McLaren MP4/6

Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Tuesday, September 12, 2023 10:34 AM

After a few coats of TS-26 Pure White have had plenty of time to dry, it's time to start masking…

The red was built up until it more or less matched the other parts painted the same color a decade or so ago. (Yes, it is the same batch of paint.)

This looks acceptable. Now it will sit and cure for at least a month, maybe two, maybe more.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Sunday, September 10, 2023 12:30 PM

A couple rounds of spot repairs in addition to the cracked areas at the cockpit, and a coat of white primer, and it looks ready for some TS-26 White.

By 2011 I had a pretty good idea of what the cause of the issue was, and after a dozen years I'm sure that I have figured out the root issue from working with the same paints in different applications and combinations on several other projects since I started this one. Those later ones all turned out well and have proven to be stable long term as well.

The fluorescent red cures at a much different rate than other TS colors and the clear. Yes, it dries in about the same time frame and even feels dry to the touch, but it takes a lot longer to fully cure than both most other TS colors and the clear. While the clear also takes longer to cure than many TS colors, if it is applied to the fluorescent red before the red is fully cured, it can shrink and pull the softer red paint out of shape as it did on this body. The process that has worked long term every time for me is simple, use a urethane clear coat instead of the lacquer clear and let the red dry for a good bit longer than other TS colors.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Tanker-Builder

Member since
October 2019
From: New Braunfels, Texas

Posted by Tanker-Builder on Sunday, September 10, 2023 6:27 AM

Aha!Still Problematic huh?

I have had that happen on some very intricate(Car of the Future Type, Customs)Some are still "Wonky" as you say. DOC.

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Tanker-Builder

Member since
October 2019
From: New Braunfels, Texas

Posted by Tanker-Builder on Sunday, September 10, 2023 6:24 AM

Hi!

I find at this point in building, that YES! it's gonna work and start getting all enthusiastic again. Looking Good!

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Friday, September 8, 2023 6:04 PM

Much of the layers of red and white were clearly softened by the brake fluid, but nothing sloughed off as hoped. I scraped the gummy-ish paint off and gave it a good water rinse before wet sanding for the better part of the afternoon. I should have taken a photo, but I went straight to sanding since it was still almost as nasty looking as the earlier photos. Overall I am pleased with the progress.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Friday, September 8, 2023 5:56 PM

Yes, I am moving in the right direction. Purple Power would not touch this. 10-12 years of drying time, some in a dehydrator too made it pretty tough stuff.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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keavdog

Member since
April 2003
From: USA

Posted by keavdog on Friday, September 8, 2023 10:31 AM

Hate backpeddling but looks like you're making progress. I've had some luck removing paint with Testors ELO (pricey) and Purple Power.

Thanks,

John

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Friday, September 8, 2023 9:19 AM

I decided to try brake fluid. I am not a big fan of using it for stripping due to the damage it can do to some plastics, but even the 100% denatured alcohol wasn't cutting through the older paint. I mummified the body with wetted paper towels and let it soak like this for about half a day. The red bleeding out looked like a good sign.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Friday, September 8, 2023 9:17 AM

The sides/rear are a different situation.

I softened the red a little with more alcohol and tried to scrape it off. The right side was always more troublesome during the curing issues than the left for some reason. It is many layers deep and rather nasty.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Thursday, September 7, 2023 10:39 AM

I softened the front section with alcohol and was able to scrape much of it off, then I hand sanded it smooth. Some of the red on the rear peeled off too, with a good amount of forceful persuasion. What had peeled off easily was only on the surface. There's still a lot of paint under it.

There is good news as the cracks near the windshield were in the paint, not the plastic.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Wednesday, September 6, 2023 10:30 AM

I washed it up to get a better idea of what I was dealing with.

The only option, as I see it, is to strip it. Unfortunately the many layers of paint might as well be a combination of CA and stucco. About 15% of it peeled off to what appears to be the base white. I guess I forgot how many layers of both white and red paint I applied trying to get this to look decent and most of the red is now hard as glass and really well adhered. (So it does eventually cure.)

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Tuesday, September 5, 2023 12:01 PM

To recap, I started this in September of 2009. In January of 2011 I started noticing paint issues like cracking on the nose. At that point it was all TS paints including the clear. I fixed the nose by hand painting the damaged decals and then I sealed it in urethane. Then the paint on the rear wing went bad and I had to make new decals as replacements were not available. For five years I chased the paint on the main body. In my mind I had to keep using the same TS paints until I could get a stable finish and apply the decals. Then the plan was to clear it with urethane (as I had done with the nose and rear wing). I would get it looking nice and a few to several months later it would pick up waves or even wrinkles. I'd sand and buff them out, wait until the paint seemed cured and stable only to have it happen somewhere else.

Well, the paint never stabilized as of 2016 so I went on to several bigger and better projects and let the body sit in a safe place. Out of sight, out of mind...

And it really got bad; wavy, wrinkly and just plain wonky over the years. The body actually cracked somehow. I'm not sure if it was due to the paint, but it wouldn't surprise me. From this point on I am sharing the current salvage work after putting it on hold for over nine years.

Here is what I'm re-starting with after I peeled some of the clear off. I'm surprised it shed that so easily.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Monday, September 4, 2023 1:31 PM

This is from 9-4-2015 (exactly 8 years ago):

It’s been well over a year since I last updated the work I’ve been doing on the body. Every month or two I’d sand the wrinkles out and let it set, only to have new ones appear. Sand them out, wait and repeat. It looks like it might have finally stabilized, but I won’t be too surprised if it reoccurs either. After all, it’s been the better part of five years since I started painting the body…

Last night I took another stab at it and after sanding out some ripples I blended in some red on the right side and sharpened up the lines on the front with some white.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Friday, September 1, 2023 1:44 PM

Thanks Greg! But it's not done yet...

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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gregbale

Member since
March 2003
From: Towson MD

Posted by gregbale on Thursday, August 31, 2023 2:35 PM

Superb level of finish overall. Really beautiful work! Yes Beer Yes Beer

Greg

George Lewis:

"Every time you correct me on my grammar I love you a little fewer."

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Thursday, August 31, 2023 10:00 AM

OK, this thing has been sitting for quite a while (many months) due to the paint fighting with itself on the main body. Most of the car is done; I just need to finish the body. A few times I sanded out the wrinkles (on the right rear) and touched up the paint only to have the issue come back a month or so later, so I stopped touching it up but continued to sand out the wrinkles as they appeared every few months. I thought I had won the battle back in April 2012, but sadly the same thing happened a little while after I painted it once again.

I continued to sand it as problems manifested, but I noticed it has been pretty stable all year.

It’s been about 6-8 months since I last sanded the problem area and it looked the same as when I last checked.

First I had to blend the white base in, and I found by tinting white primer with yellow and pink I could apply less paint and get an even blendable base. Then I started building up the Fluorescent Red.

You can see what I painted yesterday does not match, (it is too pale and lacking vibrancy, and not 100% uniform), but it is all the paint I can apply this round.

Today I built up some more TS-36. Still not there, but getting closer…

It still needs another round of paint, but I’ll probably let this dry for a while to make masking easier…

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Tim Kidwell

Moderator

Member since
September 2011

Posted by Tim Kidwell on Monday, August 28, 2023 1:06 PM

Test. Test. Test.

--

Timothy Kidwell
tkidwell@firecrown.com
Editor
Scale Model Brands
Firecrown Media

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Sunday, August 27, 2023 6:48 PM

I left the body to dry in a closet for a more than five months due to the paint wrinkling issue. It seemed like it had cured and might be stable…

So I sanded out the defects and reshot a white base let that dry/cure for a while and then built up and blended the TS-36 Fluorescent Red into the rest of the rear section. It looks like I may be on my way to saving it as it still looks like this after about 24 hours… Only time will tell…

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Sunday, August 27, 2023 6:40 PM

Months later...

I was finally able to fix the paint that was not drying correctly. I sanded out the cracked areas on the nose section and repainted it. You can see it was being problematic for a while and that I had tried to repaint it before by the "tree rings". Here is how nasty it was looking while being sanded out and reworked…

As for the main red section of the body, I sanded out part of it and found that TS-36 can be successfully blended into finished areas of the same paint, so I only had to paint part of that big area. I applied the paint very, very slowly this time only by airbrush over an 8 hour period, lightly building it up and paying close attention to the blend lines. Once it proves to me that it is stable, I’ll move onto decals and clear coat…

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Friday, August 25, 2023 9:59 AM

Kind of like that, but more like cracks and fissures that developed weeks after the paint was dry to the touch.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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keavdog

Member since
April 2003
From: USA

Posted by keavdog on Thursday, August 24, 2023 4:26 PM

Something like this happen? Tamiya Blue over Tamiya White primer and then Tamiya TS-13. Strangest thing.

Thanks,

John

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Thursday, August 24, 2023 12:22 PM

Now we're getting to what ultimately sidelined this project for a decade.

I used Tamiya Fine White Primer as the base, and then applied TS-26 over all parts that were to be white or Fl. Red. The white was allowed to dry and cure fully before the TS-36 was applied.

Once the TS-36 was built up, I sprayed a few light "sealer" coats of TS-13 over all the white and Fl. Red areas. Not moderate, not heavy coats, and within the standard recoat safe timeframe.

All was fine, for several weeks while it sat in a closet to dry/cure.

Then it went wonky and I had to chase the problems as they presented themselves... It sat again for quite a while.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Tuesday, August 22, 2023 10:51 AM

The rear wing is assembled. Tamiya paints and SMS C/F decals…

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Monday, August 21, 2023 9:25 PM

And now the front wing is done… I had to hand repaint the Shell lettering after the decals cracked under the Tamiya clear. C/F is SMS. The Goodyear decals are a pair that I made.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Monday, August 21, 2023 10:28 AM

I had some paint issues that necessitated stripping some parts and sanding out others and repainting them. The rear wing end plates had to be stripped and I had to make replacement decals since they are not available from Tamiya.

Build what you want and build it for yourself, the rest will follow... Mark D. Jones

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Scale-Master

Member since
October 2020

Posted by Scale-Master on Friday, August 18, 2023 3:26 PM

Just a reminder, this project is 14 years old. The painting of the body started in 2010. These posts are a recap of that time frame.

Finally the body has the paint on it. Tamiya Pure White and Fluorescent Red. The nose has the decals and final clear coat on it...

The lettering on the wings cracked several months after being clear coated with the Tamiya clear, so I hand painted the lettering and re-cleared with urethane. This picture is before clear coating.