Awesome work guys!!!

Mach71: You're making great progress, looks fantastic!

Gary: Same there, looks like you've got a lot done and everything looks really good. Hope your heating is back online soon. The warmer weather is a big improvement.

Bakster: Nice to see her all in one piece and ready for paint.

BTW: My astronaut now has two legs and an arm. Working on the right arm now...

Thanks Steve and Gam.

Steve, I had such good luck using melted sprue on the Redstone, I used it again! I wanted to use it again because it scribed so nicely, and I will need to re-scribe along the fuselage joins. In general, melted sprue works pretty darn well, but occasionally there are areas that need another application. In those instances, and this time around, I am testing Tamiyas liquid primer. So far, I like the stuff. It wet sands and feathers beautifully. For small imperfections it seems to work nicely. The liquid primer is what you see applied in the image. Tomorrow I will sand that out.

I used melted sprue on the wing roots too. I am not sure that is ideal because it can be a little difficult to sand without damaging detail. I think that next-time I will make a bigger effort to make the join tighter, and then use something like Perfect Plastic Putty. I am still groping around on some of this stuff. 

A little more info on the sprue-goo: I really like the stuff for sand-ability and works great if you need to build up certain areas. For example, I didn’t like the fit of the X1s side hatch. When installed the hatch had larger gaps than I would like. So, I ran a bead of sprue-goo on the edge of the plate, waited for it to cure, and then sanded it down some. Doing this expanded the edges for a better fit and you’d never know that it was modified. On the Redstone escape tower I used sprue-goo to fill gaps and strengthen some of the delicate bracing. This is versatile stuff.

Oh, one other thing. It just so happens that the sprue-goo I had made using Redstone sprue is the exact same gray as the X1 sprue. It is an exact match and this is why you can’t see the work I did. It is neither here nor there, I  just wanted to clear that up.

More than you wanted to know, probably.

No actually that's not more than I wanted to know, that's about right. One question about sprue glue, what is it? Is it a product or something you make yourself? I read that you said you made some. I've read others using it and was curious.

modelcrazy

No actually that's not more than I wanted to know, that's about right. One question about sprue glue, what is it? Is it a product or something you make yourself? I read that you said you made some. I've read others using it and was curious.

 

Steve, yes you can make it yourself. To the best of my knowledge it is not produced commercialy. Here is what I recommend:

1. Get a bottle of Tamiya Extra Thin cement. Hopefully, not a full one, it should be maybe half full. 

2. Cut up sprue into small pieces maybe 1/4 inch long or less.

3. Drop them into the bottle of Tamiya Extra Thin. I filled mine level to, or slightly over the level of cement. Stir it up a little and let it set. It will take a day or two to melt all the plastic. It helps expedite the process by mixing it the next day, then let it set again.

It is that easy. Once fully melted you can use the cap brush to dab or smear the plastic where you want it. I try to dab some of the excess on the inner wall of the bottle. Otherwise, you will get big globs of the stuff and that will cause you more work later. 

The first time I tried this I used another brand of cement. It did not work that well. I had issues with bubbles that caused divots in the final application. When I tried Tamiyas cement, the problem decreased dramatically, almost to nonexistent. It Will need to gas out some. I noticed some bubbling with the Tamiya too, but they eventually gassed out over several days of curing in the bottle. So, I highly recommend using Tamiya cement, and the brush is a handy applicator too.

One other tip that I can give you. Over time the cement gasses out of the jar and the plastic becomes too thick. If that happens, just add more cement until you get the consistency that you like. You can keep reactivating the stuff and you can keep adding plastic if you get too low. If you get stringy plastic when you remove the applicator from the jar, it is a sure sign that you need to add more cement. The same is true when you first mix the batch. You will need to adjust things a little. There is no magic to it, so don’t worry. Make it thin enough to where it spreads pretty easily and to where you are not getting stringy plastic. 

Let me know if I can help you further.

Steve, there are a few utube videos out there on this too. Here is one of them that is fairly informative.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GdVBcMOn9R8

I'll be giving that a try. It just so happens that I have a half filled bottle of thin. Is there a manufacturer's plastic you prefer likr Hase, Airfix, Tamiya, Trumpeter etc?

The things people come up with. 

modelcrazy

'll be giving that a try. It just so happens that I have a half filled bottle of thin.

Perfect!

modelcrazy

Is there a manufacturer's plastic you prefer likr Hase, Airfix, Tamiya, Trumpeter etc?

No, not at all. If you want to be on the safe side of things, I would suggest that you use sprue from more recent kits. Something from the last several years and not lets say a 70s kit. But truthfully, it probably does not matter either way. I think the type of liquid cement may play a bigger role in how it performs. Oh--and you might consider what color sprue. My recent batch is gray--which is a pretty common color for kits. Here again, it is not that critical, but if you use lets say red it might take more pre-painting prep in terms of primer to get a consistent base color. 

modelcrazy

The things people come up with. 

I know, hey? That is so true.

I am excited to see you try this. I hope you find it as useful as I have. Once it's laid down and cured, it acts just like the original plastic. You can drill it, sand it, cut it, etc. Heck--I even use the stuff as an adhesive! This stuff can in many ways bond just like epoxy. It depends on what you are attaching. It is so-so with PE, but it gives a strong bond when used on other plastic. It seems to chemically attach to it.

One other thing. Once you apply it to the model, you'll want to wait about 24 hours before sanding. It takes a bit of time to fully cure, depending on how thick a layer you put down. That is a slight negative to it but the benefits far out way the negative. 

Just wondering, I have already submitted my "eagle" lunar module and X-15, but I have a NASA XB-70 that is done, would it qualify for the race to space too?

Ben

Bakster

With me holding the exhaust plate. That plate should go on the inside of the fuselage, and that would have been too tough to mock-up without gluing it. I can't glue that yet. 

I need to make a correction. I was wrong about this. The plate goes on the outside of the fuselage. That piece had such a poor fit to it that I assumed it must fit inside. After I tried that, the problem was worse. Then I pulled the PE and tried that instead. Sure enough--it goes on the outside. 

Just an FYI.

Thanks for the detailed info. I'll start a bottle today.

Bakster: Wow, looks all kinds of awesome all lighted up!

And I may have to try some sprue putty myself. I've tried it a few times but always come back to tube putty.  

Sounds good Steve.

Gamera

And I may have to try some sprue putty myself. I've tried it a few times but always come back to tube putty.  

Gam--what kind of issues did you have with it? I am just curious what your experience was.

Thanks about the lighted up. That image is a rehash from the original post. I figured I had better repost that image or folks might have trouble figuring out what I am talking about.

Bakster>  The X-1 is looking really good, exhaust or not.  Are you planning on putting "Amorous Ennis" on the side (a copyright joke)?

This "sprue goo" sounds interesting.  I'm always looking for stuff to fill gaps with.  I don't have any Tamiya Thin Cement, but I do have a bottle of Plast-I-Weld.  Wonder if that would work?

Gamera> Hope the astronaut figure is turning out okay.  Sounds like it's one limb at a time.

Ben> While I'm a fan of the XB-70, I will have to say no for this GB.  While NASA did use it, it seems to have been more for SST research than testing for aerospace use.  If it had rockets, or an RCS system, or even been used for drop testing or chase work on another vehicle (as the DC-3 was used as a tow vehicle for the M2F1) then I would say go ahead.  If you can come up with something, I'm willing to be persuaded.  

Thanks for the kind words on my project.  We're not quite half-way through the GB, and all I can say is things are going along about as I expected.  I am working on a couple of other projects at the same time, so not all my modeling time is devoted soley to the Apollo model.

Not much going on on my end.  I still have no heat, and it seems that situation will continue to the end of the week (at last report).  I'm starting work on the Command Module interior, and trying to fix seam issues revealed by my last paint coating.  Need to drop by Hobby Lobby to find some paint to help finish up the astronaut figures, so I'll probably be there tomorrow. 

Gary

Today in Space History:

HAPPY BIRTHDAY CHARLES LINDBERGH!

1970 February 4 - . 02:59 GMT - . Launch Site: Vandenberg. Launch Complex: Vandenberg SLC2E. LV Family: Thor. Launch Vehicle: Thorad SLV-2G Agena D.

• SERT 2 - . Mass: 1,404 kg (3,095 lb). Nation: USA. Agency: NASA Cleveland. Class: Technology. Type: Ion engine technology satellite. Spacecraft: SERT. USAF Sat Cat: 4327 . COSPAR: 1970-009A. Apogee: 1,046 km (649 mi). Perigee: 1,039 km (645 mi). Inclination: 99.2000 deg. Period: 106.00 min.

• Space Electric Rocket Test; the ion engines aboard were operated until 1981. The SERT 2 development program started in 1966 and included thruster ground tests of 6742 hours and 5169 hours duration. A prototype version of the SERT 2 spacecraft was ground-tested for a period of 2400 hours with an operating ion engine. In addition to diagnostic equipment and related ion engine hardware, the spacecraft had two identical 15 cm diameter, mercury ion engines. Flight objectives included in-space operation for a period of 6 months, measurement of thrust, and demonstration of electromagnetic compatibility. The thruster maximum power level was 0.85 kW, and this provided operation at a 28 mN thrust level at 4200 s specific impulse. Flight data were obtained from 1970 to 1981 with an ion engine operating intermittently in one of three different modes, namely, HV ion extraction, discharge chamber operation only, or just neutralizer operation. Major results were that two mercury engines thrusted for periods of 3781 hours and 2011 hours. Test duration was limited due to shorts in the ion optical system. Thrust measured in space and on the ground agreed within the measurement uncertainties. Up to 300 thruster restarts were demonstrated. One power-processing unit accumulated nearly 17,900 hours during the course of the mission. Additionally, the ion propulsion system was electromagnetically compatible with all other spacecraft systems.

GAF

Bakster>  The X-1 is looking really good, exhaust or not.  Are you planning on putting "Amorous Ennis" on the side (a copyright joke)?

Hehe. Mayyyy B.

You know what? Plastiweld is the stuff I first tried. Break out the bubbly.

It worked, just not very well.

Sorry Charlie.

Bakster: I guess I wouldn't call them issues, I just like tube putty better. Just doesn't seem to make as big a mess (at least to me), less fumes, shorter drying time, etc. And sprue putty always seems to dry out on me, then again I've only made small amounts at a time though. I may have to give it another shot.

Gary: Yeap, one limb at a time... Sorry to hear you still don't have heat, but it warmed up nicely up here. I started today in a sweatshirt and jacket and was down to a short-sleeved shirt by the end of the day.

Bakster> Oh, well.  I'm planning on dropping by Hobby Lobby tomorrow.  I'll keep an eye out for some Tamiya Thin Cement.

Gamera> Yes, it's warmed up considerably around here.  Next cold snap will be Friday, so hopefully I'll have this repaired by then.

Gamera

Bakster: I guess I wouldn't call them issues, I just like tube putty better. Just doesn't seem to make as big a mess (at least to me), less fumes, shorter drying time, etc. And sprue putty always seems to dry out on me, then again I've only made small amounts at a time though. I may have to give it another shot.

Whatever works for a person.

GAF

Bakster> Oh, well.  I'm planning on dropping by Hobby Lobby tomorrow.  I'll keep an eye out for some Tamiya Thin Cement.

Gary-- that sounds good.

It's been rather quiet around here.  I've been busy catching up on other things while the weather has been warm.  It was up in the friggin' 80s today!  I did manage to do a little painting, applying some final "white" coats on parts and a little more scratch-building.

Project Report:

Applied some final coats of white to the LES and LM.  I'm pleased with the result, though the seams on the LM could probably be better.  She's ready for masking off and spraying on the black surface areas.  The landing legs will get a coat of silver (per the "Apollo 13" model).  The base is awaiting further paint and detailing.

Meanwhile, the interior of the Command Module is being detailed.  I need to print out some decals for the control panels, then finish some minor detailing.  The astronauts are on hold, as I was unable to make it to Hobby Lobby the other day.  The hi-gain antenna is being painted and detailed before attachment, while the engine nozzle needs some final work.  The LES is ready for detailing, and the nozzles are being painted flat black.  That will leave some panel lines to be done and she'll be ready.

I have decided to scratch-built a new boost protective cover for the CM, as when I did the existing one I did not leave the connection for attaching the CM to the LM.  I'll fix that with a second cover, though I suppose I should go back and redo the existing one.  I am going to sit down and think about that for a week or two.

The SM is awaiting a final coat of white, then it will be ready for detailing.  The folding doors I need to modify, as the tab along the top edge is too long for the bottom of the SM.  Needs some sanding down.

That's it for now!

Mission Director (GAF)

Today in Space History:

1959 February 7 - .

• Medical tests for the Mercury astronaut selection started. - . Nation: USA. Program: Mercury.

1961 February 7 - . LV Family: Saturn I. Launch Vehicle: Saturn C-2.

• Final report of the Low Committee - . Nation: USA. Related Persons: Seamans. Program: Apollo. Spacecraft: Apollo Lunar Landing.

• The Manned Lunar Landing Task Group (Low Committee) transmitted its final report to NASA Associate Administrator Robert C. Seamans, Jr. The Group found that the manned lunar landing mission could be accomplished during the decade, using either the earth orbit rendezvous or direct ascent technique. Multiple launchings of Saturn C-2 launch vehicles would be necessary in the earth orbital mode, while the direct ascent technique would require the development of a Nova-class vehicle. Information to be obtained through supporting unmanned lunar exploration programs, such as Ranger and Surveyor, was felt to be essential in carrying out the manned lunar mission. Total funding for the program was estimated at just under $7 billion through Fiscal Year 1968.

1961 February 7 - . 20:56 GMT - . Launch Site: Edwards. Launch Complex: Silver Lake DZ. Launch Pad: Edwards RW04/22. Launch Platform: NB-52 008.

• X-15A Stab./Control test - . Nation: USA. Agency: NASA, USAF. Spacecraft: X-15A. Apogee: 23 km (14 mi). Maximum Speed - 3660 kph. Maximum Altitude - 23820 m. Last XLR-11 flight. Air dropped in Silver Lake DZ..

Gary: She's lookin' great. You're moving right along there. 

Bakster: Lol! 

Sorry not much done here. The improvement in the weather and some computer issues I rolled down the car windows and carried my desktop PC to a repair shop an hour away. When I got there found they'd gone out of business... So last night I went to new shop 45 mins away. And so there went most of my free time this week.  

Gary--looking good!

80s? Son of a ....  it's a balmy 4 degrees here. 

Progress on my X1 continues towards primer. My scribing work turned out so-so. Scribing the X1 body with its complex body shape was a bit of a learning curve. The Redstone was easy by comparison. I learned two things:

1. I still have much to learn regarding scribing. Also-- I might need to search out a better scriber. I bought one from HobbyTown and the thing is so-so. It likes to walk on ya. I had better luck when I reverted to using my razor saw, but I couldn't use it that much because the saw couldn't get in all the recesses. Also--I think the saw is a bit heavy handed for the job. I needed finer lines.

2. I find the HT scriber left the lines a bit ugly. They look torn up verses cut. That is where the saw is so nice, it cuts nice. I tried something though, and this is the point of point 2. I laid a bead of Tamiya Liquid Primer over the scribing. The primer fills in some of that roughness and rounds things out some. It also reduces the depth keeping it more to scale. This then is followed with wet sanding leaving the primer in the recesses. In my opinion, it pulls it together some.

Lastly, I had a one step back issue last night. Somehow, I snapped in half one of the wingtip probes, and it was not even installed yet. I planned to install them at the very end knowing there'd be a high likelihood of breaking them by accident. I don't even know how it happened. There it was on the bench, snapped. So--I had to fabricate another one. #$@#$@

Next update should be with the X1 primed. That is my goal for the weekend.  

Anyway--that's that. 

PS: I would love to hear what you guys use to scribe.

Gary, things should move along now that the white is painted.

Bakster, I saw some of that Tamiya primer the other day and wondered about it  It seemed a small bottle to spray but applying it like you did sounds like what is was made for. I've been using the Vallejo filler over Perfect Plastic Putty. It works the same but doesn't clog in the nozzel as easley as PPP. I also started making a bottle of sprue goo but haven't been at the bench for a couple of days and have'nt looked to see if it needs more sprue or glue or if it's just right. I'll be at it tomorrow after work and take a look.

Bakster; like the LEDs, how is the build coming along?

GAF, I see your moving along and from what I do see, it looks pretty nice.

Keep it up

Ben

modelcrazy

Bakster, I saw some of that Tamiya primer the other day and wondered about it  It seemed a small bottle to spray but applying it like you did sounds like what is was made for. I've been using the Vallejo filler over Perfect Plastic Putty. It works the same but doesn't clog in the nozzel as easley as PPP. I also started making a bottle of sprue goo but haven't been at the bench for a couple of days and have'nt looked to see if it needs more sprue or glue or if it's just right. I'll be at it tomorrow after work and take a look.

Hey Steve-- I read that some people spray it, but I can tell you that it would take some serious thinning. One person didn't recommend it, they felt it is not the same as Tamiyas aerosol primer. They felt the liquid is more granular for the purpose of filling. From my experience with it, I would not AB with it. Instead, I would decant their aerosol for spraying. Maybe am wrong, but I think it was marketed to be brushed on and then sanded, like how some people use MR Surfacer liquid to fill minor defects. I have used it like that and man.... I really like the stuff. It feathers really nice. This is another tool in my arsenal of tools and so far, it is a great tool to blend bodywork, and or fill imperfections. One thing though--the bottle does not come with an attached cap brush. I don't know why they don't add it but a regular old paint brush works just as well. What I ought to do is use a cap from a spent Tamiya Extra Thin Cement jar. Then I'd have the brush attached.

I have use Vallejo filler as well. It works very well for running a bead along wing roots and such. Then take a moist cotton swab and draw it down. It smooths really well. The only issue I had is that it doesn't seem to take sanding well, if needed. It seems to stay somewhat soft. That was my experience, maybe not yours. Different tools for different purposes! And their filler fills a good niche.

I don't like sanding it, like you said, it stays soft and clogs the sandpaper or stick. What works great for me however is using alcohol for wet sanding it, that works very well. Water also works but alcohol works better IMO.

I'm glad everyone is discussing filler, because I think I'm going to need a lot of it on these wraps.  Not a lot of progress.  Work had been keeping me away.  

modelcrazy

I don't like sanding it, like you said, it stays soft and clogs the sandpaper or stick. What works great for me however is using alcohol for wet sanding it, that works very well. Water also works but alcohol works better IMO.

 

Another fine moment in the life of Bakster.

DRUMS01

Bakster; like the LEDs

Thanks man.

DRUMS01

how is the guild coming along

Scroll back a little. I posted an update this morning on where I am at. 

Thanks, guys!  Getting the last coat on these items sure makes me feel like I'm making progress, though it doesn't look like it from the photos!  Did some more detailing last night on the Command Module, and Service Module.  Today was a complete wash as the weather has gotten colder, and they finally came out to replace the heat pump for the apartment!  I have heat again, but it was an all day affair as they not only replaced the outside unit, but the inside unit as well!  Apparently the difference in the freon gas made the replacement of the entire system necessary!  Well, it's nice to have heat even though I had service guys in for about 7 hours.

Scottrc>  That's beginning to look like something.  If I understand correctly, those are cardboard tubes and you will need to fill the paper grooves?  Not sure what the Estes model is made from.  Work always keeps us from what we really want to do, doesn't it?

Bakster>  4 degrees?  Well, I won't complain about it being so hot here in February, though it's turning cold again here tonight.  Good thing the heat is fixed!

Sorry to hear about the wing probe.  It's a common problem, which is why I'm leaving a lot of the fiddly bits off until the last moment.

As for scribing, I try not to.  Occasionally I will use an X-acto to fix some sanded away spots, but I definitely don't want to try to recreate the grooves on a model!  I'd rather just pencil them on!  Helps me keep what little sanity I have left!

Modelcrazy> Glad you and Bakster have had this discussion on fillers.  Good information there.  I still haven't gotten some Tamiya Thin Cement.  I may have to order some online, unless I can find it elsewhere.

Gamera>  Sorry about the computer!  I understand about missing one.  To come clean, I have two desktops, 1 laptop, a tablet and a smartphone.  Recently, my large monitor (28") went out.  I hope to repair it, as there's a common problem with the capacitors in the power supply and replacing them hopefully will fix it.  Meantime, I went to the local church thrift store and found a Dell 20" wide screen they were trying to get rid of for $8.  I also picked up a nice computer chair for $12, so I spent $22 (with tax) and have a very nice monitor (picture wise).  Now why can't I find any models in the thrift stores for those kind of prices?

Gary