Choosing an Airbrush

Have a scan through my website and you'll find information on several Badger models.  Maybe that will help you decide.

Don

Matt575

Hi, I am looking at buying a new airbrush. I have started airbrushing in about May, with an Aztek A320, a single action.  I would like to go to a double action brush, but with so many different models out im pretty confused. All i want is something that can spray both fine lines, and broad areas, not a different  airbrush for each job. Im looking into a badger, because the price is right for me, which is no more than $100. Can anyone help point me in the right direction with a Badger, they have so many models out that i dont know where to start. Thanks!

I have also looked at the Aztek A470, but i would like to stick with metal construction.

If you enjoy modeling and are there to stay, the airbrush is one of the investment that can last you a life time. It is a good idea to find the airbrush locally and hold it in your hand before buying it. Feel the balance of the airbrush and the smoothness of the trigger action.

My personal favorite are the Iwata and Harder & Steenbeck. When I look for an airbrush, a few things just came to mind:

1. It balances well in my hand.
2. The trigger is silky smooth without play to give me a feeling of precise control.
3. Easy to clean by backflushing and easy to disassemble for cleaning.
4. High quality nozzle and needle that is more resistent to damage or bending. No plastic part.
5. It atomize well over range of paint consistance.

Last, but not the least, reasonably price and easy access to spare parts.

This info might help you some.  Grex is my first choice followed by Iwata. Check your local hobby or craft store...those with discount coupons can bring an otherwise out of price range airbrush into grasp.

  Check with your local hobby shops... Michael's or Hobby Lobby to find out what airbrushes they sell.  I used 40% coupon to buy my Iwata Eclipse at Hobby Lobby and they stock replacement parts BUT not all parts are stocked so you can make a quick trip if necessary. 

I kinda hesitate to post this but, I'm switching camps. I just bought an Iwata Revolution CR and am thoroughly impressed. So much so that I'll be placing an order for a BR very soon. They're basically an Eclipse with a different nozzle system. Everything from the cup back, except for the cutaway handle, is the same as an Eclipse.  Yes, you have to use a wrench to remove the nozzle but I can live with that.

Now let me tell you why. Also let me say, I don't mean to bash Badger, I've used nothing but them for years. Until now...

I almost bought a 105 Patriot but went with this instead. So, I can't compare it directly with the 105 and will have to substitute my 360U with the Patriot fine needle/nozzle/regulator combo. That means they're both using .50mm nozzles/tips and needles. Trigger response is almost immediate on the CR, it takes very little movement to start paint flow. The 360 isn't bad but there is a delay. The CR will spray consistently and smoothly as low as 3 psi. The 360 needs 7 - 8 psi. The CR uses a lot less air than the 360.  A lot. The CR has a 1/3 ounce cup and the 360 has a 1/16 ounce cup. Fill the tank to 100 psi, set the regulator to 10 psi and both will use right at 80 psi out of the tank to shoot two cups of paint. That's 5 times as much paint out of the CR with the same amount of air. Pull a line with the CR and it has a much sharper edge than the 360. Pull the trigger wide open and the CR will flow a lot more paint than the 360. I've used the 360 for almost 8 years, I've had the CR for a week. The CR is easier to pull a consistent line with. The CR will pull a thinner line. Pull the trigger back to what you want and you can spray that whole cup of paint at that position. With the 360, you're going to have to make some slight adjustments as you go along. And after shooting enamels, lacquers, both Tamiya and Model Master acrylics, even automotive primer and just flushing after each one there was no paint build-up or residue in the nozzle on the CR. Acrylics always build-up in the nozzles/tips on my Badgers(and I have several).

Here's another little thing that I've always wondered about with other brushes. My 360 has a cutaway handle and when you pull the trigger you can see the back of the needle deflect. It doesn't come straight back, it lifts as it comes back. Try it without paint in the brush and you can see that the tip of the needle rides against one side of the nozzle as you pull the trigger. You'll even get rub marks on one side of the tip of the needle. The CR doesn't do that. Screw off the handle and watch the back end of the needle and it comes straight back. Watch the tip of the needle in the nozzle and it stays centered. Maybe that's why the line edges are sharper. And my 360 was refurbed by Badger this summer. New teflon needle bearing and collar for the front of the brush so it isn't worn out and has always done that.

So, there ya go. I've always wondered what life was like on the other side and now I know. Even with the most inexpensive true Iwata. You can go to Coast Airbrush or Chicago Airbrush and get a Revolution for $72.95 shipped. Not sure about Coast but Chicago will still apply the free shipping if you add an airline. I bought mine from Chicago because they had a discount last week, 7% off. I added a couple of parts to the order and had to pay shipping. That was $5.95 for Priority Mail. Ordered overnite on Thursday, got an email Friday afternoon that it had shipped with a confirmation number and it arrived on Monday. I like everything about it. I'm happy.

Tony

PS...Free shipping from either place will be UPS Ground so will probably take a little longer.

A really interesting comparison, Tony.  I wish you could have compared the Iwata directly with a Patriot though.  I wonder if some of the differences are due to the rotating joint gimmick.  I know there will be some variation from unit to unit in production, but on my Patriot at least, the needle seems perfectly centered when I pull it back.  I also wonder how the Revolution would compare with the Badger 100 with a similar tip design.

Don

Thanks for the all help guys! I know i can get the Iwata Revolution for a great price, but my only concern is from reading about it, is it able to spray fine lines? Or will you have to buy a seprate nozzle/needle? I would really like to stick with a gravity feed airbrush, seems easier to clean and such. Im really interested in the Patriot model from badger, as it's perfect for my budget, thanks for all the advice!

Matt

Some loyalist of other brands might disagree. But I've been using my AZTEK A470 Double action for 12 years. Recently (About 3 months ago) I complimented it with the Metal Version. I have nozzles 10 years old and a few from the original A470 kit in great working order from 12 years ago. Building time is limited (IMHO), so pulling an airbrush apart for cleaning just complicates the hobby even more. That's why I love my AZTEKS because my building/painting time is very productive. I've got a Paasche Talon which is a great airbrush but cleaning needles is no my gig. From ultra fine lines, to high-flow and spatter acrylic nozzles I don't need anything else. Love my AZTEKS!

PS,

If you just want the Aztek metal, Testors has it if you call them for $75 body only. Good deal if you have already a collection of nozzles. Don't look for the body only on the web, AFAIK, is a Testors direct item.

Wingman_kz

I kinda hesitate to post this but, I'm switching camps. I just bought an Iwata Revolution CR and am thoroughly impressed. So much so that I'll be placing an order for a BR very soon. They're basically an Eclipse with a different nozzle system. Everything from the cup back, except for the cutaway handle, is the same as an Eclipse.  Yes, you have to use a wrench to remove the nozzle but I can live with that.

Now let me tell you why. Also let me say, I don't mean to bash Badger, I've used nothing but them for years. Until now...

So, there ya go. I've always wondered what life was like on the other side and now I know.

Tony

LOL, Tony. This post brings back a lot of the sweet memory during the great SOTAR HISTORY thread during April 2010. Now that you switch camp. (It is actually not that bad to be called trolls.)

I have neither the Iwata CR nor the Badger 360. I have the Iwata Eclipse with the large nozzle and the Badger 105 Fine nozzle, both of which have 0.5 mm nozzle diameter similar to your setup. But the Eclipse needles (both 0.35 and 0.5 mm) have much longer taper than the Badger. Similar to your experience, the Badger needs higher pressure to get good atomization. But contrary to your experience, the Badger opens up for paint much faster with a bare touch of the trigger. And I do not have the needle rubbing the nozzle wall issue you have.

I still believe that the nozzle size and the needle taper has a lot to do with the airbrush performance. Here are some of the measurements that I collected. The Renegade values were posted by Don Wheeler.

A needle that has a long taper and small tip angle works better for drawing fine lines. But it also requires the manufacturer to use better material to avoid easy damage or bending of the needle tip. The needle should look polished when delievered from factory.

El Taino

Some loyalist of other brands might disagree. But I've been using my AZTEK A470 Double action for 12 years. Recently (About 3 months ago) I complimented it with the Metal Version. I have nozzles 10 years old and a few from the original A470 kit in great working order from 12 years ago. Building time is limited (IMHO), so pulling an airbrush apart for cleaning just complicates the hobby even more. That's why I love my AZTEKS because my building/painting time is very productive. I've got a Paasche Talon which is a great airbrush but cleaning needles is no my gig. From ultra fine lines, to high-flow and spatter acrylic nozzles I don't need anything else. Love my AZTEKS!

As someone who has never touched one, the Aztek airbrush is an enigma to me.  How can one device be so loved by some and so hated by others.  Some say it works fine until it breaks, but it breaks often.  I assume from your comments that yours hasn't.  Some have written that they got tired of buying new nozzles all the time.  You have some that are 12 years old!  Amazing!  Do you have any theory why so many have problems with it?  Are you extra gentle or extra careful?  I'm tempted to buy one just to find out for myself what they're like.  But, with the arsenal I already own, that would be hard to justify.

Don

Hello Don, a pleasure to answer. In all the time I have my Aztek, it only broke once and it was nearly a year ago. Little over 10 years without a hitch. It was sent to Testors, they promised a very short turnaround and they did, in fact, I have the feeling that they sent me either a new copy or they detail cleaned mine after fixing it. The nozzles that I have lost, have been 100% my fault. Cleaning is the keyword. I own at least 2 tips of each. They come handy when changing colors. Once I finish one color, I drop the tip immediately in paint thinner for enamels or warm water for acrylics.

Our paints are formulated to stick to plastic, well, the tips are made of plastic so their worst enemy is dried up paint. In case I was very busy and paint got dried, I then use lacquer thinner for clean up. Other than that, I clean them with the AZTEK Airbrush Cleaner by spraying thru the nozzles at least 2 or 3cc of the cleaner. Sounds and seems cheesy but it removes traces and paint pigment leftover in the needles. I don't want to contradict myself, there is not much if any to disasemble, so the cleaning is basically done by spraying thinner thru it in a cleaning station unlike having to pull apart my Paasche Talon.

Happy New Year!

keilau, what can I say? If you have the .5mm set-up for your Eclipse you're using the same needle that's in the CR. Different nozzle of course. The Eclipse and Revolution use the same trigger, airvalve, needle tube, chuck, springs. The CS and CR use the same needle seals. I figured for almost $50 difference I'd try the CR. Since it's working well the BR version will be next. Then maybe an Eclipse BCS. I still like using bottles too and that would give me a chance to get acquainted with the Eclipse series.

Don, I wish I could make a direct comparison. The 360 is close as I can get though. Originally I was going with the new Renegade when it's released but really just needed a general purpose gravity feed. The 105 was what I had in mind but since they were so close in price and I'd never tried one I went with the Revolution. I really don't know how much any given airbrush varies from one example to another. You'd think they would be close but who knows. Maybe I just got a good one but I like it.

Matt, I haven't changed anything on this Revolution. It's just like it came out of the box. Except for the hose adapter. I started to order the .30mm needle and nozzle but figured I'd see what it did out of the box first. It does fine.

Don't take this as bashing either. My first brush was an Aztec. I still have it. I think it's a 4709. It gave me fits originally but I dug it out earlier this year and used it a bit. The biggest problem I had with it in the beginning was trying to adjust it to work as a double action. Don't know if they're all like this but this version can be adjusted to work as a single or double action. It was kind of like getting a transmission stuck between gears and didn't want to work at all. The other problem was sticking needles. It was new to me but I should have figured it out sooner. Aztec nozzles are normally open. When you screw them into the airbrush body the plunger in the body pushes them closed. If that plunger is adjusted out too far it will cause the needle to stick closed in the nozzle and if you don't realize you've done that and change nozzles it may stick that one too. Once I figured that out I didn't have any more trouble with nozzles and once I got it to shoot in double action I just never messed with that feature again. It will spray and sprays pretty well. But after using other brushes it just sets in the box. Mainly because of the way it sets in your hand.

Don, if you want to try it out I'll send it to you.

Tony

I feel you Tony, I get those Aztek nozzles stuck, but it is very rare. They should not be over tightened and that's the major reason for that to happen. I find the Aztek much more ergonomic in my small hands than my Paasche Talon. Especially for long periods of fine detailing the Aztek feels very well balanced. The only thing I miss on the metal version, is the rubbery grip from the plastic version. There are other options, and good ones I know. But the convenience of changing nozzles and colors so fast an easy, plus the fact that I can leave the nozzles submerged in cleaner 'til I get the chance to come back and clean them all, makes me look no further.

Happy new year mate!

I use an iwata HP-CS.  It has served me well from painting 1/72 figures with the needle guard off on low presure, all the way up to painting 1/8 Lexan R/C bodies.  The only issue I have when spraying the 1/8 bodies is a I wish the cup was bigger.

Cleaning is easy, I shoot acylics so I wipe out the cup with a rag and alchohol and the spray through.  I remove the needle sometimes which is fast and easy

Wingman_kz

keilau, what can I say? If you have the .5mm set-up for your Eclipse you're using the same needle that's in the CR. Different nozzle of course. The Eclipse and Revolution use the same trigger, airvalve, needle tube, chuck, springs. The CS and CR use the same needle seals. I figured for almost $50 difference I'd try the CR. Since it's working well the BR version will be next. Then maybe an Eclipse BCS. I still like using bottles too and that would give me a chance to get acquainted with the Eclipse series.

Most of the time, I use the 0.35 mm nozzle setup in the Iwata Eclipse HP-CS. It is my go-to airbrush for modeling and gets used most of the time.

I got the Badger Patriot 105 Fine out of curiosity because many at this forum compared it to the CS. They are not even close in characteristics. The 105 is much more a quick draw type airbrush with a very sensitive trigger. It is more tolerant of paint thinning, but needs higher pressure for good atomization. It works fine as a large area airbrush because it can dispense paint faster.

I got the 0.5 mm nozzle/needle/crown set for the Iwata Eclipse because it was cheap and allowed me to do a direct comparison to the Patriot in same size nozzle. Total cost was $18 at Hobby Lobby. The parts are for the Eclipse BS (syphon feed) airbrush. I was hoping to sell the Patriot. As it turned out, the 0.5 mm CS is a lot closer to the 0.35 mm CS than to the Patriot in term of paint thinning and trigger response. I would expect that it is almost identical to your Iwata Revolution CR in characteristics if not in hardware. As you also observed, the Iwata draws line with sharper edges.

B-1 Nut posted a review of the Badger Renegade Velocity at ARC Forum recently. He compared it to an Iwata Revolution CR. He switched camp in opposite direction. LOL.

When Don Wheeler reviewed the Master G-22, he compared it to the old style Iwata HP-C in appearance. It sure will be very revealing if Don can do a in depth comparison of the Iwata HP-C vs. the Badger Renegade.

Matt575

... I would like to go to a double action brush, but with so many different models out im pretty confused. All i want is something that can spray both fine lines, and broad areas, not a different  airbrush for each job. Im looking into a badger, because the price is right for me, which is no more than $100....

Have a look at Harbor Freight's dual action airbrush. It's all-metal construction, capable of wide pattern and also very fine line spraying. And the best part? It's usually on sale for fifteen bucks! Add the optional air hose for around $6, and for the price it can't be beat.

ModelNerd

Matt575:

... I would like to go to a double action brush, but with so many different models out im pretty confused. All i want is something that can spray both fine lines, and broad areas, not a different  airbrush for each job. Im looking into a badger, because the price is right for me, which is no more than $100....

 

Have a look at Harbor Freight's dual action airbrush. It's all-metal construction, capable of wide pattern and also very fine line spraying. And the best part? It's usually on sale for fifteen bucks! Add the optional air hose for around $6, and for the price it can't be beat.

I hope that you will not tell us that all those wonderfully finished models at the ModelShack site were all done with a Harbor Freight's dual action airbrush.

Yes, it is a good airbrush for the money and a good way for someone who is not sure about modeling as a hobby to try out airbrushing. But, on the other hand, for the price of a good model kit, there are too many better options.

You know, if I could afford it I'd have one of everything when it comes to airbrushes. I just like to play with them. Guess it goes back to being a little kid in the hobby shop and trying to talk my parents into buying one for me.

I saw the thread you linked to keilau. And reading over at ARC had a lot to do with trying out the Revolution. RichardL does some very nice work with his BR and CR. I went to the Iwata site and read Cyrus Tan's article on converting the CR to a .30mm needle and nozzle. Matter of fact, I studied that picture he posted of his test sheet for quite a while and wondered just how he pulled that off. There's a lot of continuous lines there. Or rather, a few lines that go on for a long time. lol I can't get them quite that fine with the .50 needle but was surprised at just how easy it was to go on and on and on.

Oh well. It's all good, whatever pulls your trigger, etc. It is just a tool but nice tools make the work easier...

Tony

Thanks for all the info guys! The airbrush i ended up buying was actually the Badger 155 Anthem. From reading around it sounded pretty good, and i was able to get 50%off at a Michael's craft store.

So now i need to start looking into a compressor, as for the months i started airbrushing with my a320, i used propellant cans. So I know a tank would be better for mantaining the air pressure...So these are the ones i'm looking at. I would like to keep it no more than 200. So here are the ones i have looked at.

Paasche D3000, looks good, as a tank- http://www.chicagoairbrushsupply.com/d3000.html

Grex AC1810, read reviews that said it keeps the same air pressure, and people say its quiet http://www.chicagoairbrushsupply.com/grac18hppopi1.html

And this Silentaire Scorpion I-C, i dont know much about these compressors, except that quite a few people use them- http://www.chicagoairbrushsupply.com/scicaircobys.html

So any help would great, if you have used any of these and have some info about them, even better!

Matt575

Thanks for all the info guys! The airbrush i ended up buying was actually the Badger 155 Anthem. From reading around it sounded pretty good, and i was able to get 50%off at a Michael's craft store.

So now i need to start looking into a compressor, as for the months i started airbrushing with my a320, i used propellant cans. So I know a tank would be better for mantaining the air pressure...So these are the ones i'm looking at. I would like to keep it no more than 200. So here are the ones i have looked at.

Paasche D3000, looks good, as a tank- http://www.chicagoairbrushsupply.com/d3000.html

Grex AC1810, read reviews that said it keeps the same air pressure, and people say its quiet http://www.chicagoairbrushsupply.com/grac18hppopi1.html

And this Silentaire Scorpion I-C, i dont know much about these compressors, except that quite a few people use them- http://www.chicagoairbrushsupply.com/scicaircobys.html

So any help would great, if you have used any of these and have some info about them, even better!

Yes, they all can work with the Badger 155. But they are better fit for gravity feed airbrush with finer nozzle.

The airbrush you pick can benefit from a stronger compressor. At your price range, you can consider:

1. The Paasche DA400R, or

1. The Sparmax TC-2000.

The twin piston compressors can provide over 1 CFM at 40 psi or higher, which twice the airflow of those you picked. And these compressor are comparable in prices.

My only concern is that neither of those have a tank, will they be able to maintain the desired psi? The compressor doesn't have to be silent, but it shouldn't shake the whole room. Is a tank that big of necessity?

Congrats Matt, I'm sure you'll be happy with it. And the good thing is you should have easy access to a needle or tip if you need it. With a 40 or 50% off coupon they're very inexpensive. Beats having to order, pay shipping and wait. Plus they sell the Badger Fast Blast caps and bottles too. At least the one close to me does.

Of the compressors you listed I'd go with the Paasche because of the tank. I've never used one of these but here's a link to one from Airbrush Depot that TCP Global sells. Scroll down to TC-196. Combines the type of compressor keilau mentioned with a tank. I use an Iwata Sprint Jet and run it to a 3 gallon tank from an old compressor. It's always been able to keep up with my 360 in gravity mode with a bottle but does have to run all the time. I've gotten it pretty warm but it keeps on pumping. If I keep living in apartments my next one will be a twin cylinder. The reason I ran it to a tank is that it would pulse a little at lower pressures. Not bad but enough to notice.

Tony

I have a Badger 200. Love it. It's a single action, but has a knob that controls the flow of the paint in the back, thus acting like a poor-mans double-action. Well under $100 too.

Matt575

My only concern is that neither of those have a tank, will they be able to maintain the desired psi? The compressor doesn't have to be silent, but it shouldn't shake the whole room. Is a tank that big of necessity?

With the modern design piston driven compressors, an airtank is still nice to have, but not necessary anymore. I added one to my Paasche DA400 and it made no difference to the performance. The key is getting a good compressor with a quiet and powerful motor. It is important to choose a compressor that runs quiet and cool. It is an indication of good design and long endurance.

When you look at compressor specifications, look for (airflow) CFM at (pressure) psi. Some seller said psi at zero or no or open flow. It does not count. For the Badger 155, it can work with a compressor spec at 0.5 CFM at 20 psi with some limitations. But it will be happier with a compressor spec at 0.7 CFM at 40 psi or higher. Let us know what you pick.

You can find the review of the old Paasche DA400 in the compressor roundup in the July 2008 issue of FSM. You can also find some good tips on what to look in the roundup article too.

One disclaimer about the Paasche compressors. They used to source their compressors from Sparmax in Taiwan who are known for reliability. Paasche switched to supplier in China in 2008. I have no information on the durability of their made-in-China compressors.

One day I will buy my white whale compressor, the silentaire 20A.  I would love to have a 30db compressor.  I just haven't wanted to drop $500 on one when my current one is still fully functional.

BlakeyB

One day I will buy my white whale compressor, the silentaire 20A.  I would love to have a 30db compressor.  I just haven't wanted to drop $500 on one when my current one is still fully functional.

I am waiting for someone to import this from Fengda Bida:

The 43 dB-A noise level falls a little short of the SuperSilent. But it is plenty quiet for most.

That is really quiet and with a tank. How much does it run.  Can't find a price on the site

Right now im probably looking at the Paasche DA400, and the TCP equivalent, the TC-196. I would think the paasche would run better, because its a name brand, but again I have no idea about the qualaity of these. The main thing I build are 72 and 48 scale aircraft and some armour. Will the DA400 be able to handle that without a tank? I know lots of questions, but i guess its better to ask them now.

Matt

Matt575

Right now im probably looking at the Paasche DA400, and the TCP equivalent, the TC-196. I would think the paasche would run better, because its a name brand, but again I have no idea about the qualaity of these.

It is not necessarily true. It may have come from the same factory in China. If you want quality, go with the Sparmax or the Iwata, which are made by the same supplier in Taiwan.

The main thing I build are 72 and 48 scale aircraft and some armour. Will the DA400 be able to handle that without a tank? I know lots of questions, but i guess its better to ask them now.

Matt

Yes, the DA400 will handle them better than any of your original choice due to the more powerful motor and dual piston design. If you must have a tank, check out the BearAir Polar Bear 2100 too. The Polar Bear 1000, its little brother, got really good review in the 2008 FSM compressor roundup article. But the 2100 costs a bit more than the TC-196.

Just avoid those older design diaphram driven compressors at the local hobby shop or Michaels. They are overpriced, very low power and likely to have pulsation problem.