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IPMS weak?

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  • Member since
    July 2011
  • From: Hurlburt Field AFB
IPMS weak?
Posted by SmartGambler on Wednesday, July 20, 2011 4:15 PM

is it just me or is IPMS a total waste of $25.00 or what. I signed up a year ago only to recieve 2 outdated magazines and when i asked for a IPMS discount at my local hobby Town store i was told they dont offer discounts to IPMS members. So my membership was about to expire i sent IPMS a email asking what i should expect for my $25.00 otherwise known as membership renewel and they never responded to my email I guess there lack of response to me was a answer in its self.

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, July 21, 2011 7:20 AM

IMO, the only reason to join is to get into IPMS contests...

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tornado Alley
Posted by Echo139er on Thursday, July 21, 2011 7:37 AM

Manstein's revenge

IMO, the only reason to join is to get into IPMS contests...

Ditto

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Massachusetts
Posted by ajlafleche on Thursday, July 21, 2011 1:05 PM

You should have gotten 6  IPMS Journals over the last year. You might want to check with your post office about issues with delivery. Mine come promptly every two months. The Journal is as good as, and maybe better than, any modeling magazine you can get on the newstand or by subscription, The models featured in there are uniformly well built and the step by steps exceed anything you can find in other print media.

Membership give full access to their web forum including areas restricted to the general public. As a member, you have the opportunity to volunteer to help on the reviewer corps. That could get you essentially free models, accessories, detailing kits, decals, magazines and books, as long as you build and review the item.

Now, if your LHS wants to be a cheap (chose your favorite explitive) that has nothing to do with IPMS. They'd probably not give a discount to a local club, either.

Remember, if the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

  • Member since
    July 2011
  • From: Hurlburt Field AFB
Posted by SmartGambler on Thursday, July 21, 2011 3:04 PM

wow access to a model forum and model galleries i dont know of any of place that cost $25.00 to view those 2 things. wait a minute is this not a free web forum with galleries. I did not forget the kit reviews, kit reviews are like opinions everyone has one.I guess i am a little negative and maybe i need to lighten up. i just dont like when large organizations take my money and wont take a moment to respond to a simple email 

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Thursday, July 21, 2011 3:20 PM

SmartGambler

wow access to a model forum and model galleries i dont know of any of place that cost $25.00 to view those 2 things. wait a minute is this not a free web forum with galleries. I did not forget the kit reviews, kit reviews are like opinions everyone has one.I guess i am a little negative and maybe i need to lighten up. i just dont like when large organizations take my money and wont take a moment to respond to a simple email 

You're right - you are a bit negative and should probably lighten up Wink

Al was simply answering your question about what is included with the $25 membership - you don't have to like it, but that is what it comes with.

SmartGambler

 wait a minute is this not a free web forum with galleries.

Yes, it certainly is. However, just like IPMS, the FSM site has 'Subscriber only content' as well. It may be different 'stuff' (reviews, for example) but it is the same concept.

As to your comments about the IPMS journal - I too have had some trouble with the delivery of mine. This past issue never arrived, so after about 2 weeks, I contacted IPMS (which, on a side note, is a bit of a PITA if you try to do it through their website), and gave them my sob story. A week later, I had a new copy of the journal in my mailbox. Three days after that, my original arrived....

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Green Bay, WI USA
Posted by echolmberg on Thursday, July 21, 2011 3:29 PM

Are their publications still in black and white?  I remember when I was a member back in the very late '80s/early '90s and all their mags came to me in B&W.  I was pretty bummed out by that.

Eric

  • Member since
    October 2010
Posted by sumter III on Thursday, July 21, 2011 3:46 PM

If you have a local club you should talk to the them.  If you do not have a club here is a link that might help.

http://www.pensacolamodeleers.com/

the society is only as good as it's members, and you are a member.  Get active and post in the members only section fo IPMS.  Remember the guys there are not full time people they have real jobs too so.

Have you been on the forum?  Did you contact your region rep?  If you don't know already your in region 11 and there are a fine bunch of guys down there!

BTW we need you rsupport to help improve and get better. 

Did you know about the kits we donate to the troops in Iraq, Afganistan and to the VA?  We had a family of a past member who was killed donate over 1400 kits for the VA thorugh IPMS?

Get active and help us so we can help others.

   

  • Member since
    October 2010
Posted by sumter III on Thursday, July 21, 2011 3:50 PM

To the Journal question:

No full color and high gloss, you can see samples at .

http://www.ipmsusa.org/

 

  • Member since
    November 2008
  • From: Jefferson City, MO
Posted by iraqiwildman on Thursday, July 21, 2011 3:51 PM

I joined it last year and will definitely be renewing this year. I really enjoy reading the bi-monthly magazine. It has lots of color photos and good build stories.

But what I really like is their desire to expand this hobby. They encourage local chapters to have kids build and take lessions. Also they collect and send kits and supplies to troops overseas and recovering in hospitals.

To me it is worth $25 a year to help in small way to encourage the expansion of this hobby and help our troops.  The 6 issues of the magazine and discounts are just an extra bonus

Tim Wilding

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tornado Alley
Posted by Echo139er on Thursday, July 21, 2011 4:04 PM

I let mine lapse many years ago.  My local club is offering a 50% discount on both the local and IPMS national.  I may just renew now that my son is getting into it as well.

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Denver
Posted by tankboy51 on Thursday, July 21, 2011 4:16 PM

I've been a member since 1985 and never regretted it. I still have the Quarterlies and Updates from that time.  The Journal is excellent.  Color and high gloss pages.  I also belong to two IPMS chapters here.  Great bunch of guys.  Our local shop offers the 15% discount, and also a yearly member appreciation day with even better sales. I can save my membership dues in a very short time.  Overall IPMS membership gives us a lot more than just the ability enter contests.  Which really only applies to the National Convention.  All the local contests are pretty  much open to everyone, but sometimes an IPMS member will get a discount on entry fees.

Sorry you had trouble with getting the Journal.  I only had one bad issue and it was handled quickly and politely.  Of course, I've only had one bad issue with FSM, and it was handled quickly and politely as well.  And that has been since FSM s founding almost.

Doug

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Thursday, July 21, 2011 4:20 PM

I cant answer for the national organization, but the local chapters are worth the time and money to participate in. I have learned more there and kicked my builds to higher levels since I became involved with IPMS. So much to learn from your fellow modelers in person.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Massachusetts
Posted by ajlafleche on Thursday, July 21, 2011 6:35 PM

SmartGambler

 did not forget the kit reviews, kit reviews are like opinions everyone has one.

Guess I wasn't clear enough...as a member YOU, SmartGambler, have the opportunity to review kits which will be provided to YOU gratis.

I guess i am a little negative and maybe i need to lighten up.

Ya think? It appears you weren't interested in hearing what your dues get you, only in dissing the organization and looking for affirmation. You don't like the organization, that's fine. Don't re-up. We all make those decisions about one thing or another every day. When my ACW reenacting group became too demanding, I told the head of the group I wouldn't be renewing my membership and left with no bad feelings on either side. Many years ago, a co-worker gave me this pearl, "If it stops being fun, don't do it." If you don't think your $25 is being well spent and you're not getting value for it, by all means, don't renew.

i just dont like when large organizations take my money and wont take a moment to respond to a simple email

I have had to contact the national organizartion a couple times over the years. Responses were quick and polite. I used that ancient technology, the phone, a time or two and was well receievd. A friend, who is convinced everyone is out to put the screws to him has even had to concede he got satisfaction when contacting someone about his membership.  

Remember, if the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Allentown, PA
Posted by BaBill212 on Thursday, July 21, 2011 7:31 PM

My $0.02

I was a member for 5 years or so back in the 80's. I saw no real advantage or benefit.....  BUT, that could have just been me too.

Perhaps it has changed over the years....  

Not knocking,,,  but I found it too expensive for what I was getting out of it....

 

 

Bill

Enjoy the ride!

 

  • Member since
    July 2011
  • From: Hurlburt Field AFB
Posted by SmartGambler on Thursday, July 21, 2011 9:14 PM

i appreciate all the feedback i had not had my coffee and was disappointed when i checked my email and got no response maybe i expect to much. i like they support the troops was not aware of that guess cause i dont recieve any magazines and dont have a local chapter that is not a hour away from my home i am currently active duty USAF and spent lots of time in Iraq and afganistan. any support of our troops over there is greatly appreciated I know i would feel better if they would just respond to my emails my duty days are pretty full and it is difficult to think of models during the day when they are open to phone calls.

  • Member since
    October 2010
Posted by sumter III on Friday, July 22, 2011 6:23 AM

It all depends on who you are sending an email to.  I still think you need to contact the region rep, he will get you to the right people.  If you still can't find him or need help PM me and I'll pass your message to the people you need.  If you have issues I encourage you to post in the IPMS forum first, kinda like following your chain thing.

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Saturday, July 23, 2011 1:02 AM

joeviz

 Manstein's revenge:

IMO, the only reason to join is to get into IPMS contests...

 

Ditto

 

Pretty much sums up my interest in it... Overall though, I haven't had any bad experiences with IPMS as an organization, just with some of their contest judges (although I think the diorama rules are too restrictive, down to the point of being rather anal in places.  I've known nuns that're less tight about aircraft nose-art)... (Also, in case you're reading this, Mike S. from IPMS "Sprue Stretchers").... There's a reason I screwed the M60 down tight on the diorama, you jerk.. It was to "spring" the suspension over the street rubble without having to cut the torsion arms and reglue them into place to then match the contours exactly...

 Some should also be required prove they have normal to red-green color-vison (the hell it was Olive Green) and should also know the subject well if they "don't need any photo to know that there's no seam on top center-line of the P-51 cowl" (actually, Skippy..  There IS one)...  

They then should also be familiar with SOME aspects of military and aviation history. I don't expect them to know everything, but they should at least give a guy the benefit of the doubt.... There most certainly WAS a "silver P-61", and it was NOT a P-61C or F-15 Reporter.... (Wish I'd had this picture there that day) It most certainly WAS a P-61A. and it was NOT a "Hypothetical 820" model...

They should also have at least, an inkling of what a soldier's living conditions are like in the field, especially if they're gonna strictly enforce the part about depicting "excretory functions" in the rules AND be judging military dioramas... 

A patch of yellow snow at the base of a tree with a GI near it, buttoning his fly, is NOT a depiction of an "excretory function"...   

Sorry guys... I went away for a minute.. I'm back now...

Whistling

 

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Utereg
Posted by Borg R3-MC0 on Saturday, July 23, 2011 3:31 AM

Firsty a disclaimer: I am an IPMS member (the Dutch IMPS, that is...but stil, one big happy family) so I might biased.

However: the thing with the IPMS is, it is more then a magazine or a forum on the internet. The are plenty of those around, some of them very proffessional (maybe to a higer standard that of a organisation depending on volunteers as the IPMS) The real plus of the IPMS over a magazine is that they organize event (not only competitions) and have chapters where you can meet other modellers.

So if you are a member just because of the magazine: then there might be better options. But if you are a participating member you get so much more then just a magazine.

  • Member since
    July 2011
Posted by DickM on Saturday, July 23, 2011 1:05 PM

Hello, my name is DickM and I am the current President of IPMS. Mr. SmartGambler is not being accurate in his statement. He sent a request for back issues to the IPMS National Office Manager for back issues and that request was serviced promptly.

What Mr. SmartGambler fails to mention is that he had recently moved and he neglected to update IPMS with his new address. Not only were his issues mailed to him (at his old address) but when they were returned as "undeliverable" IPMS was forced to pay a penalty fee for the return of the magazines to our offices.

In his email to the National Manager he provided an updated address and will receive his remaining Journals now that his address is correct.

As to why the back issues that were sent to him were "outdated".... they were the back issues that were returned to IPMS....of course they are not current. Are they outdated?  That depends on the usefulness of the content to each individual member and that is true for every book, publication, newsletter, pamphlet, and periodical ever published.

IPMS has no control over which Hobby Shops offer discounts to IPMS members. My local hobby shop offers a discount, but two others in the city do not. That decision is up to the hobby shop owner. The expectation that a hobby shop, all hobby shops, or any hobby shop should offer a discount is a business decision which rests solely with the hobby shop management. Thanks to those that offer discounts to IPMS members and we wish more would follow that example.

As to his question about what he should expect for his $25, Mr. SmartGambler states that he never received a reply. That statement is simply not true. I emailed a reply to him and copied the IPMS National Office Manager, who later confirmed receiving my email.

There you have it.

A question was asked and a reply was sent.
Due to his own negligence this member did not receive some Journals, which were later sent to him after he had provided a viable mailing address.

 

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2011
Posted by DickM on Saturday, July 23, 2011 3:19 PM

The Journal is now, and has been for several years, in living color. Please visit the IPMS/USA website and use the link to view the listing of contents in recent Journals and view the covers. There is also a link to view recently published Journal articles. That demonstrates the quality of the publication and the broad spectrum of modeling interests within the Society.

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Fort Knox
Posted by Rob Gronovius on Saturday, July 23, 2011 7:20 PM

Mansteins revenge

IMO, the only reason to join is to get into IPMS contests...

The only time a participant needs to be an IPMS member to enter into one of their contests is for the Nationals Convention. Only one contest a year out of the dozens of local and regional contests actually requires IPMS membership to enter. The local contests requirements are set by the hosting club. If a local IPMS club is requiring membership to participate, it is their requirement, not the IPMS USA's requirement. I've been to many local shows throughout the country (a quarter century of military service has made me quite a nomad in terms of "local" shows) and have yet to see a contest where IPMS or AMPS membership is required.

Therefore, that reason to join is invalid.

Now as far as contests go, IPMS USA provides the insurance policy for all of the local and regional IPMS contests. Without insurance (in case one slips, falls and hurts him or herself), most local clubs could not afford to put on a contest for anyone to attend in the first place. The insurance policy is subsidized by member dues.

So a more valid reason to join would be to pay for the insurance for the local clubs so there can be contests. No insurance, no contest.

As far as judges at IPMS contests, I've been a member of many local clubs throughout the US (MA, VA, TX, NY, NJ, KY, AL). Sometimes during my membership in local clubs, I've been an IPMS member and sometimes not (sometimes due to my neglecting to renew and membership lasping, other times I just don't join beyond the joining the local club membership).

I'm fairly sure that I've never seen the same crew of judges at different shows. Just because someone has an issue with judges at one show, doesn't mean you'll have the same issues with judges at another show. I'm pretty sure there isn't a group of IPMS circuit judges that go around the country judging local shows.

As a matter of fact, judges are volunteers, and I think at just about every show I've been to, there's always been a call for additional judges to volunteer. I don't believe there is even a requirement for the judges to be IPMS members at the local shows. It's probably a low number of member to non-member judges (more non-member judges at a show).

If you don't like the way the judging goes on at the local shows you attend, volunteer to be a judge. Don't know how to judge? Volunteer to be an assistant judge to learn how. Take notes on what those judges are doing and try to improve the overall judging process. I've been asked to judge and have done so, I've also been too lazy to step up and volunteer and have had some reasons why I couldn't help (like had to leave early).

  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: NW Washington
Posted by dirkpitt77 on Saturday, July 23, 2011 7:24 PM

LOL   I think SmartGambler just got PWNED.

    "Some say the alien didn't die in the crash.  It survived and drank whiskey and played poker with the locals 'til the Texas Rangers caught wind of it and shot it dead."

  • Member since
    March 2010
Posted by shoot&scoot on Saturday, July 23, 2011 8:19 PM

I was asked to help judge a local show here in the midwest this past spring and we were told we were going to use IPMS rules.  I'm not an IPMS member and am not familliar with the rules but was told to judge strictly on the proficiency of the build and finish (painting and weathering).

At no time were we to judge on historical accuracy as that was beyond the scope of the contest.  I don't know how one COULD judge on historical accuracy or all of the "what ifs" in every category would have to be disquallified out of hand.  Hans has a valid gripe if his models were disquallified solely on historical accuracy but maybe Rob Gronovious or D ick M could elaborate on this.

                                                                                                  Pat.

 

  • Member since
    July 2011
Posted by DickM on Saturday, July 23, 2011 8:43 PM

I guess I need to trick the FSM system when using my first name since it tends to block it. Anyway, the reader is encouraged to visit the IPMS website ( http://www.ipmsusa.org ), click on the link to the "National Contest Committee" and then use the link for "Rules".

When one judges at the IPMS national convention one attends a seminar for the judges. Questions can be answered and procedures can be clarified. Newbie judges, or OJTs, are always put on a team with more experienced National Judges. I've served as a judge in the Space and Sci Fi divison and as a team member, worked with some outstanding folks whose sole purpose is to provide fair and equitable judging of every entry on the table.  During a national convention I have never been an ear-witness to a snarky comment by a judge or have I ever seen a judge act in an inappropriate manner.

There are two goals at a national convention. The first is to ensure fairness and equity in the application of the rules, and the second is to educate and train future judges for service at national conventions, regional conventions and local contests.

I have, unfortunately, seen and heard things at local contests and regionals that were not appropriate. The issue, here, isn't which set of rules is being applied, whether it be IPMS, AMPS, or other judging systems. The issue was that an individual judge either said or did something which violated the unspoken promise of the contest host that the judging would be fair and equitable. The problem lies with the individual judge and not with any particular set of rules.  When I enter an IPMS national convention I am aware of the rules, just as I am when I enter an AMPS event. If I don't like the rules, or can't tolerate them then I should move on down the road. What I do not know as a contestant, but must take as a given is that the judges have been prepped through some sort of training seminar, that there is some supervision so that all judging teams perform their tasks fairly, and that the judging system has been fair to all entries.

 

Having said all that, the philosophy behind the IPMS rules, as seen on the website, have evolved over nearly 50 years of practice and procedure. IPMS rules guide the judges to look for evidence that the basic modeling skills are well in evidence before other factors come into play.

 

IPMS chapters are not required to use IPMS rules at their local shows so be sure to check out the websites for the host clubs, find the rules (almost every host club now has a web presence) and be sure you, as a participant, know what you're model is getting into.

An excellent way to view the judging process is from the inside, as one of the judges. You'll learn a great deal about what other builders do to make sure beautiful models by being able to get up close and personal with the model, and by joining in a conversation about the model with other judges.

 

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tornado Alley
Posted by Echo139er on Saturday, July 23, 2011 10:20 PM

Rob Gronovius

 

 Mansteins revenge:

 

IMO, the only reason to join is to get into IPMS contests...

 

 

The only time a participant needs to be an IPMS member to enter into one of their contests is for the Nationals Convention. Only one contest a year out of the dozens of local and regional contests actually requires IPMS membership to enter. The local contests requirements are set by the hosting club. If a local IPMS club is requiring membership to participate, it is their requirement, not the IPMS USA's requirement. I've been to many local shows throughout the country (a quarter century of military service has made me quite a nomad in terms of "local" shows) and have yet to see a contest where IPMS or AMPS membership is required.

Therefore, that reason to join is invalid.

Now as far as contests go, IPMS USA provides the insurance policy for all of the local and regional IPMS contests. Without insurance (in case one slips, falls and hurts him or herself), most local clubs could not afford to put on a contest for anyone to attend in the first place. The insurance policy is subsidized by member dues.

So a more valid reason to join would be to pay for the insurance for the local clubs so there can be contests. No insurance, no contest.

You just validated Manny's comment (and my Ditto).  

True, one does not HAVE to be an IPMS member to attend or participate in local events.  However, as modelers, if we want to continue having local contests with IPMS backing (insurance as you say) we should do our part and subsidize the cost by joining IPMS, therefore that IS a main reason to join. 

  • Member since
    July 2011
  • From: Hurlburt Field AFB
Posted by SmartGambler on Saturday, July 23, 2011 10:43 PM

It is true i just PSC to Eglin AFB and I neglected to update my address. But I had not recieved any publications for months prior to my transfer thus out of site out of mind. I posted this message in this forum 3-4 days after making a attempt to contact IPMS via email. I jumped the gun on posting this message i should have waited a little longer. IPMS contacted me a couple of days after I posted this message and I believe they responded to me appropriately, even though i was wrong. I guess my original question got answered (IPMS weak?) I know now they are far from weak and deserve our full support I will renew my membership and encourage eveyone to do the same.    

  • Member since
    July 2011
  • From: Hurlburt Field AFB
Posted by SmartGambler on Saturday, July 23, 2011 10:46 PM

I dont enter my work into contest because our hobby is very subjective and one mans garbage is anothers gold

  • Member since
    October 2009
  • From: Houston, Texas
Posted by Medicman71 on Saturday, July 23, 2011 11:10 PM

I just joined my local IPMS chapter earlier this year and plan on joining the national IPMS soon. My chapter had thier show and contest at the end of April. I entered my Osprey and was asked if I wanted to judge. I declined due to the fact that I had a model in the contest and the fact that I had no clue on how to judge. Had I known about being an assistant judge I would have jumped at the chance. I try to stay as active as I can (An EMS schedule is not condusive to set meetings). I just wish I could go to a National show one of thses days.

 

Building- (All 1/48) F-14A Tomcat, F-16C Blk 30, He 129

 

  • Member since
    July 2011
Posted by DickM on Sunday, July 24, 2011 8:27 AM

SmartGambler

 I know now they are far from weak and deserve our full support I will renew my membership and encourage eveyone to do the same.    

Thank you sir. I trust you will find your IPMS membership as enriching and useful as I have found mine to be.

And in reference to another post from a gent who wished he could attend the national convention....the IPMS website will be posting images of models, events, and happenings during the convention. The first images usually start showing up on the IPMS website on Thursday evening. If one visits the IPMS website, clicks on the the "Galleries" button, then on the "Events" button, and then finds the "album cover" for IPMS National Convention, Omaha 2011....one will see some spectacular models. Note that the album is populated with additional images throughout the convention. One of the best aspects of the convention, for me anyway, is the schedule of workshops and seminars one can attend. During my first convention I learned the basics of building a website during a seminar led by the IPMS Webmaster. I've also attended workshops on subjects such as "the basics of figure painting", "rigging biplanes", "applying scenic material to dioramas", and many other very useful topics.This year the convention is in Omaha, NE. home of the college World Series and runs from Aug 3 through the evening of Aug 6th.  (By the way, the website coverage features the "models", not just the winning entries.) An issue of the Journal will feature an image of each winning entry with the name of the builder)

IPMS, or any organization for that matter, may not be your cup of tea. If that is the case then "Happy Modeling" to you and perhaps we'll see you at a contest. For others its an excellent fit and your membership is much appreciated.

I've got a Monogram 72nd Space Shuttle calling me . It's an IPMS review item and I must spend some quality time with this very large and impressive spacecraft model. The review should be published on the IPMS website (we have 1,000's of reviews that you can view) in about 6 weeks.

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