The group build to end all group builds - THE GREAT WAR

Well the second figure is very close to being done.  Here are a couple pics before adding the helmet and rifle.  Still need to make the straps for those two items and have an Aber fret on order for that purpose.

While waiting for that to arrive, been looking at my stash of unbuilt kits.  So Marc, can you put me down for Eduard's 1/72 scale Fokker DrI.

regards,

Jack

This is the thread I use. Uni Caenis. I miked it at abt .002 in. I'm still on my first spool, but next time I'll buy a couple (cheap!). Comes in a couple of days.

http://www.jsflyfishing.com/cgi-bin/item/TW-030020-0000/57000/UNI-Products-Caenis-Thread.html

Marc - I'm going to make it official - put me down for another Pup, please! This one's going to be a night trainer with the RFC and a really wild scheme (for the Brits):

I was going to build something else, but I've made enough mistakes and learned so many lessons with this Pup that I know I could give another a much better go.

This one'll probably be a slow build...but we're going to be moving in probably early December, and rigging strikes me as something I could do without much of a bench, once the rest gets packed away...

Man, I gotta start paying attention...

Welcome to the GB Heavens Eagle.  That little chart is handy.  Could have used that a few weeks ago.

I will update the roster bondman.  Let's see some pics when you get the chance.  Who makes the kit?

Well, I went to the fly tying store and ask for Unimono thread.  They did not have it but they did have an actual thread made by Uni.  It came in gray and thought I'd give it a try.  It looked thin but held next to the Ultra Wire and some invisible thread it looked just about right.  The invisible thread looks to thin for 1/32 and scale to only 1/8".  The Uni thread may be as thin but it "looks" thicker. 

I did the LG last night and it looks great. Pics to follow.  And easy to work with?  OMG! Once the thread is looped back through the tube just a tug on the loose end and the tube slides up almost by itself and gets nice and snug. 

Wingnut- may I add another model, and start it first?

The 1/350 SMS Dresden, sole survivor of the Battle of the Falkland Islands.

Actually, I've started her. Hope to post some pictures by Sunday afternoon.

Here's where it's at now. The struts aren't glued...and honestly the fit is so snug I'm debating not gluing them at all. If I do, it'll be with Gator's Grip so they have a bit of elasticity.

I haven't been gluing them recently either - the rigging will hold the wing in place & if for some reason you have to take the wing off down the road.... 

-sean

Thanks Marc. Weird that there are no control horns on the rudder. The Pup has two, way down by the tail skid. They dump back into the fuselage after a pretty short distance, but that extra bit of leverage seems like it would be kind of a big deal. 

I'm still worried about tugging on the fiddly bits, not to mention "double-rigging" most of the control horns, but I think I'm finally developing a workable plan.

u-69 - you sold me on the uni-mono. The monofilament fishing line I was working with for the cockpit rigging was already quite thin, but did not take color well at all, be it paint or sharpie. 

Pupdate - Construction is very nearly complete. I have to finish painting the padded windscreen, attach it and the MG, and one small PE bit. And paint the metal border of the step up. I'm debating whether I want to add dirt and such now, or wait until after rigging. 

Here's where it's at now. The struts aren't glued...and honestly the fit is so snug I'm debating not gluing them at all. If I do, it'll be with Gator's Grip so they have a bit of elasticity.

DoogsATX

Marc - That thing gets prettier with every pic! How are you finding rigging the control horns? I'm concerned about knocking or pulling them off. Those and the ailerons. And the rudder. And the landing gear...

Sorry doogs, missed that first time around.  The rudder doesn't have control horns but there is a shaft at the front edge that goes down into the fuselage.  I assumed that meant the cables is inside for that part. 

For the elevator horns, I glued a tiny piece of tubing to each end.  Since I was using the wire it was easy to get it straight and glue one end into the holes made in the tail.  The other end had an eyelet with a long tail fed through the tube on the horn.  The tail was pulled to take up and slack there may he been in the wire, glued and the excess clipped.

The ailerons only have 1 cable that runs down into the lower wing so I drilled a hole through the lower wing.  The cable will be pulled taught through the hole, clipped flush with the bottom of the wing and a small disk punch of matching decal color to cover the spot.

wing_nut

That tank is looking fan-freakin-tasic.

OK... I am changing horses in the middle of the stream.  Seems the Unimono is just fishing line... more or less.  But which size of the Unimono are using?  The .004 or the .007?  4lb line is .008 and 2 lb is .004... about the same is invisible thread. But that seems too thin.

Hi Marc;

I'm not sure about that - 2 or 4lb line diameters would depend on the  material & manufacturing processes used... ~ I would guess ~  the fishing line I have here is 4lb @.008in, I measuerd the mono [it says "size 4"] it's .004in.

So I guess as far as diameter goes, 'it does not matter' [I hadn't bothered to measure till now] but I can say 2 things for the mono... 

1. mono was easier to work with than the line & held both glue & ink better, fishing line was s***
2. the mono only cost $1.86 -- I bought the cheapest fishing line I could find and it was over $12.00 

I did not know the mono also came in a larger diameter - might be a good idea to pick up both sizes then decide [I know I am gonna look for it!!] cause the .004 stuff looks like it will even be fine in 1/48 & 1/72 - keeping in mind that it stands out quite a bit more when you color it... 

Anyway - to get an idea, here is my Pfalz done up with the .004 mono & silver sharpie.

-sean

Since we are on the subject of flying wire thicknesses, an actual reference to wire size will be more helpful that a bunch of guessing.  I made up this reference photo from some info on the Hannover flying wires and sizes.  The original drawing (scanned from Windsock 23 Pg 27) gives some idea how the thicknesses of flying wires were used depending on load.  I also have given diameters of given wires for 48th and 32nd scales to ten thousandths of an inch.  Thus you can adjust your line diameter to get close or give an effect of the different thicknesses.

One more thing, over at Hobby Lobby they have very fine mono-filament thread in the sewing department. There are 2 colors clear, and black.  This thread is .004" in diameter and is fairly strong for the thickness.  Also over in the beading department they have 32 gage wire that is .0095" in diameter. that is in brass, copper, and silver colors.  I also have some 2 lb fishing line that is .006" diameter that I have had for years.

A little variance might be a good thing.  Some very much thinned silver or steel color paint will work quite well to color the cables too.

Here is a 20 year old example.  It is pre WW2 but it gives a good example This Hasegawa 1/72 He 51 flying wires are all made from stretched sprue and are VERY thin and delicate.  Silvered with a very thinned paint they look more like polished aluminum which in this case they were.  They weren't cables on the plane but wire.

And finally I have decided to just build the German Hannover CL.IIIa in 1/48th scale.  The upper wing will have to be rebuilt from scratch but that is part of what I am wanting to attempt.  Will post some photos later of how this kit scales out to drawings.

That tank is looking fan-freakin-tasic.

OK... I am changing horses in the middle of the stream.  Seems the Unimono is just fishing line... more or less.  But which size of the Unimono are using?  The .004 or the .007?  4lb line is .008 and 2 lb is .004... about the same is invisible thread. But that seems too thin.

That unditching beam is a nice touch.I shoulda put one on mine!

that tank is so sexy

Excellent progress to all of you!  Ships and planes, Oh my

Know only one thing about the rigging, looks awesome!

Here is the scratchbuilt unditching beam, still needs chains.

Guns look a bit better now that they received paint and drybrushing.

Finished paining all of the numbers.

And now the weathering has begun.

Will now start putting the first weathering steps onto the top of the MK IV and then start assembly of the tracks.

Marc, I'll chime in with Sean's advice.  I use 4lb fishing wire, also colored with a sharpie to string my previous biplanes. It's astounding the rigiditly it adds to your model. I use the through the bottom wing method and have once put too much pressure and actually warped the upper wing downwards.

wing_nut

Td... thanks for the vote of confidence.

Sean, I have heard that the rigging is almost as much functional as it is an appealing detail on a model.  I have a store near me that has a gigundo fishing dept. and will look into that Unimono thread.  Thanks for the tip.

Hi Marc;

Actually in the larger scales it's absolutely critical to rig them, there's just no stability without [well I suppose it depends on the subject too, FI/DI,DVII etc have pretty beefy struts and not much rigging anyway, but things like the Albatros, roland & Pfalz... absolutely necessary]

You'll be amazed once you are done - I guarantee it. [small footnote - when rigging alternate the sides of the plane you are doing, 1 wire right side - same wire left side - etc. that way you can maintain an even tension and not pull the wings out of alignment - ask me how I know :) ]

Best to look in the fly tying section [if they have one] but the product is here: http://www.uniproducts.com/ - just look for Uni-Mono under products ...  I'm sure it wouldn't be hard to find on the internet... 

BTW - my first few builds were done with nylon thread teased out of an old sock....  so there's other options ;)

http://www.onetofortyeight.com/Assets/Galleries/LVG_CVI_BUILD/

http://www.onetofortyeight.com/Assets/Galleries/LVG_CVI/

http://www.onetofortyeight.com/Assets/Galleries/WNW-Albatros/IMG_0102.jpg

http://www.onetofortyeight.com/Assets/Galleries/BristolFighter/

Can't wait to see when you are done... 

-sean

Td... thanks for the vote of confidence.

Sean, I have heard that the rigging is almost as much functional as it is an appealing detail on a model.  I have a store near me that has a gigundo fishing dept. and will look into that Unimono thread.  Thanks for the tip.

Hi Doogs;

see my post above - rig up those 3 little cables in your gear.... it will 'stiffen' right up.  no need for metal gear.

-sean

Ugh, the internet ate my big long post.

TD - ship is looking great! I'm having fun watching it come together!

Marc - That thing gets prettier with every pic! How are you finding rigging the control horns? I'm concerned about knocking or pulling them off. Those and the ailerons. And the rudder. And the landing gear...

Speaking of landing gear, I assembled and installed it last night. Talk about wobbly. If there was ever a case for metal gear, I think this is it. But, the morning after, the Pup is still on its legs.

I'm not quite to the rigging stage yet...still have some bits I need to paint and install, but soon now. I'm also expecting a shiny new macro lens today, so hopefully I'll be able to post some up close images of the rigging and my dusty, dusty paint job.

Hi Marc;

I've never worked with wonder wire, so I can't speak for it's properties, BUT, what I have found with the 1/32 scale WWI aircraft is that the rigging adds an AMAZING amount of structural integrity to the model. I prefer to assemble everything first [wings gear framing] then start rigging. Before rigging everything is very wobbly and moves around quite a bit, after rigging - absolutely rigid, no movement in the wings or landing gear at all. For this reason alone I like to use something with a little elasticity  but not too much [like 5-10%] - I've started using Unimono thread [fly tying store] colored with a silver sharpie - it's easy to work with, has about the right elasticity and is incredibly thin. 

The other fun thing about using something like this is you can adjust the tension to realign things that may be out of true [like gear framing]

hope it helps.

Remarkable build BTW.... have you caught the bug yet?

-sean 

Whatever you do wingnut,that is going to be one stellar build!

Doogs I am really lovin' that.  The wear on the cowl looks terrific.

TD great progress.  You are really moving through that.

My 1st WWI rigging :) But I already have to make a decision. My choice of material may be nice in theory, it is difficult to work with.  I am using .007"  Ultra Wire.  I think I had it in my head that using real wire would be cool.    The plan was to get one end of the cable all fixed up with eyelets and turnbuckles and get that glued in place.  Then the other end would go through an eyelet already in place, looped back through and another piece of brass tube and pulled taught.  the problem is even through it fist through the tube doubled it does not slide very easily which is going to be very problematic when I am trying to fix the 2nd end once the upper wing is fixed in place.  So the decision is... do i take off the few that I have done and change to invisible thread or take my lumps and muddle through and see what happens.

Anyway... just a few cables done... on the front of the fuselage, the elevators and the spinner.  I am real happy with the way the spinner turned out.  The beck outside edge of the spinner was beveled so when glue to the back plate there was a groove.  But as described above what a PITA it was to get the cables linked.

Mo' current progress.It's almost looking like something.

Morning Pupdate.

At long last, confirmation that the Pup is, in fact, a biplane. Finally got to that point where I could test fit the struts, and the entire thing is remarkably solid! I wouldn't go so far as to say I could pick it up by the top wing, but, well, maybe...

Here's a look-see. Shot with the iPhone, and it seems to have decided that tons of contrast is the best contrast, but you can still see what's going on. Also, the cowl keeps falling off. It'll glue on easy enough when the time's right, but I can't get it to just chill in place for the life of me!

Let's see...what else? Oh yes...found out yesterday that the wife and kids are heading to Houston not this weekend, but the next. So I now have a target date for rigging things up...I can swear as often and loud as I want, and nobody can do a thing about it!

TD4438

Possibly stupid question,but is that prop plastic?Sure looks like wood to me!

That's the nicest thing anyone has ever said to me.

Thanks TD... plastic.

Possibly stupid question,but is that prop plastic?Sure looks like wood to me!

TD, Waiknog... Thansk guys.

I had to strip the prop and start again.  The clear lacquer bubble the paint.  Same stuff Iused every wher else so I am SO glad that it only happened to the prop.

Rob, that landship is really coming along very nicely.

Doogs, I love what you did with the cowling, the weathering/fading paint on metal look great.

Marc, that is one awesome looking woodwork painting on the prop!