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First time modeller needs some advice

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  • Member since
    September 2008
First time modeller needs some advice
Posted by Mahones on Saturday, September 20, 2008 1:57 PM

Hi everyone!

I am very interested in getting into fine scale modeling and I have a few questions for all of the experienced folk out there.  I am starting completely from scratch as far as equipment and skill and was wondering where I should start.  I would ultimately like to build WWII aircraft scale models but these seem to be more challenging as far as detailing, painting, etc... Would I be best to start with something a bit easier such as cars?  Also, how necessary is it to get air brushing equipment right from the start?  I would really appreciate any helpful suggestions for where to get started and what I will need to buy up front.

 Thanks everyone

 Mahones

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Massachusetts
Posted by ajlafleche on Saturday, September 20, 2008 2:46 PM

You have to learn to walk before you can run a marathon.

If you're interested in WWII aircraft, you can try US Army or Navy aircraft in 1/72 to learn. The paint schemes are simple, usually no more than two colors, one on the top and one on the bottom. These can be pretty simple kits to assemble. I would advise strongly, very strongly, against detailing these beyond painting. Don't even think of detailing kits and conversions until you feel very comfortable. The same applies to weathering. These are advanced skills and you should learn your basics first: Assembly, alignment, seams, decalling, painting.

Cars can be simple or complex. Again, if there's an engine, there's the temptation to go crazy with detailing. Getting good paint results is much more challenging on a car since you'd be looking for a gloss finish and this can be very hard to do.

The least expensive airbrush will cost about $45 USD and a basic compressor in in the $100 range. This is a big investment if you're just starting out. There are some realy cheap models for under $20 but you'll get better results with a can. I'd suggest brush painting and using a spray can to begin with. Then, if you find you don't really care for the hobby, you haven't tied up a large amount of money on something you won't use again.

 

Remember, if the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

  • Member since
    February 2007
  • From: Casa Grande, Az.
Posted by DesertRat on Saturday, September 20, 2008 4:27 PM

Hiya Mahones, and Sign - Welcome [#welcome]

   I'd also like to concur. Brush painting and Spray cans would be the best way to start out. I've done this off and on since I was a kid. Mostly i've done the same thing. I've only recently started using an airbrush the last year or so. It can get to be pretty aggrivating at times if you are still learning how to use he thing- especially on top of just breaking into the hobby to begin with.

   But in addition to starting off with WWII aircraft, I might also take a look at a couple of the smaller jet aircraft as well. I know it's not exactly what you were looking to start with, but there are some that have just one color overall (which means a simpler paint job). Just a suggestion, though.

Either way, stick around and you'll have fun! This is a great place to learn anything modelling related. You'll love it!Cool [8D]

Warmest regards,

Roger

  • Member since
    September 2008
Posted by Mahones on Saturday, September 20, 2008 4:58 PM

Thanks guys, i wil definitely take your advice and try some simpler stuff first, thanks so much for responding.

 

cheers

 Mahones

  • Member since
    February 2007
  • From: Casa Grande, Az.
Posted by DesertRat on Saturday, September 20, 2008 9:22 PM

One more bit of advice too........TAKE PICTURES! lOTS OF PICTURES and post em here.

 

I say this because it's hard to ask questions or get suggestions/advice when others can't see what you mean. It certainly makes it easier to see where you are at, and point out areas to be addressed. After all, they say that a picture is worth a thousand words...

 

Besides, we like to look at pictures!Smile,Wink, & Grin [swg]

Warmest regards,

Roger

  • Member since
    September 2008
Posted by Mahones on Sunday, September 21, 2008 7:17 AM

I will definitely post pictures!  I am an amateur photographer so I tend to go overboard with photos.  I will be heading to the closest LHS today to find a simple plane kit to start with.  There is a store called "Hobby and Toy Central" that is a small chain of stores west of Toronto Ontario.  They have tons of kits and supplies there and they are a bit less "snobby" than some other LHS's i've been in recently, so as a beginner I feel a bit less intimidated going there, he he.

 

Thanks guys

Mahones

  • Member since
    August 2006
  • From: Neenah, WI
Posted by HawkeyeHobbies on Sunday, September 21, 2008 7:26 AM
Get involved in a local IPMS Chapter in your area. READ and READ as much as you can about the hobby, techniques and experiences others have had both good and bad. FSM is one place to start.

Take time to read and visit the websites and blogs of the membership here...mine for example...on my blog you'll find tips and such that will help you gain the skills and confidence that is desired by all of us here. We all started as novices, and each has his/her reasons for being involved in this great hobby.

Though I have been involved for nearly forty years, I am still learning. I glean a bit here and a bit there and roll it into my knowledge base for the next project...there always seems to be a next one...which is why I love this hobby...it continues to reward over and over again. There are disappointments too, but that is part of the learning curve.

If I or anyone else can be of help, pose the question here on via Private Message or email. Let's build!


Gerald "Hawkeye" Voigt

http://hawkeyes-squawkbox.com/

 

 

"Its not the workbench that makes the model, it is the modeler at the workbench."

  • Member since
    February 2008
  • From: Van Alstyne, Tx.
Posted by bspeed on Sunday, September 21, 2008 9:10 AM
Kits by Academy are nice, my first kit (in many years) was by them, and it was not overly difficult.
  • Member since
    February 2007
  • From: Casa Grande, Az.
Posted by DesertRat on Sunday, September 21, 2008 10:14 AM

Now there's sound advice from Hawkeye! He is the real subject matter expert here!

Looking forward to seeing progress pictures of your first build in whatever you choose!Cool [8D]

Warmest regards,

Roger

  • Member since
    May 2005
  • From: Left forever
Posted by Bgrigg on Sunday, September 21, 2008 12:47 PM

You've received some excellent advice from some of the real pros on the boards. If you do only half of what they say, you'll be doing better than most noobs!

DON'T buy every tool you see. Going whole hog and buying up every tool, knick-knack and supply will break your budget long before the skill in using them will be learned. Start off small (though maybe not quite so small as 1:72, a scale I find difficult to see!), and ease yourself into it. I bought the Revell line of 1:48 models to (re)start with, as they were relatively cheap, and pretty simple to build. Sticking with the US aircraft makes painting a LOT easier.

DO NOT get discouraged by poor results. If you don't make mistakes, how will you learn better techniques.

DO Wait to get into an airbrush. Simple paint jobs done with patience can look every bit as good as a sloppy airbrushing job done by a beginner! Rattle cans are capable of some pretty decent work. Once you've proven to yourself that this is the hobby for you, then go and get an airbrush, they are an excellent tool!

DO read up on techniques! FSM has some great tutorials in each month's issue, and also has some free and for pay PDFs online that you can download. Search these forums, and the internet, for online tutorials (check out Hawkeye's site, as well as www.swannysmodels.com).

DO try acrylic paints. I find them easier to clean up with, and that alone is worth any perceived difficulty with using them. You can use Windex with Ammonia to completely remove the paint from a model, so you can get a second chance when things don't work out quite so well.

DO have fun with this hobby. Hobbies are meant to be enjoyable, and stressing yourself out over costs, problems and defects will soon turn it into a job, and those tend to get shelved.

So long folks!

  • Member since
    September 2008
Posted by Mahones on Sunday, September 21, 2008 12:58 PM

Hi guys

Well i just picked up my first kit.  It is a 1:72 Revell Saab J35 Draken (#4381).  I chose it as a starter because of the simple (2 colors) paint job. I chose to go with Tamiya Acrylic paints for now and went with Olive Drab for the overall coat with flat black for accents and neutral grey for the missiles and undercarriage.  I am noticing now though that I should have picked up a few more colors for the pilot's clothing and such.

Wish me luck!

Mahones

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Massachusetts
Posted by ajlafleche on Sunday, September 21, 2008 1:14 PM
Tamiya acrylics don't do well with a brush, unfortunately. Search around, however, some guys have come up with a formula to thin them so they can be brushed.

Remember, if the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

  • Member since
    September 2008
Posted by Mahones on Sunday, September 21, 2008 1:33 PM

i see what you mean, this stuff brushes on terrible, it won't spread at all and just peels off when you move the brush over it

 

  • Member since
    May 2005
  • From: Left forever
Posted by Bgrigg on Sunday, September 21, 2008 1:46 PM

Try decanting a little bit to another container, along with some Isopropyl Alcohol (90% or better). Dip the brush into the alcohol, and then into the paint. Alcohol is used as a thinner, and "flashes" off quickly. This will help shorten the time the paint needs to adhere to the model. Also consider giving all the parts a primer coat, either using Tamiya Fine Surface Primer or their AS-12 Aircraft Silver rattle can. A primer coat goes a long way to improving a paint job.

Also be sure to wash the parts (best done when all are attached to the sprue) as the oils used as a release agent from the molds remain on the model. Release oil and paint DO NOT MIX!

I started with brush painting AND Tamiya paint, and managed to do a sufficiently good enough job for my purposes. It's NOT easy, but it is possible.

So long folks!

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Sunday, September 21, 2008 4:29 PM

Ditto alcohol for those paints... Water's good for cleanup only.. Alcohol flashes fast, and won't bead up of the surface.  Pick up a boxed starter set of Testor's military flats as well... You'll need to work with enamels as well acryllics and, farther down the road, oils... Aso, buy your thinners at a hardware store, not a hobby shop...  The price per oz. in hobby shops compared to hardware is ludicrious...  Same thing with spray cans that you'll use a lot of, common ones like flat black, grey (for priming), white...    Buy the big cans at Wal-mart or the like, not the little one in the hobby shop... For the 5.49 or so that  you'll pay for a 3 oz. can of Model Master Flat Black or White, you can buy two or three 10 oz. cans of Store-brands...  Ditto also on airbrushes... You don't need one yet, not until you've honed the techniques for spraying... It'll save you time and money learning to paint with cans before you air brush... Once you've mastered the rattle-cans, you then can move on to mixing your own for the AB, usually a cheap one to learn about mixing and air pressures and such....  I still use my el-cheapo Badger (about 25.00) for over-all one or two-color jobs.  It's fine for mixing and applying custom colors you can't get in the can...

 

  • Member since
    August 2006
  • From: Neenah, WI
Posted by HawkeyeHobbies on Sunday, September 21, 2008 4:43 PM

Let echo bgriggs comment about tools. You don't need them all! I have a polethora (a whole lot) of tools. Yet I continue to use the most basic of them for the most part. My collection of tools is a much a part of my hobby as the kits themselves. Just another, though functional attribute to scale modeling.

Get yourself as many of the basic technique books as you can lay your hands on. You might even find some at your local library, I have in the past. Check the vendors area at contests for reference books, great deals on them are to be had. I myself still scour the tables for even the books covering the most basics...so I can give them to someone like you who needs them...sorry but I'm out at the moment or I would. Also check second hand bookstores and yard and estate sales, one never knows where they'll strike gold.

Again I cannot stress enough about getting involve with a local model club. If they are anything like the two I am involved with you'll be rewarded ten fold...it is partially the reason I can do what I do today, model buildig wise that is. The mentoring I received all those years ago is why I share this hobby and mentor others just coming into or up through it.

 

Gerald "Hawkeye" Voigt

http://hawkeyes-squawkbox.com/

 

 

"Its not the workbench that makes the model, it is the modeler at the workbench."

  • Member since
    February 2007
  • From: Casa Grande, Az.
Posted by DesertRat on Sunday, September 21, 2008 7:25 PM
More good advice, and a very good choice in kits, I think. Good luck, and have fun. Remember if there are any questions or problems,then this is the place to ask!Big Smile [:D]

Warmest regards,

Roger

  • Member since
    October 2004
  • From: League City, Texas
Posted by sfcmac on Monday, September 22, 2008 5:36 PM
 Hmmmm I am no expert but it is safe to say, Anything you see me do.... DON"T.  I unlike you have failed to heed these words of wisdom and have fallen prey to the most beastly of models. It is I that should be asking you for advice! A fresh start perhaps a fresh bottle. To any end there must be glue. Glue is what binds the model and paint adds color to our world. A good set of nippers and a sharp blade to guide your path into this surreal realm that is scale modeling! I have said this before and it fits. Never before will you find a more wretched hive of scum and villianry.... we must be cautious. BTW sometimes it is good advice just to ignore me.  At least until I get my coffee.
  • Member since
    September 2008
Posted by Mahones on Monday, September 22, 2008 6:07 PM

Well I am now full swing into my first kit and things are going...well...they are going :)  Painting is challenging and will take a great deal of practice to get good at. 

I have a few questions.

#1-I am noticing as I spray paint the main plane body that there are quite a few gaps where the wings were glued on, etc... which I am thinking is partly due to my own lack of experience but perhaps also to poorly fitting kit?  I'm heard that some people use some sort of putty to fill cracks and them sand it all down before painting, is this something I should be doing or should I just buy better fitting kits?

#2-Now that I have painted the main plane body, I am noticing that there are no "holes" where the bombs/missiles attach, meaning they are to be glued directly to the body surface.  Will I need to scrape off any paint between both peices before glueing them on?

Thanks all

Mahones

  • Member since
    October 2004
  • From: League City, Texas
Posted by sfcmac on Monday, September 22, 2008 6:51 PM

 Yeah filling gaps are part of life in this hobby. There are several techniques to do this. From super glue and accelerator to some model putty ( some even use car bondo) I would suggest model putty with q-t-ps and acetone based nail polish remover to smooth it all out. As with anything else it takes practice. Try different things and read up on techniques until you find the one you like best.

 Yep if using model glue you need to expose bare plastic for it to be able to weld the seams together.  Lots of new stuff to try out ! Good luck!

  • Member since
    February 2007
  • From: Casa Grande, Az.
Posted by DesertRat on Monday, September 22, 2008 8:17 PM
 sfcmac wrote:

 Yeah filling gaps are part of life in this hobby. There are several techniques to do this. From super glue and accelerator to some model putty ( some even use car bondo) I would suggest model putty with q-t-ps and acetone based nail polish remover to smooth it all out. As with anything else it takes practice. Try different things and read up on techniques until you find the one you like best.

 Yep if using model glue you need to expose bare plastic for it to be able to weld the seams together.  Lots of new stuff to try out ! Good luck!

Looks like ya had coffee this morning, Aaron!Smile,Wink, & Grin [swg]

...What he said, Mahones! Don't worry too much about the gaps though. You'll find that many kits are like this to a degree (expect for your more high end kits, but even those are not perfect). Definately try out the putty if you feel up to it. And a quick search of the forums should reveal an awful lot said in the recent past about the stuff. But ultimately it's what works best for you. Give it a shot, and let us know how you make out!

Warmest regards,

Roger

  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by IL2windhawk on Tuesday, September 23, 2008 12:22 AM

I haven't read this entire thread, but everything I have read has been excellent advice.

I wanted to post a link to this website:
http://www.world-war-2-airplane-model.com/

This is basically a step-by-step tutorial on how to build a WW2 model.  It was immensely helpful when I was in your shoes.  Also swanny's webpage, as mentioned above.  Good luck and stick with it.  It's a great hobby.

  1/32 Revell Duo Discus
  1/32 Revell ASK-21
  1/48 Ardpol SZD-51 Junior
  1/48 Czech Models Grumman Goose
  1/144 FineMolds Millennium Falcon

  • Member since
    August 2006
  • From: Neenah, WI
Posted by HawkeyeHobbies on Tuesday, September 23, 2008 10:15 AM
 Mahones wrote:

Well I am now full swing into my first kit and things are going...well...they are going :)  Painting is challenging and will take a great deal of practice to get good at. 

I have a few questions.

#1-I am noticing as I spray paint the main plane body that there are quite a few gaps where the wings were glued on, etc... which I am thinking is partly due to my own lack of experience but perhaps also to poorly fitting kit?  I'm heard that some people use some sort of putty to fill cracks and them sand it all down before painting, is this something I should be doing or should I just buy better fitting kits?

#2-Now that I have painted the main plane body, I am noticing that there are no "holes" where the bombs/missiles attach, meaning they are to be glued directly to the body surface.  Will I need to scrape off any paint between both peices before glueing them on?

Thanks all

Mahones

Let me answer them in reverse order...glue and paint do not mix!  The best method for a strong bond between surfaces is bare plastic...yes, you'll have to expose some skin to get the bombs to attach and hold.

Take a gander at this >> CLICK << This should help you with the seams issue in the future.

 

Gerald "Hawkeye" Voigt

http://hawkeyes-squawkbox.com/

 

 

"Its not the workbench that makes the model, it is the modeler at the workbench."

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