Political correctness or historical correctness?

Hi to all, sorry I have not been here for a while. My life took a bit of a down spiral that I had a hard time getting out of. My fault, my problem. Enough of that. The swastika problem will not go away. They will still ban it as there is still too much stigma associated with it. As modellers, we should be using it in a historical context, NOT TO GLORIFY IT!! Having the correct markings for the period is showing what it was like, not saying that you believe in it. As said before, whats next? Japanese or Italian symbols? What about USAAF/RAF markings? Ban the hobby altogether?

Gents,

We've been down this road a time or two. The truth is, as mentioned by one of the early posters, is that is illegal to sell images the swastika in some countries. That is why boxtops almost never carry the image, even though it may be in the kit. Some companies package their kits in two different forms so they can included the markings in the markets where they aren't an issue and than sell those without in the areas that are.

Let's keep the discussion about ways to work around the issue, such as buying aftermarket or printing your own, and avoid the long, drawn out debate of the merits of laws banning the symbols in question.

Cheers, Aaron

Good lad. I'll drink to that. It seems only fair that way. A string in the bow for the Polish model manufacturers. Hear hear....

I think that if the genuine article had it, and someone makes a model of it, everything ought to be included.  History is not served by inaccuracy.

What I found surprising and laudable was Poland's tolerance of the symbol for historic purposes, and willingness to include it in Polish-produced kits.

Bish and Edgar. Thanks for your thoughts on this. I agree that you can't ban the symbol. It doesn't make the swastikas go away. Perhaps it's important, that the symbol continue to exist in people's mind so we would NEVER allow ourself to forget the suffering and the nasty atrocities that was inflicted on the human race for generations to come.

Its not about banning symbols of those we fought against, more of what that particular symbol represents. Personally i think its wrong to be banned, and yet the symbols of the old Soviet Union are totally acceptable. I think Germany's bann of it is them trying to show that they are no way related to that regime, but from what i understand this goes way to far, even to how their military personel are treated.

The symbol in kits does seem to be more common that it used to. I recall hasegawa kits not haveing it, and yet now they do. Revell, being German, of course have good reson not to include it. And i suppose the other companies can't be sure where exactly the kits will end up.

It's called tolerance, and the swastika is, in fact, only banned in Germany and Austria; Germany, recently, tried to get a blanket ban introduced throughout the E.U., and was soundly defeated.

If we start to ban symbols, because we've fought against them, you can include the U.S., France, Spain, Holland, Turkey, Italy, etc., etc., which is patently absurd.

Good old Indy, he knows how to deal with those nazi krauts.

I find it most surprising that we - the British that is - don't have a ban on the image. Most of the countries who do where occupied, maybe there is an attempt to distance themselves there

I can't think of anything that makes an offensive symbol more powerful than completely banning it.  Besides, letting flags fly is a good way of keeping track of who's who ... even though, like Indy Jones once (or twice or so) said, "I hate those guys ..."

I agree. You might as well take them off the market and have none. What do we use in stead. The Iron cross?

I think the laws are archaic and hypocritical...I mean, if makers are allowed the sheets to be produced with "broken-up" swastikas and everyone is aware that it is just a "game" to conform with laws adopted in the '40's, then it is pretty much a farce...

Thanks for the links Checkmateking02. I like the decals on the Spanish Messerschmitt. Looks really good.

Bissyboat

Well i suppose they are not banned from all manufacturers. Was the kit an old version or a more contemporary one?

Perhaps the bigger brands who sell the larger bulks of kits prefer to tread more carefully by not using swastika in order to avoid any financial repercussions. It's a cooperate move isn't. You sell the german kits without swastikas to please the mass market and no one will question your ethics or political views. I also had a BF109E-1 1/72 I bought for 23 years ago. It was Hasagawa, which was the dogs bollocks! It too came with swastikas on the decals.

Well i suppose they are not banned from all manufacturers. Was the kit an old version or a more contemporary one?

Perhaps the bigger brands who sell the larger bulks of kits prefer to tread more carefully by not using swastika in order to avoid any financial repercussions. It's a cooperate move isn't. You sell the german kits without swastikas to please the mass market and no one will question your ethics or political views. I also had a BF109E-1 1/72 I bought for 23 years ago. It was Hasagawa, which was the dogs bollocks! It too came with swastikas on the decals.

Oddly enough, I have a Bf109E-1 (1/72)  in markings for the 1939 Polish campaign, made by RPM, a company in Poland, and the swastika is complete and undivided on the decal sheet.  It is also obviously displayed on the box art.  

You can also buy decal sheets that contain nothing but...

Thanks for shedding light on the subject. I reckon the symbol would be banned i most countries. I find it hard to build the svastika from little pieces, so it's far better to design my own on Adobe Illustrator.

Bissyboat

Just to let you know the swatika is illegal in some countries, Germany, Austria, Hungary, Poland, Czech Republic, France, Brazil and some more I think. Its not a question of political correctness its a question of not getting items past customs. I have heard of kits being opened and the decals having the image cut out. Some manufacturers print the image in pieces to allow you to make the image up just just don't try to take the kit to one of the countries in which its banned.

Phil