I give up

QUOTE: Originally posted by AH1Wsnake QUOTE: Originally posted by Tankmaster7 This is rapidly developing into a flame war methinks. Let's stop it here. Naaaaah...... I never even got the flamethrower warmed up!

You no wat methinks, That this post has became famous and not but turning into a mere skirmish not a flame war. Sorry if I offended youTankmaster7 pass the quote,lol.

whoa oddjob! arn't you supposed to throw your hat?!?!
sorry just had to say that.

When i started modeling, i was clueless, i tried to paint the decals on and cut of the supports for a cockpit, aplied, too much glue, didn't take care of my brushes,threw my models in frustration,I was just plain cluless, until.. i discovered FSM!!! they do have tips for the noob, like I, and help you. Some of the times you have to search for the tips, but most of the time there obvious. Please don't give up modeling just because of that! It's always great to see a fellow modeler. Oh!... if offeneded anyone, i'm sorry no harm!

KEEP MODELING

Here my $0.02....

I started subscribing to FSM magazine in the spring of 1986, whilst in high school. The first issue I received was the beginning of a series of articles with the theme "Basic Techniques <--> Advanced Results", meaning that one leads to another, another draws from one.

C'mon guys, if we want "flame wars" we can go to one of a multitude of blogger sites. (My favorite is "Ernie's House of Whoopa**", at www.ehowa.com)

I have to ditto on most of the posts.
they helped the beginners-which is me sort of- out a lot.
sorry if I ticked you off

It's a great time to be a beginner. Imagine life without the internet and the plethora of information that can be had in moments, all from within the comforts of home! I gotta hand it to the previous generations of scale modelers, they had to actually figure out their skills through trial and error. The information for beginners is out there, you just have to be willing to look for it!

Matter of fact, I think I'll make a webpage in my personal webspace dedicated to the absolute basics of scale modeling.

Well it looks like what this thread needed was some sandwiches and drinks.

As for me I am not really an FSM subscriber although I make it a point to pick a copy when I have extra money or when I see that the topics interest me. But if you ask me, I think it does cater to basically the newbies and the regular modelers. Rarely do I find something that really is intended for the really advanced modelers.

However, people have different understanding abilities so we have to expect that others may still see FSM as something that does not suit their needs.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Jeff_Herne A good analogy...I love the NY Yankees, and I love baseball. When the Yanks lose a game they should win, say, against the Orioles, sure, I complain. But I don't stop watching them !! (Please don't hold it against me that I'm a Yankees fan) :-)

Jeff,

That is a good analogy (except that I'm an Orioles fan!). I wonder if part of the problem is that people in general tend to focus too narrowly on the subjects of the articles in FSM and not enough on their content.

I'm sure this has been mentioned before, but I've found plenty of cool tips in articles about building armor kits that I was able to apply to aircraft kits.

Just my $.02

Regards,

It is impossible to be everything for everyone, especially when you are limited by the number of pages you can run in each issue. If FSM were to try to cover every aspect of the hobby in each issue, they'd be 400 pages each!!

As an experienced modeler, I generally do not gleen much from the basic or how-to articles targeted towards newer modelers. That's because I've been there, done that, and bought the proverbial T-shirt.

That's not to say that I'm not interested, because helping new modelers is something I take immense pride in doing. My skills were learned from a retired USAF B-36 Nuclear Weapons Specialist, and I must admit I didn't have the trials and tribulations of learning by trial and error. When he passed away (he was like a grandfather to me as a kid), I swore that I would try to continue his legacy of teaching and helping out new modelers. This brings enjoyment to the hobby and minimizes the frustration of your models not looking like those on the box tops.

The hardest thing to do (in my humble opinion) is to strike a balance within each issue that offers something for everyone. When you consider the individual groups of modelers, beginner to experienced, aircraft to armor, ships to cars, its an accomplishment in itself to keep people happy. Inevitably, there will always be someone who feels that a particular issue was better or worse than the last, because that particular issue may or may not have something in it that is of use to them.

A good analogy...I love the NY Yankees, and I love baseball. When the Yanks lose a game they should win, say, against the Orioles, sure, I complain. But I don't stop watching them !!

(Please don't hold it against me that I'm a Yankees fan) :-)

Just one man's opinion, that's all.

Jeff

C'mon guys be fair, you're making me hungry!

I'm a amature bodybuilder so Baloney is out of the question! Which brings me to another point.....why is it that all my buddies seem to think I'm really sad for enjoying making miniature versions of real craft?? Is there some unwritten rule that bodybuilders/weight trainers can't make models???

They always tease me. They say that the Hulk never built models, he just broke the real one's. They wouldn' like me when I'm angry!

:o)

LOL....I was getting hungry reading this post, Brian!

QUOTE: Originally posted by boybuddho

Is that the baloney sandwich I mentioned in my first post, Dan (Boybuddho)?

Man, that looks good! You know, you can't get good baloney here in Japan...



Tankmaster, I don't think anybody is flaming anybody here. Just exchanging opinions! That's what forums are all about.

Dan (Trowlfazz), thanks for the clarification. I asked because I sincerely wanted to know your opinion.

Dwight, yes indeedy, nothing goes better with baloney than an ice-cold Coke!

Anyway, I guess I've said all I can about this. Here's hoping Vyrus did indeed read the replies to his/her post and at least reconsiders participating here in the forums.

Well as a beginner I found this post rather interesting (and amusing). I've never read FSM as I can't seem to get hold of it in the UK (anyone help?) but I've read such magazines as Tamiya Monthly, Scale Modeller etc and find them to cater for all modellers on many levels of skill. That said you can't please 100% of people 100% of the time but even I feel that vyruses comments were from sheer frustration rather than being constructive. I sure hope though that he reads these replies and carries on with this most enjoyable hobby.

(2nd) Dan

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tankmaster7 This is rapidly developing into a flame war methinks. Let's stop it here.

Naaaaah......
I never even got the flamethrower warmed up!

Thanks buddy. You're the best.

Hey Dan, got Coke with that?

Tanky, try Scale Aviation Modeller International. It's a British Mag, but distributed in the US by Kalmbach, the parent Co. of FSM. It covers more advanced techniques & very in-depth build reviews. Also, much broader coverage of new kit & AM products.

Regards, Rick

This is rapidly developing into a flame war methinks. Let's stop it here. Oh and BTW can anyone direct me to a magazine that carries slightly mroe advanced thechiniques as well?

I can't even figure out what level I am. I am perfectly comfortable with some of the topics mentioned her, as beginners, but not with some. And I am comfortable with some more advanced techniques. I would like to see FSM taking a more mid level approach. With articles on hot to make RESIN COKPITS FIT!!!!! (you are mostly all familiar with the trouble I was having recently) and tips on applying AM PE and the like. I would find that more helpful.

JHulk-shoulda been more concise in my comment-I guess I'm unfairly comparing them to people like Tuchman et al. It's hard for me to read straight information material like instruction, hiway signs recipes...so it's the style.

Dan

QUOTE: Originally posted by trowlfazz I buy FSM for the photos and inspiration, and for products releases as well (even the ads). I certainly don't read it-I find the text rather dull. Dan

Dull, as in too easy for you? Boring, because the material presented isn't challenging enough for you? So, you find it to be TOO beginner-oriented, text-wise? Or just not very exciting writing styles?
Fair enough!
One person's opinion, duly respected!

And it should also be duly noted that Dan's opinion adds yet another voice to the "one-sided" majority that recognizes FSM's obvious commitment to the beginner.

I happen to disagree with this opinion, too.
But I respect it!

I find that each issue of FSM has plenty to offer modellers of any skill level. I enjoy reading all the articles about all genres, from the most basic techniques (it never hurts to review what you know, or think you know) to the most advanced.

I really like the ads, too!

I buy FSM for the photos and inspiration, and for products releases as well (even the ads). I certainly don't read it-I find the text rather dull.

Dan

Well, he/she hasn't again posted since this Rant. Either we scared him/her off, or he/she was just doing a little Trolling .

Regards, Rick

Check and mate

QUOTE: Originally posted by boybuddho Well, if one can't have a different opinion, than that is a shame isn't it. Even if we don't agree with it, we should at least respect it for what it is, a different opinion.

Does "respect" mean I can't openly disagree with statements I feel are completely wrong, Dan? As I mentioned in my previous post, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but conversely, everyone is entitled to comment on those opinions when they are stated in a public forum.
I don't think anyone here denies Vyrus' (or anyone's) right to his/her opinions, different as they may be, it's just that everyone here DISAGREES with his/her statements, for obvious reasons.

Big difference, disrespecting and disagreeing.

QUOTE: Originally posted by boybuddho I doubt Vyrus will reply to this post after being chastised for his/her opinions. After reading it, it all seems one sided. What a shame..... Dan

I didn't "chastise" him for his/her opinions, Dan. I strongly disagreed with his/her statements that FSM ignores beginners, which I found to be ridiculous, and clearly stated so.
The overwhelming consensus (and plain truth) is that FSM is very beginner-friendly. As I mentioned in my original post, a lot of folks believe FSM is way TOO basic, as we've seen proven in this very thread with a hearty bit of FSM-bashing.

You'll rarely see me strongly disagree in this fashion here at FSM, as I always respect other's opinions and do my best to see things from other perspectives, but I felt that Vyrus' comments were sufficiently off-base to warrant such a strong response.

Dan, you seem to be championing an individual's right to an opinion here, but does that not also hold true for opposing opinions and views, in any case?

Additionally, the blatantly belligerent tone of Vyrus' post invited a much harsher response than he/she indeed received, in my opinion. I think we all took it pretty easy on him/her, in the spirit of respecting opinions. Personally, I bent over backwards to emphasize the point that we were not in any way belittling beginners here.

QUOTE: FSM staff may argue that most of their audience don't want beginner stuff, but I say that FSM has systemically narrowed down its readership by alienating beginners

I don't mean to be rude, but have you seriously taken a look at the contents of the last year or so worth of the FSM mag? I would say that AT THE LEAST every other issue, if not every issue, has some topic that is directly related to the beginner. I find that FSM is the one mag most tailored to beginners. If you find it lacking in that field, I'm sorry to say, don't look any further, as you'll be sorely disappointed.

I hope he comes by again to reply. Maybe there was a one-sided reaction, but I wasn't quite sure what grounds he was comming from. FSM, when compared to pretty much every other model related publication, is very clearly trying to reach the beginner audience, and I think that this is something obvious, so maybe some detail instead of an outright criticism would have been the better way to go.
Either way, what are ya gonna do. I find it really funny that people will go online to forums, under the cloak of complete anonymity, and actually get offended or scared off enough to leave. Hope he isn't one of them.