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RAF red.

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  • Member since
    January 2020
  • From: Maryland
RAF red.
Posted by wpwar11 on Sunday, March 28, 2021 12:58 PM

 Forgive me if I posted this in the wrong category.   I'm trying my hand at painting roundels on the Spitfire.  I'm using MRP RAF marking red for the center color.  The blue and yellow were accurate.  The red looks off.  Any thoughts?  It looks more orange/brownn compared to the decal.  If it helps its a MKI and I'm painting over white.  What's a better color for the red?

  • Member since
    April 2006
  • From: ON, Canada
Posted by jgeratic on Sunday, March 28, 2021 1:55 PM

The WW2 RAF roundel red was indeed a dull shade, often described as being close to a brick colour. Pre-war (or up to 1937) and post war (1947) was more a bright red.

A Paul Lucus publication provides FS matches that are close, but not exact.  Here are the values grouped together using the colorserver:

Compared to Nick Millman's readings, the FS sample of dull red could use a little more yellow.  Digitally, the MRP sample you have sprayed looks more correct.

 

regards,

Jack

  • Member since
    January 2020
  • From: Maryland
Posted by wpwar11 on Sunday, March 28, 2021 2:55 PM

Interesting.  The MRP certainly looks like the pre war red.  Thanks for that.

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Sunday, March 28, 2021 3:20 PM

I think that the big thing is that you're trying to match the decal as opposed to the actual color chip. The source of the decal red is unknown. Just match that as best you can, probably with a custom mix.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    January 2020
  • From: Maryland
Posted by wpwar11 on Sunday, March 28, 2021 4:09 PM

Thanks Stik.  I think as long as I'm consistent across the entire model I'll be fine.  I'm going to give it a go.

  • Member since
    April 2006
  • From: ON, Canada
Posted by jgeratic on Sunday, March 28, 2021 5:04 PM

Not too many decal manufacturers get the roundel colours correct for WW2 RAF.  Even for the blue, it's either too dark and on the verge of black, or it's too bright and lively. 

I suspect it may have something to do when going from a digital screen (RGB values) and how that is switched to CMYK when prepared for printing.  At least this was my experience when trying custom printing.  Mind you, a more professional outfit will take the time to match their inks to colour samples provided, but that is a lot more $$ as inks will be mixed beforehand.

The other problem is these wartime roundel colours are not part of the modern British Standards paint chart (BS 381C).

regards,

Jack

 

  • Member since
    January 2020
  • From: Maryland
Posted by wpwar11 on Sunday, March 28, 2021 5:57 PM

I know this topic can generate a fair share of opinions.  I've heard heated debate about WW2 aircraft colors.  I also heard very little was for certain when it came to Spitfires.  This is my first go with spraying the roundels.   Right red or wrong red hopefully everything will turn out ok.

  • Member since
    April 2020
Posted by Eaglecash867 on Sunday, March 28, 2021 6:01 PM

wpwar11

I also heard very little was for certain when it came to Spitfires. 

That is definitely true of the parts on those aircraft.  What fit on one airframe wouldn't necessarily fit on another...and usually didn't.

"You can have my illegal fireworks when you pry them from my cold, dead fingers...which are...over there somewhere."

  • Member since
    April 2006
  • From: ON, Canada
Posted by jgeratic on Sunday, March 28, 2021 7:27 PM

Roundels were painted to specification at the factory, so there is not much of anything to debate.

 I've quoted two researchers,  but of the two, Nick Millman made the extra effort to publish his findings on RAF colours in digital values (RGB).   These were based on L*a*b* values measured with photospectrometric equipment  from original MAP paint swatches.

Of course, there is some leeway to exact paint shades, since paint manufactures provided  products that would naturally vary to a certain percentage that was still deemed acceptable.


regards,
Jack

  • Member since
    May 2020
  • From: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Posted by Deeve_ on Monday, March 29, 2021 12:37 AM

I just painted some roudels on my Spitfire. I did a little research and used Vallejo Insignia white, RAL 1006 Yellow, Signal blue and a mix of Rust and Ferrari Red for the red. 3 drops rust and 2 drops Ferrari Red. Just my personal experience.

 In Progress.

1/72 Revell Arado AR-240-c2

1/72 Hasegawa Mitchell Mk.III RAAF

1/72 Italeri XB-70 Valkyrie

Deeve_

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