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Opinions needed on a color

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  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Tumwater, WA.
Opinions needed on a color
Posted by M. Brindos on Friday, September 16, 2022 7:53 PM

It's been a while, but as this summer is finally winding down I'm beginning to resume my Rainey day hobby of scale model building.

I've been on the hunt for a color that will match the early WWII German armor grey typically depicted on all of Tamiya's box art. I've always thought they were onto something with that Green-grey they always depict German vehicles in. Plus, it's always made sense to me that dark grey wasn't the best color for hiding your vehicles in anything but a dark forest. 

Those thoughts have occupied my mind for years and I've decided I needed to just make my own color.

I started with a base color of Vallejo Basalt Gray and added Dark German Green and a touch of Russian Green til I landed on this Dark Green-grey mix. 

I've sprayed my test vehicle with a light overcoat of the color and provided the Tamiya 222 raw for comparison.

I think this color is what I'm looking for and I'd like to believe it's more realistic than any German gray I've used before. It's works well with a green wash and highlights well when I add I couple of drops of neutral grey for highlights. Giving me the look I've been searching for, for years.

Now I'd like to know what your thoughts on this color are. Am I close? Does it look right? 

Its definitely dark grey with a greenish cast. It's close, without weathering, to the typical Tamiya box art. It's what I've been looking for. 

What do you think?

-Mike

Edit;

On whim I decided to toss a little DAK colors on the top and it works very well with the new color. I like this!

I may just end up keeping this as-is and completing it as a North Africa vehicle. I've been using it as a test bed for so long I never thought I'd finish it.

Now maybe I will.

- Mike Brindos

Figure Painting Moderator -- Genessis-Models

  • Member since
    October 2019
  • From: New Braunfels, Texas
Posted by Tanker-Builder on Saturday, September 17, 2022 8:17 AM

Okay!

      There's this too. After moving in country, they usually didn't paint camo on them. The units in the front Yes! The ones I did in1/48 Bandai Armor, I did in Werhmacht Grey/Green. Slate Grey with a shade of  Moss Green to it. Usually take one tin of Humbrol Werhmacht Grey and four drops of Moss green. Mix well and Apply!

        Frontline vehicles I did in Mud Grey Green. This was the base followed by A weak wash of Black/Green! Let a little of the Werhmacht Grey show through in spots.This was a field Mod!

  • Member since
    September 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Saturday, September 17, 2022 12:05 PM

The basic problem with any answer about correct colors for Wehrmacht armor is that it often depended on how each crew mixed the paint, and what was available.  The colors were at best inconsistent.  So, you should pick that which looks best to you.

Bill Morrison

  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Tumwater, WA.
Posted by M. Brindos on Saturday, September 17, 2022 3:08 PM

Thank you for your responses, gentlemen.

You've just taught me something new. Very appreciated!

- Mike Brindos

Figure Painting Moderator -- Genessis-Models

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Sunday, September 18, 2022 1:13 AM

warshipguy

The basic problem with any answer about correct colors for Wehrmacht armor is that it often depended on how each crew mixed the paint, and what was available.  The colors were at best inconsistent.  So, you should pick that which looks best to you.

Bill Morrison

 

Mixing the paint by crews goes out the window with early war German vehicles. They were painted at the factory in specific colors of brown and gray up to June 1940, then solid gray for the next couple of years until the three color camouflage was introduced in early 1943. The one exception to that at the factory would be vehicles slated for North Africa once the tropical colors had been developed and issued in 1941. The standards for the colors used are known. The only real variable would be the age and usage of the vehicles. But basic Panzer Gray starts at a known point, then fades and weathers from there.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Fort Knox
Posted by Rob Gronovius on Sunday, September 18, 2022 1:48 PM

If WW2 German crews were anything like Cold War US crews, we kind of just winged it until the factory applied NATO 3-color scheme arrived in the late 80s.

Even then, vehicles that did not get a lot of manuever abuse got faded by the sun. Vehicles that got beat up by trees and terrain got painted more often and the colors started varying as you mixed old paint with new paint or tried thinning it more to make it last.

  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Tumwater, WA.
Posted by M. Brindos on Monday, September 19, 2022 9:06 PM

Again, thank you for the replies. 

I've got much to consider here. 

Early war should be more uniform in color and not show too much wear or fading. Late war should show the opposite of that with lots of crew attention and less conformity.

So time period and theatre should dictate how I process the paint scheme. Got it.

Thank you, my friends. You've been invaluable again.

Let me see what I can do.

- Mike Brindos

Figure Painting Moderator -- Genessis-Models

  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Tumwater, WA.
Posted by M. Brindos on Wednesday, September 21, 2022 11:12 PM

Update.

 

I've worked the upper Camouflage pattern over by dry brushing lighter colors over the yellow and green and then misting a 5to1 clear and desert yellow mix over the upper surfaces to blend it all together.

The lower part of the model just received drybrushed and fine brush highlights to provide some contrasting green and grey. 

The last thing I've done is gloss in prep for some decals and washes.

So far I'm liking the results, even though its been more than my usual efforts of late. Too many shortcuts have not made for the best finishes in some of my efforts before now.

- Mike Brindos

Figure Painting Moderator -- Genessis-Models

  • Member since
    May 2004
  • From: Land of Lakes
Posted by cbaltrin on Thursday, September 22, 2022 6:56 AM

Cool

On the Bench: Too Much

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: SW Virginia
Posted by Gamera on Friday, September 23, 2022 9:28 AM

Mike: I like the 251, nice work! I haven't commented since I'm not sure if the colour is right or not but your results look good! Yes

"I dream in fire but work in clay." -Arthur Machen

 

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Friday, September 23, 2022 10:54 AM

So it looks like you're doing one of the 1943 "field applied" schemes? A vehicle built in dark gray, then repainted at the front by the crew after the new 1943 camouflage colors became available to better help that vehicle match the local conditions. The troop compartment, and perhaps the running gear, are still gray, while the outer upper surfaces have a pattern of Dark Yellow and Olive Green applied over the gray.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Tumwater, WA.
Posted by M. Brindos on Friday, September 23, 2022 7:08 PM

Thank you, Gam. I'm beginning another season of practicing and improvements. I appreciate your comment. I certainly hope I haven't lost my edge lol.

Carlos, you are correct. I'm attempting to portray an end line vehicle that got the last of the paint and so was given a scheme that would make the most of the paint that was left. Henceforth the upper parts Camouflage with the lower still in grey. My planned weathering should tone it down more once I start "dusting" the model. But first, decals, washes, and then chipping. With maybe some more crew "maintenance" in evidence. 

I've got to get back into the swing of things and this old kit is my mule.

- Mike Brindos

Figure Painting Moderator -- Genessis-Models

  • Member since
    September 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Sunday, September 25, 2022 7:52 PM

This is what I said earlier. Field applied means field mixed. Colors were inexact depending on the mix, what it was mixed with, and how it was applied.  For example, colors mixed with water differed from colors mixed with gasoline. Colors could be varied by the ratios of paint to base. They also could vary based on whether they were applied with brushes, air spraying, or mops. And, this is before weathering takes hold. In other words,get it to what you consider to be reasonably close.

Bill Morrison

  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Tumwater, WA.
Posted by M. Brindos on Monday, September 26, 2022 1:19 AM

Thanks, Bill. I will be trying to do exactly that.

Just got the decals on tonight. Not much to them, but they help break it up a bit more. I had to repair one of the crosses because part of it broke off when I went to dab it with a paper towel and I couldn't recover the piece lol. Fine tip brush to the rescue.

-Mike

- Mike Brindos

Figure Painting Moderator -- Genessis-Models

  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Tumwater, WA.
Posted by M. Brindos on Monday, September 26, 2022 3:39 PM

Decals look good.

On to the next phase.

 

- Mike Brindos

Figure Painting Moderator -- Genessis-Models

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: SW Virginia
Posted by Gamera on Monday, September 26, 2022 10:48 PM

Looks just right from the old Squadron/Signal Panzer Colours books and SP and Bill said. 

Nice work, the contrast from the early war grey to the later mustard and green looks good! 

"I dream in fire but work in clay." -Arthur Machen

 

  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Tumwater, WA.
Posted by M. Brindos on Friday, September 30, 2022 2:00 AM

Thanks, Gam. 

I'll be testing some more ideas on it later, but it's benched for now. I've got some other projects I need to get ready to continue, such as my M-60 with the mine plow. 

I'm getting the itch again lol.

But for now I'm going to enjoy that little 222 and get something simple completed for the ol' mo jo boost.

- Mike Brindos

Figure Painting Moderator -- Genessis-Models

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