Revellogram kits

 I'm with ya! I do love the Revellogram kit, mainly because of price, and the challenge of "bringing it up". I also love Tamiya, for the ease of a relaxing decomp build(on occassion). Some of their kits are way high in $$$, especially their modern jets, $60 some odd for an F-16, no thanks, Hobby Boss is even worse!!! Many of their WW2 kits are reasonable, but I can still get em for half $$$, at vendor tables. I harbor no hatred for any model manufacturer.

 Lets face it, Revellogram is pretty much the only one that can be affordable to the next generation. Guess it really doesn't matter all that much, I'll have models til I'm dead, then, what do I care, I aint gonna know about it anyway.

I'm on a Revell "Nostalgia Tour" from the early '70's recreating my childhood with the big ones (1/32) from Revell.  I just got the Spit MkI and the Seafire yseterday from GMW.  I have the Hurricane MkI I got this summer, and a P-40E ("1941" version, instead of the Aleutian Tiger) the year before that.  I just need the Corsair, P-38J, P-47, FW-190, and the Me-109G to complete the set.

I would have to say that I love me some Monogram...if for nothing else that is what I grew up building. However, and this is a big however, the very first Taymia I did was a 1/72 P51 and was simply amazed at how well it went together and how little clean up I had to do with it. 

So my conclusion is that yes they are a bit like your first love you will defend them to the death.

I think the Revelogram stuff is fine and is great for the price, but (sorry Hammer) sometimes I just want a build that I don't have to bang my head against the wall to build. Call it laziness or whatever. Not hating on them but there are options out there.

I certainly don't hate Revellogram kits.

I admit that in the past I've been grumpy about some features such as the closed canopy on the F4U-4 and bad quality decals but Hans has shown me the light ( and didn't need to wack me more than twice with his  hammer ) about the virtues of a low price vs. newer kits.

Much improved Revellogram decal quality also helped.

Also, I had left the hobby in the early 1990s just before Monogram issued better kits ( He-111 )  so I was unaware of the change during my absence.

No way no how will I  pay $229 for a model kit and a kit would need to be very special for me to pay even $100.00.

Building multiple 1/48th scale aircraft kits by any other manufacturer would be much too expensive.

Revellogram makes a large collection possible at a sensible price.

I am going to defer commenting until Hammer writes his dissertation in here first...

isnt Hammer going for his Doctorate  ??

I feel like I'm in a medical amphitheater waiting for the professor to begin dissecting a cadaver ........

I think all the replies so far kind of prove my point. There's a lot of affection on these forums for the Revellogram kits, so I don't really get where this perception that so many hate them comes from.

Yet, in every thread that invariably turns to singing the praises of Revellogram stuff, there's always some permutation of "everyone bags on Revellogram stuff, but...".

This thread isn't intended to bag on Revellogram. Far from it. More to point out the disconnect between that perception that so many people hate them, and the reality as I see it on the forum, which is pretty much the exact opposite.

fermis

...Lets face it, Revellogram is pretty much the only one that can be affordable to the next generation. Guess it really doesn't matter all that much, I'll have models til I'm dead, then, what do I care, I aint gonna know about it anyway.

And just as important for that next generation, if you walk into a big-box store & spot a model... 9 times out of ten it's Revell these days. (If you can at all - last time I lurked at a WalMart on this side of the border, there was a half-aisle of pre-fab metal cars, no plastic kits.) So most will get their first crack at a Revell model... the "pathway drug" if you will.

Looks like I'm another voice in support of your point, Doogs. I grew up, like just about everyone else, building Monogram/Airfix/Revell/AMT kits, with the occasional Japanese/Italian brand thrown in.

Like just about anything else, you can pick and choose individual kits of a brand that either stand out above or below the rest, but I for one don't consider that I give a blanket 'thumbs down' to a brand in general. For my kit dollars in the '80s, I would tend to avoid Revell aircraft in favor of Monogram, but I thought Revell race cars were good. I didn't think Airfix planes were great on detail and accuracy, but I still bought many because the level was acceptable and because of the subject. Of the handful of Tamiya armor kits I bought at the time, I thought there was always something about those that needed improving despite my belief that I was constantly reading that Tamiya was setting the standard for detail and accuracy. This could have been, however, Tamiya's marketing department exerting Jedi mind tricks over an impressionable mind (we ARE the industry leaders, young padawan.....)

Today, I'll still buy  what I think gives me value for my money (like everyone else on these forums), coupled with my desire for a particular subject. Yeah, I plopped down $60 for Hobby Boss' AAVP7A1 recovery vehicle because I wanted the subject and I thought the engineering and level of detail were worth it to me. Reviews of the kit indicated that it went together well, and when I opened the box the detail was exactly what I was looking for. I haven't started it, but I expect when I do the fit will be what others said it is. I do know about the fit and detail of the Dragon stuff, and will happily recommend them to anyone.

But that's that end of the spectrum. I'm totally excited about Airfix's new 1/72 a/c offerings, and I can't wait to fork over a mere $7-10 (maybe less at a vendor table?) for their Spitfire Mk I. And as a shout-out to the older stuff, I think Monogram's 1/72 F-105G Wild Weasel from 1984 (I believe, without looking at the box) still stands up to anything today. In fact, I don't think there are many 1/72 a/c kits out there today that have that level of detail without including some sort of PE or resin with the kit, and this was over 25 years ago. The level of detail and engineering to me make that kit absolutely superb and a total value.

I've got planty of kits in the stash that are 20+ years old, but I have them because I want to build them. They're from a wide variety of brands (most definitely including Revell and Monogram), and most have things about them that could definitely be improved upon, but to me they will help me see where my modeling skills are in terms of bringing up the level of detail or making parts fit right. There's a different skill set involved in building a new Dragon 500-part kit with PE (so-called shake-n-bake?), but that's one of the reasons I'm in this hobby.......

Ok, I'm done..... 

ADoogs, I agree with most of your points. But on several occasions here recently, in response to a, "who makes/what are the best kits?" question post, most often someone chimes in, "stay away from Revell/Monogram, they are unbuildable junk". And yes, Hans, myself and others will jump in with a reply. That was the reason I started the show your "R/M Builds" thread. The old Black Widow is constantly being bemoaned as yet there are several gorgeous builds of that kit in there.

My main personal problem with the Tamigawas is pricing. Now I know that a substantial part of that blame goes to their importers. I do recall the days when Hasegawa was imported by Minicraft and was very competitively priced when compared to US made kits. Those days are gone. I still enjoy building their kits today. And Tamiya, yes today they are the gold standard for fit and ease of assembly- the proverbial shake and bake kit. And there is nothing wrong with that. And lately in aircraft the do seem to be on the cutting edge of detail in a kit without being "over engineered" and an astronomic parts count. I really do love building those too. As others have said, after a difficult build or two, it is nice to pull out a kit that you know will have no fit issues- a recent Tamiya kit. But that has not always been the case. And some of those older T/H kits are still out there.

But I dont see any "persecution" against those who build the Tamigawa. Nobody says, "oh it's a Tamigawa, it cant be built, painted, finished bad, He/she did not do that on their own". Look at Fermis's recent pair of Emils. He has recieved lots of solid praise for those builds. Those two have just as much finished "Wow" factor as his previous Monogram TBD. However, when you saw the amount of scratch detail he added to the TBD, you saw the route he took to achieve was considerably more involved. But he is no less or more of a modeler for his kit choice. He achieves gorgeous results no matter what his starting point is.

In the end, it is the model builder, not the kit.

DoogsATX

I think all the replies so far kind of prove my point. There's a lot of affection on these forums for the Revellogram kits, so I don't really get where this perception that so many hate them comes from.

Yet, in every thread that invariably turns to singing the praises of Revellogram stuff, there's always some permutation of "everyone bags on Revellogram stuff, but...".

This thread isn't intended to bag on Revellogram. Far from it. More to point out the disconnect between that perception that so many people hate them, and the reality as I see it on the forum, which is pretty much the exact opposite.

I don't think it's so much that Monogram and Revell get bashed immediately and frequently here in this forum, Doogs.  Rather, it's more of a feeling that those of us have, who are old enough to have built those kits when we were kids, and it's built over the past 30 years, as developments in the hobby have produced really nicely engineered kits, of subjects that neither Monogram nor Revel ever did (though some other companies did, eg, Lindberg's F11C and Aurora's F4B-4, in 1/48).  It's natural, of course, for people who embrace new things to discard the old, just as it's natural for those who like the old things to defend them.

And I concede, when I was a kid, in the 70s, building models, I became aware of Tamiya and Hasegawa, but they were out of reach for my paperboy wages, and a little intimidating, with their finer details and higher parts counts.  And they were only available to me at the hobby shop, while Monogram and Revell were sold elsewhere.  Almost all of the Revell and Monogram kits that I built, I received as birthday and Christmas presents.  So, the upshot is that I built a lot of Monogram and Revell kits, and Aurora, fewer Airfix, and no Japanese-made kits, back in the day.

Fast-forward to 2000 and a rekindled interest in scale modeling, encouraged because my toy soldier club merged its meetings with the local IPMS club.  With the Internet, I was able to see the great variety of kits and info available, so much broader than what I had in 1982, and I was excited by Accurate Miniatures, and Classic Airframes, and I have a stash of kits in the subjects I like to build.  But I also found myself looking longingly at the kits I built as a kid, too, and thinking--as so many nostalgia builders do--that I'd like to tackle those kits again and apply techniques I'd learned since the first time around.  So, I have a pretty good stash of Monogram aircraft in 1/48, and Revell aircraft in 1/72 (haven't really gotten back into 1/32, because of a lack of space), both used kits bought on the secondary market, and new boxings still available from Revell-Monogram (for the record, it was Monogram that bought Revell, but because of the international recognition, Revell got first billing in the newly merged brand.  Cf Thomas Graham's books on Monogram and Revell).

As to looking down at those who prefer kits with all the detail, and aftermarket, to scratchbuilding, well, I like to think that I have a healthier attitude about it, that we each should build what we like, the way we like.  Personally, I like to see if I can reproduce the detail with scratchbuilding, especially because of guys like Shep Paine, who achieved such results in a time before there was aftermarket.  And I believe in stretching and exercising those skills.  But I recognize that it takes skill to work with resin, and PE, and, I still can't use an airbrush to save my life.  So, for those who think they're better than the others because they use one or the other, well, shame on them, because it's a hobby, after all.  But I think the number of those folks is relatively small, though, too, even if one or the other might be relatively loud.  Most guys in the hobby recognize it for what it is and enjoy seeing all kinds of work.

Good topic, Doogs, and good thoughts from the respondents!

Best regards,

Brad

I think if you look at what is happening you will see it is posts where people start trash talking older kits. It's not like people are just popping into Tamiya builds and making comments like "so what duuude, if you want to build a real model build Monogram". 

Granted some are kind of obnoxious with the assembler vs modeler thing, but really some of the whinning I see in posts over relatively minor issues does make me wonder sometimes.

If people stuck with objective comments like the kit has a nasty gap along the wing roots, instead of making statements like "Airfix kits are garbage, I'll never buy another one",  you wouldn't see so many rising to defend these old kits. 

Now people trashing Tamiya kits for being too expensive or too good that is just people on the other side guilty of the same kind of generalization. Personally I've never been in a hobby shop and had the cleark put a gun to my head and tell me what kit I have to buy. If I decide to get a $75 Hasegawa B-24 instead of the $29 Minicraft B-24 that is between me and my wallet.  

Revellogram is OK in my book. I grew up with Monogram and doing a Revellogram offers the opportunity to be "back in the day". Heck, I still seek out the real thing.

I just recently restored a 1973 motorcycle like I had when I was a kid. Riding it now I realize that the memories of what it was capable of are not able to live up to the reality of how it performs now but that doesn't take away from the enjoyment I get tooling around on it.

That's how I view a Revellogram (or an oldie) kit. Nothing has to be state of the art to bring a smile to the face of those who love them for what they are and what they bring to the table.

Someone asked why we Monogram and Revell kit fans react the way we do, when here in FSM, there is such a strong following for the nostalgia makers, and such loud protests about how great the kits really are.

I posted somewhere in this thread that it's not in reaction to specific posts here in FSM as such, but that over the years, everywhere, we get to hear comments like the one in this article, a "Blast Form the Past" feature on Revell's 1/72 P-39 kit, over at Modeling Madness:

http://www.modelingmadness.com/reviews/allies/us/fordhamp39.htm

We see comments like:

"...the model is still the original 60’s fair (sic) that I remember building as a kid, hell it still has the optional side cover so you can display the motor, the funky do-nut tyres and the masses of raised rivet and panel lines"

"...that the Revell kit is really basic and toy like."

"Want a well detailed P39? – buy the Academy one, Want a more accurate P39? – Buy the Academy one, Want a slap together weekend project with the kids for mock dogfights?- Buy the Revell one, Since the late 90’s when Academy released there P39 the Airfix/Heller and Revell P39’s have basically become BB gun targets or wet weekend slap togethers for the kids, A nice model can be made out of it but it’s easier to buy the Academy one."

Now, let me say first that everyone is entitled to his opinion, and the comments aren't really that negative, and I can agree that the kits we love so much are simple, compared to today's kits.  But this article illustrates my point that we're not responding to some sort of active and violent prejudice against these kits.  Rather, it's a response to a constant background chatter of comments like these.  Eventually, you want to respond, and so, we do.

And to be fair to Modeling Madness' editor, he did insert his own comment at one point to state that he has built a half-dozen of these kits.

In any case, I don't let those who say they don't like the kits bother me.  I'll argue a kit on its merits, and concede where there are shortcomings.  But ultimately, to each, his own, regarding what we like to build.

Best regards,
Brad

DoogsATX

Second, that Revell would probably be really, really smart to revive the Monogram brand (didn't they just bring out a repop tank under the Monogram brand?) and start giving some love to those old kits. Not all-out retoolings, but it'd be great to see some new tooling here and there, maybe a real cockpit for some of the older planes, better gun barrels, that kind of thing. Clean up some of the molds that have gotten "flashy" over the years. They could even go Profi-pack style and throw in canopy masks and extensive marking options. I can't imagine that would cost them all that much, and certainly less than the payoff. 

I thought I read somewhere that the Monogram brand was going to be repackaged as their "high end" kit.  Just getting back into scale modeling, I will say there are more Revellogram kits available from my LHS, so therefore that seems to be what I buy (although I do have a couple of Tamiya kits).  If the fit is a little bit of a challenge, then I view it as a little bit of a challenge to build (as I'm seeing with the P40).  On a side note, I'd pay an extra $10 for a canopy mask (boy do I hate doing that).

Reasoned

 

DoogsATX:

 

Second, that Revell would probably be really, really smart to revive the Monogram brand (didn't they just bring out a repop tank under the Monogram brand?) and start giving some love to those old kits. Not all-out retoolings, but it'd be great to see some new tooling here and there, maybe a real cockpit for some of the older planes, better gun barrels, that kind of thing. Clean up some of the molds that have gotten "flashy" over the years. They could even go Profi-pack style and throw in canopy masks and extensive marking options. I can't imagine that would cost them all that much, and certainly less than the payoff. 

 

 

I thought I read somewhere that the Monogram brand was going to be repackaged as their "high end" kit.  Just getting back into scale modeling, I will say there are more Revellogram kits available from my LHS, so therefore that seems to be what I buy (although I do have a couple of Tamiya kits).  If the fit is a little bit of a challenge, then I view it as a little bit of a challenge to build (as I'm seeing with the P40).  On a side note, I'd pay an extra $10 for a canopy mask (boy do I hate doing that).

I'd love it if they did that. Most of the kits I built growing up were Monogram, so I've got way more nostalgic attachment to the Monogram name than to Revell.

Just imagine...the current B-25 kits sell for what, about $25? Kit it out with some new-mold engines, slide-molded .50 cals and external gun packs, a canopy mask, 5 marking options, and maybe an extra sprue for the PBJ radar pods, sell it for $35-$40. I'd buy a few in a heartbeat.

I'm waiting to see what they do with thier upcoming PV-1. Their latest kits have been very sweet.

I really like the lines of the PV-1

Okay, found the quote:

"A misconception has arisen regarding the company's name and status since it was bought by Odyessy Partners of New York in 1986. Later that same summer Odyessy purchased Revell Models of Venice, California. Subsequently Odyessy Partners quietly merged the unprofitable Revell with the highly profitable Monogram and moved all its usable assets to Monogram's Des Plaines, Illinois Plant Number 2. Gradually the Revell name was phased into the product lines due to Revell's world wide brand recognition. The Monogram name is currently used exclusively on the company's high end "Pro Modeler Kits"."

stikpusher

I'm waiting to see what they do with thier upcoming PV-1. Their latest kits have been very sweet.

I'm waiting too!! Got one on pre-order!

me 3....

Wait, you can pre order it?!?!?! =D what site??? 

i totally agree!!! all brands make a fair share of good and bad kits. i learned to build using older monograms kits. i still build monogram kits to this bay because they are priced great and easy to find. 

i see it more has...basic monogram 1/48 prop say BF 109 is what..$15 bucks? vs tamiya in the same scale still basic kit is usually $30. i find that their decals aren't so nice with Microsol so thats another $10 for the decal sheet. 

i never had problems with the monogram kits. i mean if you want something that is crazy detailed then maybe monogram isn't for you unless you use after market resin parts. 

i love my monogram 1/48 A-10 and for only $20 bucks. it's awesome.

i scene the 1/48 hobby boss a-10 kit..nothing special for the price.

Italeri looks to have a little shape problem but i never touch italeri kits.

tamiay A-10 is $40 and has some shape problems. 

good old monogram kit that blows all these expensive  kits away.