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ARMOR - Panther (PzKpfw V) Group Build (any scale)

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  • Member since
    December 2009
  • From: West Grove, PA
Posted by wildwilliam on Thursday, February 12, 2004 9:33 AM
Spector & Kenneth,
i think they could be done either way.
also, someone here mentioned that the kit links have
the pin ends molded in, even tho thereis no actual pin in the one end.

of course, if you look THAT closely at my Panther, you will find worse mistakes!
:-)

well, i fiddled w/ some concepts to anchor the cable end.
Kenneth's picture is excellent, but when i went to fabricate that i ran into problems.
a scale clamp of that size would mighty delicate.
i was going to use the left over fret from my Tamiya Zim rakes,
but when i tried to drill it w/ my pin vise, it smacked me and took my lunch money!

so i eyed my enormous styrene collection and got out my calculator.
i thought 1/2" would be a reasonable thickness for the steel plate used.
but at 1/35, that is a bit over .015
i had the feeling this was not going to work out, as the cable WOULD
actually be connected to this.

so i punted.
i took some styrene rod that matched the diameter of the rod that holds
the front eye, drilled two holes in the rear deck, inserted the rod w/ a
bit of CA, painted the rod to blend in w/ the camo that surrounds it
(one red, one green) and called it 'good'.
or 'good enough'.

now i just have to figure out how to get this styrene cable to drape
more convincingly. i have put it in recently boiled water,
but that has not helped much.
i am afraid to use flame, but i might.

if i had some decent string, i would steal the ends from the kit piece
and soak the string w/ Elmers to form it.
then paint it.

suggestions?

ed.
or just let it hang.
  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: Southern Maine
Posted by spector822002 on Thursday, February 12, 2004 9:27 AM
Kenneth: What site did you get that panther pic from ? How those guys get those paint finishes on the tanks to appear so real is beyond me
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 12, 2004 9:13 AM
Kenneth, that Gunnar Jansen model is looking pretty good. It raises some issues for me all over again.

1) The grill screens look very realistically dented in. I've tried to do that on mine, but it just doesn't look as natural.

2) The spare treads on their hangers look very realistic. I don't know what to do about that. The friuli are just too thick to sit reralistically on the etched rack, but that's what my tank is wearing. I could use the kit links, drilled out of course, but they are a lot thinner. Maybe MK is the way to go after all, but they are so fragile and hard to build. I tried them once for a panzer iii but gave up on them.

Meanwhile, my new compressor arrived yesterday, delivered by some German snow dudes. Tongue [:P] So I'll paint up my critter in the next few days.
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 12, 2004 7:49 AM
Spector, THIS one is hung by the track pins but I have seen both ways so don't worry about it... Its just like anything else there are almost always more than one way to do something... I really wouldn't worry about it.........really!

Peace
  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: Southern Maine
Posted by spector822002 on Thursday, February 12, 2004 7:09 AM
Ty for the pixkenneth I can already see something i did wrong on the track attachment at the rear of my tank , there are pins in them babies in your pic , I have mine attached to the link sprocket guides , DOAH!!! Time for an overhaul! Amazing how a picture of a trully nice model brings you crashing back down to reality , there are builders out there in a level I may never achieve Disapprove [V]
  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Kent, England
Posted by nmayhew on Thursday, February 12, 2004 5:05 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by Kennethc

The tow cable ends were held to the rear deck with a open u shaped bracket welded to the rear deck about 18 inches from each side and a couple inches in from the back. It had a pin that held the cable in the bracket.
EDIT, Here is a pic. Its mid way up on the left side... above the toolbox.
Model by:Gunnar Jansson



kennethc thanks for that info, although i fear it's now a bit too late to add those little brackets to my kitty (just waiting for dull coat, pastels and maybe some mud, although the latter might result in disaster!)...shame as i went to alot of trouble getting aftermarket tow cables and all that...oh wellDisapprove [V]
seen some great looking pics as ever...Big Smile [:D]
regards,
nick
Kind regards, Nicholas
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 11:22 PM
Wild W. The Tamiya Red brown is great for use as a primer colour for vehicle interiors. I use it for this, and overspray a mist coat of the real main colour to give a 3D effect. You will be amazed at the difference to a straight off-white or buff clolour. I am in the last stages of detail painting the Ausf D's interior (adding knobs, cables and handles to radio units) and should be able to post a pic or two to show this method of painting next week.

The interior has taken far longer than I expected. I can't wait to finish the interior so I can glue the hull together and start the outside final details.

I'm still waiting on my Armo Aluminium barrel. My supplier got some in, but they were all for Tamiya not a mix of Tamiya and Dragon as he ordered; The Tamiya ones don't fit without work. He has re-ordered them, but is not sure when they will arrive. He won't be at my club's March meeting, so I will need him to mail it or I would have to wait for the first Saturday in April. Sad [:(]

Upside, he had some PE from a company called 'Voyager' out of China. Never heard of them before, but after looking at what he had I bought a set of German tool clamps and clasps. This set is just like Aber's 3 piece sets, and comprises 19 early type clamps and 20 late type (each set has 3 different lengths for the different tool types) and cost me only AUD $3-50 (about USD$2.75). Once I've bent a few I will let you know what they are like.

Keep on building
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Utah - USA
Posted by wipw on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 4:38 PM
Ed, don't be sorry about anything. That's what this here G B stuff is for!

If it looks a little off from the rest when you get it done, go the other way make it look like it was either a field mod, or that the last maintenance team put a new one of for one that was damaged in action!

Kenneth, thanks for adding in the pic. That is way different than I'd figured. I was thinking of the u being on it's side facing the rear.

Bill
Bill ========================================================== DML M4A2 Red Army ========================================================== ========================================================== -- There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness". (Author unknown)
  • Member since
    December 2009
  • From: West Grove, PA
Posted by wildwilliam on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 3:17 PM
Thanks, Bill, i appreciate the effort! sorry to open this can of worms,
but you'll get out of it easier than me.
my tank is painted & weathered ferpetessakes!

Kenneth,
great pic!
now i know what i need to do.
now i gotta do it & not screw up the rest of the stuff.

we love challenges, right?
:-)

ed.
  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: Southern Maine
Posted by spector822002 on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 3:15 PM
On my PE set it had a pipe and pin assembly at the rear for mounting the tow cable if you klik on my link below you should be able to see what I mean. I am sure many of these were feild applied , so anywhere you chose at the rear ( as long as it does not interfere with anything else ) should be correct . the mounting beside the turret does not make sense as it would interfere with the turret spin( on the real deal may actually fetch up during combat )
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Utah - USA
Posted by wipw on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 3:03 PM
Completely. Basically what I thought for the shape. Thanks for the info on the pin and position.

Bill
Bill ========================================================== DML M4A2 Red Army ========================================================== ========================================================== -- There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness". (Author unknown)
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 2:59 PM
The tow cable ends were held to the rear deck with a open u shaped bracket welded to the rear deck about 18 inches from each side and a couple inches in from the back. It had a pin that held the cable in the bracket.
EDIT, Here is a pic. Its mid way up on the left side... above the toolbox.
Model by:Gunnar Jansson
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Utah - USA
Posted by wipw on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 2:48 PM
Okay, Ed, I'm back from lunch. I looked through 3 of my "state of the art" Panther kits. Dunce [D)] First, let me appologize, when I wrote that, above, I was thinking of the way the cables sit on a Tiger. They loop around the grills and back almost to where they start. They are the ones that have the brackets I was talking about. So, having said that...

My Panther G Steel Wheel...The instructs show the front eyes of the cables around the cylindrical projections on the tool racks at the front, side of the hull. The back ends, it just shows sitting there! I assume that's the same thing you noticed. In one pic, they almost look like they are sitting over the overhang of the hull at the rear of the tank.

My DML Panther G Late w/night vision...It shows the cables on the box art, but they are not shown anywhere on the instruction sheets. In fact, as far as I could determine by looking at the parts break down, they aren't even contained in the kit!!! What's THAT all about??Confused [%-)]Confused [%-)]Confused [%-)]

So I looked at my DML Panther A early...Same story, absolutely NO tow cables I could see. They may be on the sprues somewhere, but I didn't see them on the parts layouts on the instruction sheets. Sorry!

What I will probably do, is lay the cable over the tool mount at the front and see where the end sits at the back. Then try and figure out how to bend a bit of brass fret into some sort of bracket. It would only need to be a U shaped thing sitting on its' side with the opening facing the rear of the tank.

If you come up with something better, or more true to life, please let me know. Now you got me curious and more than a little disgusted with DML!Disapprove [V]Disapprove [V]Banged Head [banghead]Grumpy [|(]
Bill ========================================================== DML M4A2 Red Army ========================================================== ========================================================== -- There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness". (Author unknown)
  • Member since
    December 2009
  • From: West Grove, PA
Posted by wildwilliam on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 2:07 PM
Bill,
there is definitely nothing on the cable ends in my kit
(other than the big eyes, of course)

i am assuming (ho, ho) you mean around the grille
and not right on it.
i used the Tamiya PE grilles, and there are no hooks on them.
there are small hooks on the rear deck, but i thought they were for lifting something.
there are four of them around the engine hatch, i think.
(i am at work)
:-)

thanks. something else to check.

i will do 'something' tonight, as i want to wrap this up and get back to
my other sausage wagon (IV-D)

ed.
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Utah - USA
Posted by wipw on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 11:12 AM
QUOTE: Very nice Bill. I can't wait to see the finshed model.
mark956

Thanks, Mark. I'm getting rather anxious myself!! lol


Ed, I haven't gotten far enough to be looking at the tow cable yet, but there should be two or three little U shaped clamps on the engine grills on each side to hold the cables. They may be molded on the cable. The ones for my ancient Tamiya are molded with the cable. I'll try and remember to look at my Tamiya steel wheeled G when I go home for lunch in about 2 hours. I'll let you know what I find.


I didn't have much time, last night. I got the radio man's hatch glued on as well as the hull mounted machine gun and the driver's vision port. (Found out I had it on upside down when I put the zimm on it, but I was able to make it fit!) Tonight, I'm hoping to get started on the driver and get some of the tools onto the hull.

Bill ========================================================== DML M4A2 Red Army ========================================================== ========================================================== -- There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness". (Author unknown)
  • Member since
    December 2009
  • From: West Grove, PA
Posted by wildwilliam on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 6:12 AM
Derek,
not to worry. i went the otherway and went out and bought the Tamiya red-brown and then came home and saw that i already had it. (apparently for a Japanese aviator uniform!) i am going to have to paint a LOT more 3 color camo to get rid of all that!

Spector,
i had located the front one w/o trouble, but i did not see anything on the back.
thanks for the picture,
i will check mine again when i get home from work.
i will also re-examine my instructions to see if there are
still parts on the sprue that should be on the tank!
because i was searching around by the lift hooks and did not see anything likely.
the Tamiya box pictures show the cable lying on the horizontal surface of the deck,
but there should be a hook or a pin or rod to put the eye over.
otherwise it would fall off i would think!

Tigerman & Lizardquing,
you guys have the same kit (Tamiya Early G w/ Zim)
do you know what the rear eye of the cable connects to?

ed.
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 1:06 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by wildwilliam

Bill,
you are rolling now!

Derek,
did you use it up on some other project? Big Smile [:D]
i mean you have had over 2 months to get some !! Tongue [:P]
i should be sending you the wrap up for my Panther soon.
too bad i don't have that ready.
THEN you would have something to do!! Smile [:)]

ed.

I didn't even think to check if I had any!Black Eye [B)]Dunce [D)] I do have Afrika Mustard tho...Mischief [:-,]
  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: USA
Posted by mark956 on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 9:38 PM
Very nice Bill. I can't wait to see the finshed model.
mark956
  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: Southern Maine
Posted by spector822002 on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 8:53 PM
the attachment at front of cable is the round piece near the tow cable hook ( that funny horseshoe thingy ) , at rear it is near the lift hook ( on the rear hull )
  • Member since
    December 2009
  • From: West Grove, PA
Posted by wildwilliam on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 6:14 PM
Alright,
i am ready to call this project done, except for one small problem.
i was about to put the tow cables on my Panther,
and i realized, there seems to be no attachment point for the cable
on the engine deck end of the cable.

what is supposed to hold it in place on the 1:1 tank?
Dunce [D)]

EDIT
i am modeling the late EARLY G version.
ooops!!

any suggestions (pertaining to the cable!) Big Smile [:D]
would be appreciated.

thanks,
ed.
  • Member since
    December 2009
  • From: West Grove, PA
Posted by wildwilliam on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 2:58 PM
Bill,
you are rolling now!

Derek,
did you use it up on some other project? Big Smile [:D]
i mean you have had over 2 months to get some !! Tongue [:P]
i should be sending you the wrap up for my Panther soon.
too bad i don't have that ready.
THEN you would have something to do!! Smile [:)]

ed.
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 10:15 AM
Well...going pretty good and then I find out I have no Dunklegelb! Blush [:I]
So while I wait for that...I have no Idea what I'll do!
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Utah - USA
Posted by wipw on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 9:34 AM
Whoa-ho, I really was busy yesterday!! I got the three rings cut out to hold the turret onto the hull. The first two went well, but the inside radius was just a touch too big. So for the bottom ring, the one that will keep the turret from falling off, I made the inside a little smaller. Unfortunately, I made it too much smaller! Thank goodness for motor tools. I used a sanding drum and inside of five minutes and a LOT of plastic shavings later, I had it fitting. I'm finally ready to put the stuff on that goes inside the hull, like the machine gun and the drivers letter box hatch mount, get the turret on, and glue the hull together!! YEA, WHOOPIE!

Bill ========================================================== DML M4A2 Red Army ========================================================== ========================================================== -- There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness". (Author unknown)
  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Rain USA, Vancouver WA
Posted by tigerman on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 12:04 AM
ROFLMAO, I repainted my cammo again. I'm losing it! I liked the first better until I ruined it. I'm painting it one more time, like it or not. I figure if I'm pouring all this money into it, it better be satisfactory to me. I really didn't want to look at it and say later...oh, I should have done it this way. I may not finish before the nex two group builds I commmited to.

   http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y269/wing_nut_5o/PANZERJAGERGB.jpg

 Eric 

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, February 9, 2004 9:01 PM
Great work guys. Derek and Bill, looks like you are having fun with the 're-builds' of the old kit.

Bill, love the pic of the 'dueling Panthers' - The impotency of the tamiya turret is nicely emphasised with the rubber bands to help hold the barrel up.

Hope the comp comes soon Larry.

Have been busy elsewhere so the Ausf D has been plodding along. Have finished drilling out all guidehorns from the indy tracks, and drilled out the holes for the retaining pins on the top/bottom of the 12 spare links to be attached to the rear (Yes Wiild William, you were darn right stopping that procedure after the first one you did). I only did the spares; I have seen so many people forget that the kit tracks have no pin all the way through yet they leave the moulded on pin ends on the spare track links.

Have drybrushed the interior components and will start the detail painting next. Should have some pics of the final painting soon ( I hope).

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Rain USA, Vancouver WA
Posted by tigerman on Monday, February 9, 2004 1:33 PM
Looking forward to pics Larry.

   http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y269/wing_nut_5o/PANZERJAGERGB.jpg

 Eric 

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, February 9, 2004 10:59 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by Kennethc

Larry_Dunn, Those the Aber Schurzen holders? I love those things.... So easy to use... Glue em on real good though.. I kept knocking them off...


These are the Eduard. Not as pretty, but generally easier to make.

QUOTE: I can't wait for pics of your painting...


Me too! Tongue [:P]
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Utah - USA
Posted by wipw on Monday, February 9, 2004 9:53 AM
I did just a little more last night and this morning. I've finally got all the sponson bottoms glued in and braced. Next job will be cutting some rings out to increase the size of the turret ring to the size of the hole in the hull. That should be a pretty straight forward thing. But we'll see!

Bill ========================================================== DML M4A2 Red Army ========================================================== ========================================================== -- There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness". (Author unknown)
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, February 9, 2004 9:09 AM
Larry_Dunn, Those the Aber Schurzen holders? I love those things.... So easy to use... Glue em on real good though.. I kept knocking them off...

New compressor....ouch that sucks...!! Oh well, you get what you really want now though right.... Look at the bright side...

I can't wait for pics of your painting...
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, February 9, 2004 8:20 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by Kennethc

Sounds like ya'll are movin right along. Keep it rolling...



I'm pretty much at the painting stage now. That means I have to wait for my new compressor to come. I ordered one of the badger ones that Squadron carries, the one with the on/off switch.

All I've got to do is get the schurzen holders folded up and glued on and I am ready to start shooting paint.
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