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Falklands/Malvinas War 30th Anniversary GB

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  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Tuesday, May 24, 2011 7:29 AM

jetmoderler is looking at starting a Harrier GB and cross overs are allowed. He is looking at getting Harriers in all their guises and is looking at starting once it gets enough interest. DSo if any of you guys building Harriers fancy earning another GB badge for you build, take a look. Hopefully others will join in with none British aircraft.

/forums/t/138228.aspx

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Tuesday, May 24, 2011 4:32 AM

dupes, does the helmit have bulgded sides to fit a headset underneath. If so this is a standard AFV crew helmit and should be fine. Love these things. Warrior crews don't get issued them but i was lucky enough to have one that i wore all the time when i was driving.

bondo, i would appreciate that. The name rings a bell but i am not sure where it is.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    November 2006
  • From: Coastal Maine
Posted by dupes on Monday, May 23, 2011 8:54 PM

That is SPECTACULAR! Man, I feel like I should just send my whole project your way and let you wrap it up for me...Stick out tongue Talk about a comprehensive tutorial. Wow.

Should have my new card reader in the next day or two - want to get a pic of the one bloke that I'd really like to use from the Cromwell set if his helmet looks right...if I can keep from shelling out $25+ with shipping from Accurate Armour, that would be best! That, and if I order the figs, I'll want to order the fire extinguishers, and if I'm getting them, I'll want to get the resin track set...see where I'm headed with this? Heh.

  • Member since
    April 2010
  • From: Lexington, VA
Posted by USAFSPOOK on Monday, May 23, 2011 8:41 PM

Hey Dupes!  Found what you need!  Go to Armorama.com.  Where they have a search box at the top of the page, type in the name David Blacker, have it search the Armorama site; a list of articles written by him will appear, click on the one about painting British and Pakistani uniforms in DPM.  It is excellent, with many in-progress photos that are about the best around for this pattern.  This should get you all you need!!  Good luck!!  

  • Member since
    March 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Monday, May 23, 2011 8:16 PM

Thanks Jere, which led a google search that dug up a website I had not known of.

http://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=54687

BTW they have it as XZ451.

Trying to find a map of drone hill. Bishie I'll send it to you if I find it.

  • Member since
    April 2010
  • From: Lexington, VA
Posted by USAFSPOOK on Monday, May 23, 2011 8:07 PM

dupes

Egads! Started the google-research on DPM Camouflage...wish I hadn't! That's going to be tough to paint.

Wiki Pic

Any idea if the colors in there have FS equivalents?

Colours are pretty close to the three colours used for late  WWII German armour--sand base with medium green and red-brown camo patterns.  DPM also has black splashes as well.  The sand colour could be toned down to an almost tan or even use tan, maybe with a hint of green; brown does not need to have a strong red tone either.    I'm an old timer and still use Humbrol enamels, using their recommended colours for German armour; also have actual garments to match to.  If you are using Tamiya or water based, I do not know what to use, but maybe start with their recommended colours for WWII German and go from there.  If you still have some woodland BDUs, those colours are pretty close as well.  The pattern is what will set them apart and is the tricky part.  If I remember correctly, someone did a tutorial on painting the DPM pattern on the Armorama website in the figures section;will try to locate it.  I'll be back.... 

  • Member since
    January 2003
Posted by el_jere on Monday, May 23, 2011 6:22 AM

Hi there guys,

Sorry to jump out late (I don´t know if already discuss this) with this but I haden´t time to be around the forum so much (either with the Etendard LOL)

The Pucara A-511 with the Mayor Tomba as a pilot, was shot down by the Sea Harrier XZ541, afer 3 runs of cannons fire. It charshed near Drone Hill.

Best regards

 

Jere

 

ps: guys, great advances so far with the projets!

Res non verba

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Sunday, May 22, 2011 5:05 PM

vance, i have checked my xtracolor paints, and RLM 75 looks just a tad lighter than DSG, so i reckon allowing for scale effect you could get away with. Of course that assuming you RLM 75 is the same as mine lol.

Mike, i ahve been checking some pics. Is the scheme you are thikning of white? undersides and EDSG? on top. I agree it deffinatly has a blue tint to it. But i think Vance may be doing an all over grey, which from looking at pics looks like the DSG i have. I have a pic of a Sea Harrier on Illustrious and the caption says 83. There is land in the background with lots of snow on it, which would put it a year after the war. The question is, when was the switch made from the two colour to one colour scheme.

Azorean, bsyamato, some great detailing there guys. Nice work.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    October 2008
  • From: italy
Posted by bsyamato on Sunday, May 22, 2011 3:56 PM

Great start Azorean Yes

At the end successfull fitted the seat with the new scratched cockpit on the gr3, but some lateral ej seats was lost, not in picture but the rear cockpit bulkhead was removed.

on super etendard last works before to close fuselage

that's all

  • Member since
    December 2009
  • From: San Miguel Island, Azores, Portugal
Posted by Azorean on Sunday, May 22, 2011 2:38 PM

A little scratch in the interior.

  • Member since
    April 2005
Posted by Thunderbolt379 on Sunday, May 22, 2011 7:41 AM

Bish -- thanks for confirming this, I figured it was probably a close match. Gunze 333 is said to be an exact match but not easy to get hold of. I've always felt EDSG had a blueish element, but that could be reflective, photos and artwork always seem to have that blue element but the pure paint in other lighting conditions lacks it.

Now checking my literature for which shade the Sea Harriers received overall, DSG or EDSG...

Cheers, M/TB379

http://worldinminiature.blogspot.com/

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Sunday, May 22, 2011 4:28 AM

Azorean, great to see another kit started, some nice work so far, look forward to some more.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Sunday, May 22, 2011 4:24 AM

Vance, sorry had hidden myself in the bunker cut off from the world. But seems there was no need. SOOOOO dissapointed.

Mike, modern British aircrfat are not really my area, especially when it comes to colours. Ask me what RLM schemes where worn in 1942 and i can help.  I can't find anything on line which says which colour they were. But Vance, i came across this which will hopefully help. You have to scroll down towards the bottom.  Gives you the FS equvalants and what Humbrol and tamiya paints which match them. And yep, tamiya XF-63 matches Extra Dark Sea Grey.

http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/colorcharts/stuff_eng_colorcharts_uk.htm

Mike, 63 is German Grey isn't it, its been a while since i seen my paints lol.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    December 2009
  • From: San Miguel Island, Azores, Portugal
Posted by Azorean on Sunday, May 22, 2011 3:42 AM

Early developments on the Twin Otter:

 I made the gap between the cockpit and cabin load.

Open the air inlets of the engines.


  • Member since
    April 2005
Posted by Thunderbolt379 on Sunday, May 22, 2011 3:01 AM

Bish -- I thought I read somewhere the Sea Harriers were in Extra Dark Sea Grey, same as the RN Phantoms of the day... I was fixing to use Panzer Grey as a base for it, and tint as necessary to get something that looks close to photos... Would appreciate your evaluation too!

Cheers, Mike/TB379

http://worldinminiature.blogspot.com/

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Rothesay, NB Canada
Posted by VanceCrozier on Saturday, May 21, 2011 3:23 PM

dupes

Egads! Started the google-research on DPM Camouflage...wish I hadn't! That's going to be tough to paint.

Wiki Pic

Any idea if the colors in there have FS equivalents?

I seem to remember some Japanes armour with that crazy polka-dot pattern in your past...  You're a glutton for punishment aren't you!

Bish, good to see you're still with us. Apparently that "end of the world" talk was a bit off.

On the bench: Airfix 1/72 Wildcat; Airfix 1/72 Vampire T11; Airfix 1/72 Fouga Magister

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Saturday, May 21, 2011 12:56 PM

ye, it does look a bit awkward to paint, and thats even after having done SS camo. I would go for tamiya paints myself.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    November 2006
  • From: Coastal Maine
Posted by dupes on Saturday, May 21, 2011 11:50 AM

Egads! Started the google-research on DPM Camouflage...wish I hadn't! That's going to be tough to paint.

Wiki Pic

Any idea if the colors in there have FS equivalents?

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Rothesay, NB Canada
Posted by VanceCrozier on Saturday, May 21, 2011 11:39 AM

Bish

I am not 100% certain, but i think i have some Xtracolour Dark Sea grey. When i get to camp tomorrow, IF i have it, i will compare it to the RLM 75.

Yes

On the bench: Airfix 1/72 Wildcat; Airfix 1/72 Vampire T11; Airfix 1/72 Fouga Magister

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Saturday, May 21, 2011 10:28 AM

I am not 100% certain, but i think i have some Xtracolour Dark Sea grey. When i get to camp tomorrow, IF i have it, i will compare it to the RLM 75.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Rothesay, NB Canada
Posted by VanceCrozier on Saturday, May 21, 2011 10:22 AM

OK, colour question - I no longer have the benefit of a hobby shop across the road. Considering the "scale effect", do you think RLM 75 grau-violett is close enough to RN Dark Sea Gray?? Or should I be mixing up a special formula? ( I suppose a dark wash afterwards would help as well - I may be alright with supplies on-hand...)

On the bench: Airfix 1/72 Wildcat; Airfix 1/72 Vampire T11; Airfix 1/72 Fouga Magister

  • Member since
    November 2006
  • From: Coastal Maine
Posted by dupes on Friday, May 20, 2011 7:18 PM

Re: Cromwell figs - got them in with the Scimitar I purchased at a show! They're great figs, but obviously the wrong time frame. I ALSO got some Castoff Resin guys with it - I may have to dig them out to see what they're about. So is Cromwell out of business?

Re: Accurate Armour - well lookee there! I've been meaning to get some stuff from them anyway (some of it for this Scimitar!) so this may push me over the edge. Don't know what that's going to do to my completion date, but it's a long GB, right?

Re: Goodfellow - I can TOTALLY see that happening! Man, can't believe it was 17 years ago I was stationed there. Wow. So long, in fact, I don't remember the name of the bar outside of post we used to go play darts at. Hmmmmm.

 

 

  • Member since
    April 2010
  • From: Lexington, VA
Posted by USAFSPOOK on Friday, May 20, 2011 6:50 PM

Bish, Strange site indeed!  Came up in French!  Have been trying to find a listing of those models; had no idea they were so much (especially when translating to our weak dollar!), though the quality from what I have seen and read is excellent.

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Friday, May 20, 2011 6:17 PM

SPOOKS, sorry, missed your second post on the M16's. I have no idea why those guys would be carrying them. Would make an interesting scene. And good point you made about the helmits, i had forgotten about those.

The only place i found Cromwell figures was here.

http://www.tsahal-miniature.com/cromwell.liste.prix.html

Its a bit odd because it seems to be an Israli site but the prices are in £sterling and the address is in the UK. And tehres an address at the bottom for Cromwell Model productions. But no photos.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    April 2010
  • From: Lexington, VA
Posted by USAFSPOOK on Friday, May 20, 2011 6:16 PM

Dupes  UPDATE:  Accurate Armour does have a set specifically for the CVR in the proper helmets and in CW hats!!  Set is FS 03 and are 1/2 figures.  Should be exactly what you need!!  

  • Member since
    April 2010
  • From: Lexington, VA
Posted by USAFSPOOK on Friday, May 20, 2011 6:04 PM

dupes

 USAFSPOOK:
Dupes, do you want a book to use or will a website be sufficient?  If you only need to see the pattern used, you can google 'DPM camoflague' and will get several useful articles; wikipedia had a good overall history of DPM camo ( a few mistakes in it) and a few good colour photos of the pattern.  Since I see you live in the U.S., you can check with a store called the Sportsman's Guide; they usually have DPM jackets on sale at very cheap prices that are of the colouration suitable for the Falklands era--I even managed to get an early 68 pattern from them (they didn't know it!).  As far as books go, I would highly recommend Osprey's Men-At-Arms Series #133 Battle for the Falklands (1) Land Forces.  It gives an excellent rundown on the uniform items used in the campaign on both sides, but especially the British.  It has some excellent photos (although in B&W) and some of Mike Chappell's best plates on British uniforms I have seen.  This book is usually on E-Bay-- I bought an extra one just to keep on my workbench.  The colours I use for DPM are close to those used for the 3-colours used for late WWII German Armour, though DPM has black added to it and the base sand colour could be toned down a bit .  The DPM colours have had different tints in them over the years, and the early polyester jungle uniforms had some really strange colours in them, especially the brown, but there is almost no variation between fabrics today.  Another cheap but accurate source for photos is from a surplus store in London called Silverman's; I believe it is www.Military.co.uk; will have to check.  They usually have colour pictures of available DPM uniforms, often including original Falklands era parkas.  Do you have figures already picked out?  If not, let me know I can make some suggestions.  Most on market are in current uniforms/headgear; helmets in Falklands era much different than today's.  Long answer, hope some of it useful.         

 

 

Spectacular! If this doesn't get me a decent pic to work off of, nothing will! Big Smile

As far as figs - I'm planning on using some Cromwell chaps...looks like it's set CF-12 (handwritten), which says "Gulf CVR Crew" (also handwritten). Was hoping that 1991 wasn't too far after to have incorporated too many uniform changes.

Re: Goodfellow AFB - I was there in 1994, not too long after you! I was Army, not Air Force, so infer what you will about me being a "USARMYSPOOK". Heh.

Dupes, Where are you getting Cromwell figures from?  I have been trying to get in contact with Gordon Brown for several months with no luck(please, no cromwell bashing on this site, please) to answer a message he sent me.  I have not seen those figures, but helmets had pretty much changed over by 91; the earlier British CVC helmets were much like our helmets that we had during Vietnam and during early 80s; actually saw one of these British helmets for sale on E-Bay;  they look like the old 30s era football helmets to me!  I cannot think of any sets that have proper helmets; many did wear berets with headphones, though probably not in combat.   Will keep looking though.  Have another Goodfellow AFB story--Army related; when I was there, I used to get up and jog around the track at the same time (0 dark thirty) that the Army enlisted detatchment did.  One morning an NCO started yelling at me for running the wrong way, etc., etc.;  had to convince him I was actually an AF O-3 actually working out on my own!!   Started carrying my ID card all the time after that!  Glad to have contacted you!!  

  • Member since
    November 2006
  • From: Coastal Maine
Posted by dupes on Friday, May 20, 2011 6:01 PM

Hmmmm. I'll have to take a closer look. Also was unable to find a pic of them online (did Cromwell fold up? or just never have their own website?).

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Posted by Bish on Friday, May 20, 2011 5:41 PM

dupes, i found those figures, but the site doesn't have any photos. the only concern i would have is that they would be in desert combats. The troops in the Gulf would have been issued warm weather gear for night time i would imagine, do they look like thats what they are wearing. The Falklands in April/may is coming into winter, and its pretty damn cold with extremly strong cold winds.

I am a Norfolk man and i glory in being so

 

On the bench: Airfix 1/72nd Harrier GR.3/Fujimi 1/72nd Ju 87D-3

  • Member since
    April 2010
  • From: Lexington, VA
Posted by USAFSPOOK on Friday, May 20, 2011 5:40 PM

Bish

Yep, its Green Slime in the Army as well. As for Northern Ireland, do you know i can't recall if we wore lightweights or combats on the streets. I know we wore light weights when on guard duty. We may have worn them when on patrol, but honestly can't remember, it was nearly 20 years ago. Will have to try and find some photos. As far as i am aware, light weights ain't issued any more, they certainly ain't worn. I think i still have my 3 sets somewhere. The M16's is an interesting one. I have no idea. As you know, our main rifle at the time was the SLR, 7.62mm. You could be right about the mountain warfare cadre. where these the standard long M16, or the shorter carbine version as they would make sense if they were carried while climbing.

M16s were standard length, not short ones, though I have seen current photos (well, during 90s) of RMs using short length, collapsible stock version.  Also seemed to have 20 round mags, not 30 round.  Have thought of doing a 1/35 RM figure by Kirin carrying M16 for "something completely different".  

  • Member since
    November 2006
  • From: Coastal Maine
Posted by dupes on Friday, May 20, 2011 5:35 PM

USAFSPOOK
Dupes, do you want a book to use or will a website be sufficient?  If you only need to see the pattern used, you can google 'DPM camoflague' and will get several useful articles; wikipedia had a good overall history of DPM camo ( a few mistakes in it) and a few good colour photos of the pattern.  Since I see you live in the U.S., you can check with a store called the Sportsman's Guide; they usually have DPM jackets on sale at very cheap prices that are of the colouration suitable for the Falklands era--I even managed to get an early 68 pattern from them (they didn't know it!).  As far as books go, I would highly recommend Osprey's Men-At-Arms Series #133 Battle for the Falklands (1) Land Forces.  It gives an excellent rundown on the uniform items used in the campaign on both sides, but especially the British.  It has some excellent photos (although in B&W) and some of Mike Chappell's best plates on British uniforms I have seen.  This book is usually on E-Bay-- I bought an extra one just to keep on my workbench.  The colours I use for DPM are close to those used for the 3-colours used for late WWII German Armour, though DPM has black added to it and the base sand colour could be toned down a bit .  The DPM colours have had different tints in them over the years, and the early polyester jungle uniforms had some really strange colours in them, especially the brown, but there is almost no variation between fabrics today.  Another cheap but accurate source for photos is from a surplus store in London called Silverman's; I believe it is www.Military.co.uk; will have to check.  They usually have colour pictures of available DPM uniforms, often including original Falklands era parkas.  Do you have figures already picked out?  If not, let me know I can make some suggestions.  Most on market are in current uniforms/headgear; helmets in Falklands era much different than today's.  Long answer, hope some of it useful.         

 

Spectacular! If this doesn't get me a decent pic to work off of, nothing will! Big Smile

As far as figs - I'm planning on using some Cromwell chaps...looks like it's set CF-12 (handwritten), which says "Gulf CVR Crew" (also handwritten). Was hoping that 1991 wasn't too far after to have incorporated too many uniform changes.

Re: Goodfellow AFB - I was there in 1994, not too long after you! I was Army, not Air Force, so infer what you will about me being a "USARMYSPOOK". Heh.

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