Mobelwagen Flak 43 3.7cm Complete 09-01-08

Wow you sure do work fast! You're already done with the lower hull and I must say it looks great so far! Nice to see come kitbashing, don't seem to see alot of that nowadays.

I'll be waiting for your next update.

Bill,

I picked up on this build almost instantly when I read the header. But what I'm really interested in is the 37mm gun kit. Tell us about it!!

gary

Roy, I picked this one up on a trip to the Philippines in 2005 at bargain-basement rates (can't beat Manila kit prices!) and have been holding on to it ever since. Your project sounds much more ambitious though, sounds like it needs to come off the shelf and get some love!

squeakie wrote:

Bill, I picked up on this build almost instantly when I read the header. But what I'm really interested in is the 37mm gun kit. Tell us about it!! gary

Squeakie, at first glance the kit looks impressive and is a close copy of the Tamiya molding but with better bolt detail and definition. It includes a turned brass barrel with integrated flash suppressor as well as PE for the gun splinter shield and other parts/details. The kit is designed with this in mind so there's no surgery required to fit them to the gun parts as would be required with the Tamiya parts. The LR PE detail is better than the Eduard PE IMHO, so it makes some of the Eduard parts redundant, particularly in regards to things like the spent shell basket netting. The LR kit also includes spent brass rounds to populate that area, a nice bonus IMHO.

WN,

This one's not that complicated of a kit-bashing exercise, the LR gun is virtually a 1-for-1 swap out for the Tamiya parts. The base of the LR gun is designed exactly the same as the Tamiya part so it will mount seamlessly to the Tamiya hull. Now if I were adding a Tristar suspension or similar, now THAT would be a more complicated endeavor. 

A Tamiya is a sudden change of pace, but with all those goodies it's like pimpin' your ride!    I always liked Anti-Aircraft AFV's and this should be a fun build to watch!

Panther F wrote:

A Tamiya is a sudden change of pace, but with all those goodies it's like pimpin' your ride!    I always liked Anti-Aircraft AFV's and this should be a fun build to watch!

Thanks Panther, this particular kit was released in 2001 IIRC so it's not quite as old as some of the other Tamiya offerings out there. The rubber-band one piece tracks were just awful but other than that it stands up well, at least so far. I hear you on the attraction of self-propelled AA designs, the Germans certainly had a penchant for putting AA guns on anything that was strong enough to carry them.

wbill76 wrote:

Work began today on a new project, one that I've wanted to do for a while but held off on for a variety of reasons. Lion Roar's recent release of the Flak 43 3.7cm kit is what finally pushed me into the build though, so here goes. I'll be using the Lion Roar kit for the gun as well as Eduard's PE and Model Kasten replacement tracks. Since this is a multi-media build and kitbash/combination exercise, the kit instructions steps will not necessarily be followed to the letter. I started with the lower hull and suspension first, installing the bogies, bump stops and final drive housings as called for in Steps 1 and 3 but left off the return rollers for the time being. The rear hull plate had it's various elements installed and I used the Eduard PE items to replace the fuel filler cap since it included the retaining chain. The chain was given a 3-D look by carefully bending the flat links 90 degrees to each other using two pairs of tweezers and working one link at a time. PE mounts for the base of the exhaust covers were also added and the rear plate installed to the lower hull. Next came the road wheels, return rollers, sprockets, and idlers. The kit provides the option for both the earlier welded-tube style and the later cast style idler, I opted for the later style. The sprockets include a polycap insert that will allow them to rotate freely while the idlers do not. The steel return rollers were assembled but not installed since a dry-fit shows they've got a little bit of play to their mounts and I want them to be lined up properly with the rest of the running gear, so they will get installed later on. All of the road wheel halves were removed from the sprues and sanded to remove a slight seam on the rubber portion and the outer halves received their hub caps. Turning to the upper hull, the side air intakes were added along with the rear fenders, mud flaps, and rear deck plate. The rear deck plate required two molded-on areas originally used on earlier Pz IVs to mount tow cables to be removed, this was done using a #11 blade and carefully sanded down to match the rest of the hull. The kit parts for the intake covers were replaced with the Eduard items and the retaining wing nuts and side hull clips added. I used Gator Glue, an acrylic binder, to mount the plates and the various parts to allow for some work time to position them properly.  I also added the bolt strip detail to the top and bottom of the rear hull bracket, using liquid glue to soften the plastic and gently pressed the strip into place with the tip of a wooden toothpick. The hull front also received some attention with the access hatches added for the driver and radio operator, the front superstructure plate installed, and details added to the front fenders and mud-flaps. The Eduard items were used here along with a short length of solder bent to shape and glued in place with CA gel to complete the Bosch headlight wiring. Next up was the interior of the fighting compartment, I removed the simplified molded on handles for the two rear access panels and replaced them with the Eduard parts. The Eduard set included additional detail for this area including the hatch hinges and retaining clips and handles, so these were added as well. The side ammunition bins were also installed and detailed. The top of the bin had a molded-on ladder shaped item, this was removed and replaced with the Eduard part which was bent to shape and glued in place. The ammunition bin faces are molded smooth on the Tamiya parts, so the Eduard PE faces were used to upgrade this area. The reinforced "X" patterns were created using the point of a wooden toothpick and a piece of hard, but flexible, rubber matting to allow the "X" to be embossed on the outer surface. Eduard allows for this with the inner faces having the X pattern already etched and recommend using a ball-point pin to do this but I've found the toothpick provides a more reliable and consistent pattern and used that instead. Each of the bins received 2 latches which were carefully bent to shape using tweezers and a magnifier and installed with Gator Glue to allow for proper positioning. Rounding things out for the time being, the lower and upper hulls were joined using regular glue to get a good solid bond. Additional details were then added to the hull including the front Bosch light and "d"-shaped flap support, brake housing vents, rear side grab handles, front tow pintles and spare track holder, and the rear antenna mount. Next up will be the side walls for the fighting compartment, the kit allows for 3 different modes (full transport, AA only, AA and ground) for the plates and I'll have to study that carefully to determine the placement and use of the various Eduard items to create those details.

I'm suprised you haven't tried the Tristar running gear replacement set it also has a fully functional road wheels and replacement return rollers as well bumpers for the Ausf D through Ausf H which are way better than the molded on bumpers on the Tamiya kit. As in fully functioning road wheels even the suspension works too.

Mikey,

It's true the Tristar suspension set is fully workable but since this one will not be on a base or posed, there's really no added-value in replacing them and putting in the extra work to fit them. The bump-stops on the Mobelwagen aren't molded on to the hull, they are separate pieces, and are the correct style for the IV-J hull used on these vehicles whereas the Tristar bump stops are correct for the earlier chassis as you point out. The Tamiya supplied steel return rollers are also correct and using rubber-rimmed return rollers from the Tristar set wouldn't be accurate. 

SWEEEEET! it's realy cool to see a bit of kitbashing now and then. Can't wait for the next update.

Mikeym_us wrote:

I believe the return rollers in the TriStar kit are both the Steel and the Rubber type. And of course remember not to remove any seams on the road wheels as those are supposed to be there.

Good to know about the steel rollers, didn't realize the Tristar set included both. As for the seams on the wheels, that's true only if you want to depict a brand new set of tires. Wouldn't take very long once in use for them to be worn down.

Stick Man, appreciate the comments, thanks for looking!

Bill,

So far it its looking very good and I like the PE work. Must've cost a pretty penny eh? Definately looking forward to more of this, as this is one of my favorite deviations from the original Pz. IV. What scheme are you going to paint it in?

Tigertankman wrote:

Bill, So far it its looking very good and I like the PE work. Must've cost a pretty penny eh? Definately looking forward to more of this, as this is one of my favorite deviations from the original Pz. IV. What scheme are you going to paint it in?

TTman, I got the kit a few years back in Manila for around $20 and I waited until GM had a sale to pick up the Eduard set for about $10 IIRC. The MK tracks were normal price of $25 and the most expensive item was the LR Flak 43 since it's a new release at $35. Under $100 for the whole lot, not bad considering. I usually watch for the sales on places like Great Models and others to pick up goodies over time, spreads out the cost and some great bargains can be had if patient.

As far as scheme, it will be a three tone "worm" type pattern common to these kinds of AA platforms.  

wbill76 wrote:

Tigertankman wrote: Bill, So far it its looking very good and I like the PE work. Must've cost a pretty penny eh? Definately looking forward to more of this, as this is one of my favorite deviations from the original Pz. IV. What scheme are you going to paint it in? TTman, I got the kit a few years back in Manila for around $20 and I waited until GM had a sale to pick up the Eduard set for about $10 IIRC. The MK tracks were normal price of $25 and the most expensive item was the LR Flak 43 since it's a new release at $35. Under $100 for the whole lot, not bad considering. I usually watch for the sales on places like Great Models and others to pick up goodies over time, spreads out the cost and some great bargains can be had if patient. As far as scheme, it will be a three tone "worm" type pattern common to these kinds of AA platforms.

Well I also have the same kit I think I got it for 15 bucks on Ebay I also picked up some 37mm ammo for the Flak43 from Armorscale. just need to find a source of metal clips for the ammo.

wbill76 wrote:

Roy, I picked this one up on a trip to the Philippines in 2005 at bargain-basement rates (can't beat Manila kit prices!) and have been holding on to it ever since. Your project sounds much more ambitious though, sounds like it needs to come off the shelf and get some love!  squeakie wrote: Bill, I picked up on this build almost instantly when I read the header. But what I'm really interested in is the 37mm gun kit. Tell us about it!! gary Squeakie, at first glance the kit looks impressive and is a close copy of the Tamiya molding but with better bolt detail and definition. It includes a turned brass barrel with integrated flash suppressor as well as PE for the gun splinter shield and other parts/details. The kit is designed with this in mind so there's no surgery required to fit them to the gun parts as would be required with the Tamiya parts. The LR PE detail is better than the Eduard PE IMHO, so it makes some of the Eduard parts redundant, particularly in regards to things like the spent shell basket netting. The LR kit also includes spent brass rounds to populate that area, a nice bonus IMHO. WN, This one's not that complicated of a kit-bashing exercise, the LR gun is virtually a 1-for-1 swap out for the Tamiya parts. The base of the LR gun is designed exactly the same as the Tamiya part so it will mount seamlessly to the Tamiya hull. Now if I were adding a Tristar suspension or similar, now THAT would be a more complicated endeavor.

I have the same basic trac with the quad 20mm cannon, but have also been thinking about adding the same basic kit you have to my stash for an eventual build up. Your right about Lion Roar PE, and I've got a few sets, and in my own opinion I think it's better with many more options. And while on this same subject; have you ever built the "Ostwind?"

gary

Gary,

So far in the build the kit has held up to the usual Tamiya standard in terms of fit and engineering, I'm enjoying it. From what I understand the Flakvierling kit was produced first and then they came out with the Flak 43 later, kind of like the actual vehicle where the Flakvierling was the initial prototype and then replaced with the heavier gun. 

I've built Tamiya's Wirbelwind a long time back but not the Ostwind, do you know who has it available in kit form?

wbill76 wrote:

Gary, So far in the build the kit has held up to the usual Tamiya standard in terms of fit and engineering, I'm enjoying it. From what I understand the Flakvierling kit was produced first and then they came out with the Flak 43 later, kind of like the actual vehicle where the Flakvierling was the initial prototype and then replaced with the heavier gun.  I've built Tamiya's Wirbelwind a long time back but not the Ostwind, do you know who has it available in kit form?

I think Tamaiya did it, but it might have been DML. I've seen a couple of them, and it looks sorta like a Whirblewind with the 37mm cannon. I want one real bad.

gary

Panther F wrote:

The Ostwind?  Italeri No. 376.  I have it sitting on the "to do" shelf.

I started off the next round of effort by dealing with the rear hull details that I didn't quite get to last weekend. The mufflers were added along with their Eduard PE braces, a bit of a challenge as the braces need to be angled just right and are a square surface mating up to the rounded surface of the exhausts. I glued them first to the rear hull with Gator Glue, let that set up good and tight, then used a pair of tweezers and liquid glue to carefully attach them to the exhausts directly. Also added were the spare tire holders and the PE reflector for the left side mud-flap.

The next area of attention were the walls of the fighting compartment. The Tamiya kit offers three different options for posing these: fully flat, anti-aircraft mode, or transport mode. I decided for the middle-road approach with the anti-aircraft mode and this in turn required some surgery to the Tamiya parts. The Tamiya instructions rightly tell you to remove the molded-on wing nuts on the extension flaps here and I removed the molded on brackets and replaced them with the Eduard items and wing nuts. There were some slight ejector marks on the inner surfaces that also needed attention, these were carefully sanded down to remove them.

The side panels also had some ejector marks that needed to be sanded down, so this was done first before mounting anything. The Tamiya instructions were followed to mount all the various components, the exceptions being the spare barrels and their retaining clips. I used the Eduard clips and carefully removed the molded on clips from the Tamiya parts by cutting away the excess with sprue cutters first then carefully trimming the rest down with a #11 blade. The surface was then lightly sanded to keep the rounded shape and the two barrel ends were drilled out with a pin vise so that they look like barrels and not solid tubes.

The barrels are only dry-fit into the clips for photo purposes, they will be painted and installed later on after the interior has been painted.

Next came the incredibly tricky task of installing all the panel and getting them to play nice with each other. The Tamiya instructions recommend using clear tape for this step and it's not hard to see why. The panels are designed to be fully workable and since I went with the anti-aircraft mode, the only thing holding them together are the little hooks on either side. Instead of using tape, I carefully braced the panels using toothpicks and needle files and just a touch of liquid glue at the corners to get them to stay together and let it dry for some time to insure everything would stay in the desired location. Not hard to see why they nicknamed this thing a "furniture van"!

With the fighting compartment out of the way, I started in on the Lion Roar Flak 37. Once I had the instructions out and started studying them and comparing it to the Tamiya instructions, it's not hard to see where LR got their inspiration. The assembly steps are virtually identical right down to the parts breakdowns but the LR parts do have better detail definition, so I don't feel like it was a waste.

First up was the base installation of the gun parts along with the barrel. I used the Eduard PE part for the barrel splinter shield because it had better detail. I annealed it on the kitchen stove gas burner and used the Tamiya part to curve it to shape before gluing in place. The LR barrel was mounted and I actually had to enlarge slightly the provided mount holes, go figure, for it to fit but nothing serious.

The rest of the gun base was also constructed following the LR directions for their Step 2. I used the Eduard items to replace the crew foot rests as the LR parts were plain with no tread plate detail. The two tiny loops were added using the LR supplied parts for this side with another three added to the opposite side. I took care to construct the base in firing mode vs. travel mode since the LR kit is designed to be the towed version. I also carefully attached the bearing races for the gun elevation so they would remain positionable, something the Tamiya instructions tell you about but the LR ones do not.

The gun was then installed to the mount along with the ammo feed tray in LR Step 3. The weight of the gun and barrel made it immediately apparent that I would have to fix the gun into position before mounting it into the vehicle.  

I test fit the gun into the Tamiya mounting point and then ran a small bit of liquid glue into the elevation races to secure the gun at the desired angle. Once that had dried and I could handle it without it shifting, I added the rest of the gun equipment in the form of the ready ammunition rack on the left side for the LR Step 4. This was a very delicate operation to install it properly has it is mounted in a swivel between the two supports, so I had to use gravity and some strategically positioned toothpicks to get it to dry in the correct position.

I also installed the styrene part that the LR kit provides as the mount post for the splinter shield even though it's not called out in the instructions, it's there just like in the Tamiya kit. In an oddly complicated alternative, the LR instructions actually call for using a length of brass rod and two PE parts to form the mount and the brass rod is conveniently provided as part of the set...yet the styrene part will do just fine if you don't want to go that route.

The right side also received quite a bit of attention with the crew seats added along with the gun laying wheels. The gun sight was also constructed and installed and I used a drill bit to deepen the eye piece and to drill out the external face since it was solid. I used the Eduard PE piece for the shell ejector tray since the LR part didn't have any bend lines provided which would've made that a much harder proposition to get it bent to the right shape.

Next up will come the big challenge, constructing the splinter shield and mounting that.

 Hello wbill76,

 A very neat build so far, the 37mm AA gun looks great. That LR barrel is a cool tool. I was wondering about those. I believe they are sold seperately as detail upgrade for the Tamiya gun. The toothpick embossing tip will come in handy, when ever I get around to building that Panther in the "Stash Horde". Thanks for posting.

 Best Regards,

Mobious wrote:

Hello wbill76,  A very neat build so far, the 37mm AA gun looks great. That LR barrel is a cool tool. I was wondering about those. I believe they are sold seperately as detail upgrade for the Tamiya gun. The toothpick embossing tip will come in handy, when ever I get around to building that Panther in the "Stash Horde". Thanks for posting.  Best Regards,

Thanks Mobious, you're right, the LR barrel is indeed sold separately. I know this because I have one in the stash that I acquired before the LR full kit was available. The LR kit is still worth the effort though IMHO as it includes the LR pieces for the gun shield which have some very nice detail on them but are going to take several soldering sessions and a lot of patience for me to assemble.

Wow great job! this build is making me won't to go buy the kit. GREAT work!

Stick Man, appreciate the comments! It's been an enjoyable build so far, the usual Tamiya quality on fit and engineering. If you can find one, I recommend it.

wing_nut wrote:

Nice PE work Bill.  The LR gun looks real nice too.   I was thinking about getting the LR barrel for the 251/17 Flak 38 I have been assigned in Dupes GB.  After seeing the barrel on your gun it is a must.

The one piece brass barrel with the flash guard integrated into it certainly makes for a nice touch. Not sure if their Flak 38 barrel is the same, usually for the 2.0cm barrel other makers like Armorscale or Griffon have the suppressor separate in brass from an aluminum barrel. Either way, it definitely is a plus over the typical styrene-molded barrels for sure.