordered some Hi-Decal 1/72 RF-4C[2003] and F-4E Phantom[1998] decals for the "ROK" South Korean Air Force .

 I was thinking of using Fujimi's 1/72 F-4E and RF-4E Phantom kits however I noticed the the outer wing section are unslatted on Fujimi's kit , there is a choice of slatted and unslatted tail planes though .

Anyway , does any one have any info if the ROK Phantoms had slatted wings or unslatted .

Hasegawa's inexpensive 1/72 F-4E kits have slatted outer wings , I have a few of those kits and I could cut the outer wing section from a couple of  kits if I need too .

I gratefully appreciate any help ....

                             John .

berny13 and others: Thanks for the info-interesting stuff!

The Geasel is gaining some camo paint now, while the bottom of the "F" has all hardpoints drilled but still needs a bit of cleaning where those extra antennas had to be removed.

:

Helo H-34

Hi everyone ;

I ordered some Hi-Decal 1/72 RF-4C[2003] and F-4E Phantom[1998] decals for the "ROK" South Korean Air Force .

 I was thinking of using Fujimi's 1/72 F-4E and RF-4E Phantom kits however I noticed the the outer wing section are unslatted on Fujimi's kit , there is a choice of slatted and unslatted tail planes though .

Anyway , does any one have any info if the ROK Phantoms had slatted wings or unslatted .

Hasegawa's inexpensive 1/72 F-4E kits have slatted outer wings , I have a few of those kits and I could cut the outer wing section from a couple of  kits if I need too .

I gratefully appreciate any help ....

                             John .

The ROK Air Force RF-4C Phantoms are ex USAF stock and as such all are un slatted Hard Wing.  None have the slotted stab.  The ROKAF F-4E, some were ex USAF aircraft but the majority were direct factory delivery and all had the slatted soft wing.  All have the slotted stab.  Check your reference on which F-4E you are building because not all ROK aircraft had the TISEO.

These are quite old, but it will give you a look at how to load up the F-4.

thanks Berny

gotta like a guy that dangles vintage TO's at ya, lol

I only had one of those 3 pages before,,,,always good to have more of them,,,,,,especially for a "weapons on pylons" nut like me

thanks again

Rex

I'm having issues finding out exactly what load outs are appropriate for my RAF FGR.2.  Does anyone have any info on what the typical stores load would be on one of them?  Also, does anyone know exactly what color green is used in an RAF cockpit?  I have seen a few MM paints called RAF Interior Green, and RAF Cockpit Green, but they don't look exactly like some of the images I have seen of an RAF cockpit should look like.

I am at least having plenty of time to work on the ejection seats.  The detail on the seats is tiny, and  am having trouble doing the detail painting.  I just can't find a brush fine enough, and a needle doesn't want to work either.  I think I am going to have to get my Daughter the artist involved in this one. lol

Have a great day everyone.

Rich

TarnShip

oh, that will not be the way I end up doing them,,,,,,,I'll assemble all 6 before I use them,,,,,,,I just had to use something for paint adhesion tests, and chose that to do it with

I'm going to do them "like an 8 year old",,,,glue them all together, and then do the "glue wash", then the Dk Gull Gray, then the detail colors

then I can pop them into the modified fuselages, after trimming the various kits,,,,,,and get on with the sealing and sanding, etc,,,,,stuff I can do while I wait for it to warm up here

and yes, it does look a whole lot like the modern Haze Gray that the Little Rock is painted,,,,something else to keep in mind for whenever I get back to finishing up a bunch of my tiny 1/700 ship fleet

Rex

Thanks TarnShip.

Sparrowhyperion

I'm having issues finding out exactly what load outs are appropriate for my RAF FGR.2.  Does anyone have any info on what the typical stores load would be on one of them?   

Have a great day everyone.

 

Rich

Take a look at this one.

Thanks for the image.  Now I just have to figure out what those are and what kinds of pylons they use lol.

Rich

Thank's for the info Berny .

I didn't realize that some Fujimi 1/72 F-4E kits have the slatted soft wing , the first one I grabbed from my stash didn't have the extended wing slats but I checked another one and it has , so I would like to join in with two Fujimi Phantoms , RF-4C and F-4E ,

For decal markings I'll be using Hi-decals RF-4/F-4 ROK air force ,

I'm going to be using low-viz insignia's from a couple of KF-16C kits to replace the hi-viz ones on the decal sheet .

I'll make a start today .

                            John .

Berny -- thanks for posting those loading charts, they're amazing!

Rich -- the RAF interior green from Humbrol and MM is the WWII shade, a cooler, darker green than USAAF interior green. Thinking back on the FGR.2 at Hendon, I think the cockpit was either grey or black. I'll check my cockpit flash shots later, and try to post them.

Helo H-34 -- page 1 updated! Watch out for fit around the cockpit/lower fuselage parts and the main wing junctures.

Cheers, Mike/TB379

Thunderbolt got my kit today its a 1/48 Revell Germany C/D Phantom II. And I see I am up against a few very talented builders with the same kit, hope I can keep up with them.

Service message -- could we maintain the standard thead name? It just keeps it clerarer when you look at the morning's slew of forum posts, as to what's happening on the boards. Please post on from here rather than selecting "reply" on previous posts carrying the alternate title.

Cheers, Mike/TB379

Rich, all that stuff is available in 1/72,,,I have no idea where to get them all in 1/48, though

the missiles are UK's Sky Flash upgrade for the Sparrow, same dimensions, etc

the Recce pod is an EMI for the F-4M RAF

the "bombs" are Hunting BL 755 CBU Cluster Bombs, mounted on TER in "slant 2"

all the racks and pylons are the same as the USN versions

another option for the inner wing pylons is TER with 2 Matra 155 19 tube rocket launchers,,,they would mount  per TER, with the bottom empty

I figured the names would help you search for this stuff, if you wanted to build it

heh, didn't see that while I was typing, sorry Mike

Rex

Randy -- page 1 updated.

Rex -- no worries!

Cheers, Mike/TB379

Thanks. That helps a lot.  Looks like I'll be doing another hunting safari on eBay... lol

I swear, just when I think   have everything lined up for this build, something else crops up.

Rich

Mike, I have my list ready (finally, I know)

Fujimi F-4B NL-100 VF-51

Fujimi F-4B DR-4 VMFA-312

Hasegawa F-4B AG-208 VF-84

old Revell QF-4B #42

old Hasegawa YF-4J prototype

Eastern Express QF-4N #145

all of these are thin winged, and chosen to do some of the different nose and tail combos,,,,and I needed the YF-4J for a "ringer" on another list