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The group build to end all group builds - THE GREAT WAR

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  • Member since
    August 2003
  • From: Connecticut, USA
Posted by Nachtflieger on Thursday, April 21, 2011 2:48 AM

Daaaaaaang Marc; that's looking awesome!

Nate

 

 

 

  • Member since
    April 2006
  • From: ON, Canada
Posted by jgeratic on Wednesday, April 20, 2011 11:56 AM

wing_nut that is just freak'n nutz - awesome work!  I thought those WnW kits were the cat's meow, but I guess some of you guys are finding room for improvement. 

Apparently Roden has come out out with a 1914 version of the Rolls Royce armored car.  At a quick glance the only thing different from their original release is the new spoked wheels.   To my knowledge no AM products have been yet released for this type of car, can anyone else verify this?

I also came across a producer of  WW1 aircraft decals located in the UK, Pheon Models .   He has no website, but there are reviews on the net.  He has a list of available decal sets (in all 3 popular scales) and does his sales by personal email and paypal.  More info here: 

regards,

Jack

  • Member since
    June 2010
  • From: Austin, TX
Posted by DoogsATX on Wednesday, April 20, 2011 7:26 AM

Mark - WOW. That's about all I can say. Can't wait to see that engine start its relationship with paint!

On the Bench: 1/32 Trumpeter P-47 | 1/32 Hasegawa Bf 109G | 1/144 Eduard MiG-21MF x2

On Deck:  1/350 HMS Dreadnought

Blog/Completed Builds: doogsmodels.com

 

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Wednesday, April 20, 2011 7:19 AM

Mike, Julez... thansk guys

 

ruddratt

you've just placed the bar on the other side of the moon!

Well that's not too smart... it's dark over there.

 

"I'll see you on the dark side of the moon. "Whistling

Marc  

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Brisbane
Posted by Julez72 on Wednesday, April 20, 2011 2:06 AM

Dittooutstanding work guys....

 

 

 

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 11:28 PM

I think I'll just quit right now and start collecting swizzle sticks instead. Geez Marc, you've just placed the bar on the other side of the moon!

Outstanding work!!  Bow Down Bow Down

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Tuesday, April 19, 2011 6:41 PM

Alclad transparent smoke you say huh?  Didn't know about that one. Oh goody... something to BUY.

Work continues on the engine, slowly but surely. Needed to make the plates on top if the springs for the lifters.  They are not flat but have a curled under edge with a dimple in the middle.  I came up with this...

The 2nd to smallest punch on the Micro Mark set fits the top of the spring.  To figure out what size bit to use to make the little rings I doubled the size of the wire (0.02) and the thickness of the lead foil (0.1).  Take that off the size of the punch, .058 leaving .038.  I went down a tiny bit to a #65 bit at .035 for some wiggle room. 

In the standard ring making manner, wrap the wire around the bit shank and cut of the rings.  Press the lead foil over the ring.  Run a burnishing tool around the outside of the ring and make a dimple in the middle. The next step will explain why the calculations.  Turn the foil over and the shape of the rich should rest perfectly in the hole for the punch... ring side up.  Now gently punch it out and, Bob's your uncle, lifter spring covers.

The nuts, such as they were, by the lifter were chiseled off and replaced with Tichy plastic bolts heads.  I get these at a local model RR shop.  The engine mount bolts were replaced with machined brass from Scale Hardware.  The brass stuff is some of the most amazing stuff that add a great light bit of detail look.  The engine is just dry fit at the moment waiting for paint.

Marc  

  • Member since
    June 2010
  • From: Austin, TX
Posted by DoogsATX on Monday, April 18, 2011 7:46 AM

wing_nut

Doogs, I know how stuff can get in the way of.. well... other stuff.  I would hate to see you give up on this though since you are doing such good work.  But you have to do what's best for you.  It's been a few days since your post so I am wondering what you thinking as at this point.

Oh, I'm definitely not giving up, just slowing things down a bit so I can play in shallower water for a few days. Got the LaGG-3 interior primed up and I've been doing a lot of boring detail work on the Achilles most of the weekend.

I guess...basically...updates may be slower for the next week or so (though hopefully the whole job thing will be sorted by Tuesday evening).

On the Pup's side of things, I got the tiny wood framing inside the fuselage masked and sprayed (god what a PITA), got the outside shot with primer where I'm going to have to paint before assembly, painted the tires, and finished up the engine. First time playing with Alclad's transparent smoke. Love the look it's given the engine. And it's way less "oily" than Tamiya Smoke. 

On the Bench: 1/32 Trumpeter P-47 | 1/32 Hasegawa Bf 109G | 1/144 Eduard MiG-21MF x2

On Deck:  1/350 HMS Dreadnought

Blog/Completed Builds: doogsmodels.com

 

  • Member since
    June 2010
  • From: Austin, TX
Posted by DoogsATX on Monday, April 18, 2011 7:39 AM

Have to agree with Jack. I definitely think the yellow/orange is the closest tonally, just too dark. Maybe a really light base (deck tan or something)?

On the Bench: 1/32 Trumpeter P-47 | 1/32 Hasegawa Bf 109G | 1/144 Eduard MiG-21MF x2

On Deck:  1/350 HMS Dreadnought

Blog/Completed Builds: doogsmodels.com

 

  • Member since
    April 2006
  • From: ON, Canada
Posted by jgeratic on Monday, April 18, 2011 1:23 AM

wing_nut

I think the yellow/orange mix is looking the best of the three.  The sand colour you chose might be a bit too dark (brown/gray) as a base when comparing to photos in museums.  Keep in mind too if you plan on using a gloss coat this will darken everything even more so.

These two pics I think were from a movie set, (German site).  You can really see how the setting sun gives the albatros an orange glow.


regards,

Jack


  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Sunday, April 17, 2011 10:25 PM

Doogs, I know how stuff can get in the way of.. well... other stuff.  I would hate to see you give up on this though since you are doing such good work.  But you have to do what's best for you.  It's been a few days since your post so I am wondering what you thinking as at this point.

I need some opinions about these colors.  I've been practicing some plywood.  I've seen D.V's and D.Va's with the wood to the yellowish and with a bit of orange.
 
The 1st pic is the painted wood.  The base is Vallejo Iraqi Sand with the 2 left panels darkened twice =with medium brown and hate 2 right panels darkened twice with red leather. The 2nd has a 50/50 yellow/orange mix on top and straight yellow on the bottom.

Marc  

  • Member since
    June 2010
  • From: Austin, TX
Posted by DoogsATX on Thursday, April 14, 2011 1:36 PM

In honor of Photobucket finally being back up, here's a peak at the cowl chipping. Apologies for the iPhone photos.

As I mentioned over in my Achilles WIP thread, I'm thinking I may try to throttle back a bit on this build. Got a lot on my mind at the moment, and as much as I'm enjoying pushing outside of my comfort zone, I'm also kind of craving a comfort zone build in the midst of all the insanity. But we'll see. I may change my mind tonight and keep the bench limited to the Achilles and the Pup.

On the Bench: 1/32 Trumpeter P-47 | 1/32 Hasegawa Bf 109G | 1/144 Eduard MiG-21MF x2

On Deck:  1/350 HMS Dreadnought

Blog/Completed Builds: doogsmodels.com

 

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Thursday, April 14, 2011 1:21 PM

gnsnow, welcome to the group.  I iwll update the 1st page with you list.  Don't worry that you are a treadhead.  As you can see by my avatar I am a winged treaded  flying rolling streamlined muddy guy.  Very much out of my comfort zone here.  And certainly don't worry about not being up to par.  It's not about that.    Better that you are going out of your comfort zone.

 

This brings us to 31/42 molders/potential builds. I really didn't expect this to be so popular.  Wonder why no one did it before?

 

Marc  

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Denton, TX
Posted by gnsnow on Thursday, April 14, 2011 10:26 AM

Hey guys - I've been lurking around this thread for a while now - I have a number of WWI models laying around the stash (one of my favorite subjects!) ...

Being a treadhead, I'd like to build a landship or 2, but 1/35 WWI armor kits tend to be pigs and I don't know if I have enough time/patience for 2 of them ... anyway, put me down for an A7V, Tauro 1/35, and possibly a Mk.IV Male, Emhar 1/35.

I also have a Pfalz D.IIIa, Eduard 1/48 (WIP) that I'm itching to finish. I don't have many aircraft under my belt and I've never built a pre-WWII plane before, so it may not be up to par with this crew, but I'm going to give it a go anyway.

"Artists who seek perfection in everything are those who can attain it in nothing."
   - Eugène Delacroix

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: NYC, USA
Posted by waikong on Wednesday, April 13, 2011 8:12 AM

Doogs, your office looks really, really nice!

Marc, thanks for the tutorial on the springs - great idea and very clear instructions.

Well, dispite a bit of intimidation, I've started on a Dragon 1/48 DR.1. Not sure how much details I can incorporate into the thing - it's smaller than I expected. I would like to try the buckles though.

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Tuesday, April 12, 2011 7:26 PM

Doogs, man that's lookin' great! I'd be very proud of that office - it's first-rate! Looking forward to seeing how you finish the cowling too. All in all, excellent work so far on your first bipe. Yes

Marc, just checked out your tutorial on the springs - pure genius. I will definitely be trying that out on my next WnW kit (after the Albatros - engine's already finished on that one.).

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Tuesday, April 12, 2011 6:59 PM

In my best  South Park chef voice... "Hello childrens."

Doogs yur killin' me.  Damn that looks good.

This link will take you to a toot for the springs.

http://wingnutmodels.com/Valve_Springs

Marc  

  • Member since
    June 2010
  • From: Austin, TX
Posted by DoogsATX on Tuesday, April 12, 2011 10:06 AM

Jack - LOVE the figure! One day I'll work up the nerve to try my hand at one of those people-things...

Marc - Great job on those springs! I'm curious about your method...I'd imagine something like wrapping them around a tapered shape like an airbrush needle. Probably be a pretty cool technique for making the volute springs for VVSS bogies, too, if you wanted to go crazy.

It's been awhile since the last Pupdate, but progress is afoot!

First, the cowl. I originally tried rubber cement chipping and hated it. Then I tried sanding back to the silver and hated that too. So I wet sanded it back, and repainted. 

Weathered the pieces last night with rub-n-buff. Don't have any pics yet, though.

Second, the cockpit. I'm calling it done. 

I made the rookie mistake of installing the seat BEFORE attaching the harness (in this case, rope). Couldn't work between the rigging, and decided to say screw it rather than risk damaging stuff. Besides, lots of Pup pics show no evidence of any kind of restraints. Doesn't really show up in the photo, but the leather of the seat does have a sheen to it.

Third, the Le Rhone. 

Love the detailing on this engine, but I'm not a fan of the arrangement of the pieces. The molding of the tubes to the front cover is annoying, since it makes painting something of a pain. The tubes don't all link up with the cylinders, either, but those will be buried beneath the cowl, so I'm not sweating them. Wired it up last night (again, no pics yet), but the wiring is strangely all behind the engine, so it probably won't even be visible once the plane's done. Next, I'm thinking about hitting the entire engine with some Tamiya Smoke to dirty it up a bit, but it's mostly there.

I'm also discovering that the fuselage is going to be a slow go. On the inside, there's a grid of wood framing that has to be painted, but that's too thin to brush. I've masked and sprayed the veritcals, and in a day or two (once those cure), I'll swing back and mask and spray the horizontals. Then I'm going to have to paint some parts of the fuselage before I install the cockpit and join the sides. 

It's slow going, but it's going well...

On the Bench: 1/32 Trumpeter P-47 | 1/32 Hasegawa Bf 109G | 1/144 Eduard MiG-21MF x2

On Deck:  1/350 HMS Dreadnought

Blog/Completed Builds: doogsmodels.com

 

  • Member since
    August 2003
  • From: Connecticut, USA
Posted by Nachtflieger on Tuesday, April 12, 2011 3:26 AM

Jack: Your figure looks great! Very life-like.

Marc: Love the valve springs for the engine. They will look great on the model.

Nate

 

 

 

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Monday, April 11, 2011 7:54 PM

Jack, yep, I'm likin' that a lot! The stubble really takes it to another level. Definitely has me looking forward to your next figure.

Marc, now  you come up with that idea for the springs! Ya know that I'm dyin' to see how you did those - they look awesome (and may just sway me enough towards the Roland as my next purchase! Wink ).

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Monday, April 11, 2011 6:35 PM

Wow... Out-frakkin'-standin', Winger...  And people think I'm a scratch-built detail freak, lol.. Those'll look b*tchin' once installed..

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Monday, April 11, 2011 6:21 PM

Been a little busy with work... self employed so this is a good thing... but i did have time to get into the lab and come up a new molecule that will cure all future energy problems.

OK. so really... I started to make some turnbuckles last night and I decided my eyelets were too big.  So I stated fresh. I stared with and 18" piece of wire and stared twisting.   But instead of cutting each one I just kept twisting and made 50 in about 5 minutes.

And I came up with a way to make perfect conical shaped springs for the engine 2 at a time. I'll post a how-to later.

 

Marc  

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Monday, April 11, 2011 5:16 PM

Jack the face look terrific.  The eyes are perfect.  Looks like he's staring right at you.

Marc  

  • Member since
    April 2006
  • From: ON, Canada
Posted by jgeratic on Sunday, April 10, 2011 7:16 PM

Begun work on the next figure, the second half of my group build entry, but also touched up the first one.

Bockscar - I took your comment as constructive criticism and have added the 5 o'clock shadow.  Originally it was there, but the face as a whole had too much contrast so a filter wash was applied.  It was too strong and it pretty much obliterated everything and had to go back and go through the steps again and somehow omited the stuble.  This time I used black weathering powder.

The prep work on the second figure is really becoming a bear.  Major seams on the front and back of both legs.  The rifle would not sit at all in both hands, so they have been chopped off and glued to the gun at the properly measured points.  Will probably have to build up the wrists so they fit into the sleeves as I have hollowed them out a bit.  Also performed  a lobotomy on his head as his cap will be replaced with a helmet.  These were made available during the latter half of 1916 and were given to those serving in trenches.

regards,

Jack

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Sunday, April 10, 2011 6:06 AM

Yeah, I still pull RB3D out now and again, EB... The campaign engine in that game has yet to be beat... The war goes on around you, generating missions and enemy flights 24/7... No other flight sim campaign ever came close...  I used to do the mission assigned, then go off and "lone Wolf" behind the Allied lines, and look for trouble...  Believe me, you would FIND it, too... More than once I had to run for my life back across the mud with a pack of SE-5s or SPADs chasing me, damaged, outta ammo and leaking oil...

  • Member since
    December 2010
  • From: Memphis TN
Posted by Heavens Eagle on Saturday, April 9, 2011 9:15 PM

Something I thought of while looking through the posts here and looking into the painting (or lack thereof) of various planes.  It struck me that many of the old WW1 planes just had plain uncolored linen and that it was quite translucent.

It seems to me that the best and easiest way to make that effect possible would be for the manufacturing companies to make the plane out of a translucent plastic.  I had a LIndberg model once that was somewhat clear but a little milky.  That plastic would be perfect for the light colored unpainted effects.  Just use black or dark brown to paint the framework on the translucent part and then paint a thin coat of linen color over that.  Seems to me that it would even be good for the colored planes with lozenge camo and such.

  • Member since
    February 2010
  • From: Berkeley CA/St. Paul MN
Posted by EBergerud on Saturday, April 9, 2011 8:41 PM

Red Baron....the time I spent on those games. I think the first one was a marvel for its time - Damon Sly really pushed the envelope. I once did a career as Cecil Lewis and got 121 kills (required some emergency saves of course.) Always chose the fastest planes so I could run away - loved Spads. (I flew Aces High seriously for a couple years and was a P51 fan for the same reason.) The online Baron version was sweet too if you didn't mind a freeze a minute. 3D Baron was a terrific game but by that time Air Warrior cut it's prices and I became an addict. Haven't flown online since I started modeling: something had to give. I thank the Lord there were no video games when I was a kid or I would still be in my bedroom. I would have missed out on the baby boom masses of kids getting into trouble and modeling.

Eric

 

A model boat is much cheaper than a real one and won't sink with you in it.

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Saturday, April 9, 2011 4:45 PM

I'm more than a little familiar with Rosebud's WW1 archives.. I did a couple-three hundred hours of research for painting skins for the aircraft used in the WW1 flight simulator, "Red Baron 3D"... I also used it for several static models of Fokker Dr ls and D Vlls too, and their dioramas..  It's a marvelous research site and indeed,  all too easy to get "sucked into" lol...

Regarding the "Harry Tate"... I know that was a typo with the "F.E. 8" ID... An R.E. 8 ("'Harry Tate", see?) is what you meant, I know) at the top, that indeed is translucent.. But it's also unpainted, being covered in just the clear dope... The camouflage paint has yet to be added, as you pointed out with "arrival day", EB...

F.E. 8:  http://www.aviastar.org/air/england/raf_fe-8.php

I don't want a "Photo War", lol.. Too much bandwidth, lol...  The only thing I was trying to point out is that the eyes are decieving at times, so one has to look at all the little tells and study those... Then keep and discard whatever cancels out or supports the hypothosis...

Like the bottom R.E.8.. Given that I can find no evidence of a roundel shadow on the top wing (like the top photo), I'm assuming (ya, I know, I know) that the bottom is likely painted in a "sky" or light grey grey color rather than just being covered with the clear dope...

 Also, IMO, the rib tapes are creating an illusion of translucency, combined with lighting effects, like a reflector of some sort (I'm not a photographer though) is being used, and given the reflection off the wheel cover (which also contrasts to good effect the grey rubber that was common back then on aircraft tires), and the appearance of an overcast sky (which is not all that uncommon in France either, during the late Spring/early Summer), with the Channel storms causing a lot of weather over the mainland, makes good photography difficult at times...

However, I'll conceed that it is possible as well, that the top wing of the lower Harry Tate is finished in clear dope only, since I do see SOME kind of shadow, I think... Likely the spars... Apparently, this aircraft is undergoing it's first camouflage paint job, but we don't know where, when, or who, since their unit markings and squadron badges have yet to be applied...   

So.. What does all this mean?  Simple.. Paint the ribs on either side of the rib tapes if'n ya wanna to show shadows or translucency...  I'd use powdered charcoal and a 1-"0" red sable brush were I doing it... 

 I personally wouldn't spend much time on it, unless the underside is  the main focus, and I'd decided to display it inverted as the result of a crash-landing, or nosed-over in a shell-crater in No Man's Land (HOWEVER: This would negate the see-though effect as well, since there's no light source under the aircraft),  with perhaps one of Rosebud's "Unfortunate Aviators" still in the rear cockpit ...

Observers/gunners generally had a shorter life-expectancy than pilots (fighter pilots would want to aim well in order to incapacitate/kill the GIB as quickly as they could, for their own safety while finishing the attack), although with most recce flights, the Observer was the Mission Commander and an officer first, gunner second and didn't or couldn't spend a lot of time with their guns, at least not the amount that the bombers' dedicated Gunners did...

IdeaThink I just got a diorama idea!Idea

This was the practice on both sides (and the first flying job Von Richthofen had as a "Flying Uhlan") However, MvR was different from most Observers in recce aircraft in the fact that he was an exceptional marksman...

 

 

 

 

 

 

  • Member since
    February 2010
  • From: Berkeley CA/St. Paul MN
Posted by EBergerud on Saturday, April 9, 2011 4:30 PM

I don't even know if the translucent effect exists - maybe it was a sometimes yes, sometimes no. (Nothing confuses most people more than the word "sometimes.") I noticed on Rosebud that the older the plane the more pronounced the effect. Modern replicas usually show nothing at all. As far as achieving the effect wwwiaircraft.com has a page dedicated to it. Very familiar to Tony Greenland fans. http://www.ww1aircraftmodels.com/page9.html

Doog: tried artist oil varnish for a quick sheen? You could put that on straight-up, although maybe experiment on something first. It's not a medium but a fluid put on oil paintings to preserve them. Adam Wilder is a fan of it for grease stains on tanks, and it certainly works for that. It looks more like the real deal than clear or Pledge. Art stores also sell acrylic varnish which is whitish - a lot like Vallejos "clear." Never used it.  (Did you check the wwiaircraft bit about spark plugs? That struck me as "not in this lifetime" but might appeal to the real detail heroes.)

Plane's are looking very sweet.

jEric

 

A model boat is much cheaper than a real one and won't sink with you in it.

  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Saturday, April 9, 2011 1:31 PM

Yes the translucent effect of fabric over frame would be impossible to simulate in plastic.

Crap. I was hoping no one wold say that.  Now I have to remember where I saw a model that looks like photos above.

Marc  

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