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crap models

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  • Member since
    January 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Tuesday, October 7, 2014 12:53 PM

Rob -

Those are very useful points. I will take into consideration using as a test kit for different things. Thanks.

  • Member since
    December 2004
  • From: Houston, Texas
Posted by panzerpilot on Tuesday, October 7, 2014 12:37 PM

I started the Hasegawa Sabre I recently built under that idea, thinking I'd just turn into a Mule if it was a real disaster, ie..Well, this kit is gonna be difficult! It really wasn't. It's from the 70's, so I knew it wouldn't be like recent kits. Raised panel lines, some fit issues, Poor cockpit detail, etc. I had a lot of fun nonetheless, and I think it came out great.

-Tom

  • Member since
    May 2006
Posted by Rob Beach on Tuesday, October 7, 2014 11:12 AM

BS214, you are seeing what happens to a mold that has been around this long (35 years...) and pretty much in production the entire time.  However, when it came out (along with the contemporary Spitfire Mk.V and the Bf109F kits...) the accuracy and detailing of these kits were top-notch.  Now, given their age and design (pre-CAD) precepts, they might be better viewed as equivalent to 'limited run' tech kits.  Meaning, more prep of the parts required before assembly can proceed.  After all, it doesn't take but a smidge of excess plastic where it shouldn't be to mess up an otherwise perfect fit...

If nothing else, I'd recommend taking a chance on the Hurri and use it as a test bed for your 'fettling' skills.  For example, taking the fuselage halves and giving them a light 'block sanding' to clean and square up that primary joint.  Straight 320 grit paper (wet and dry is a good choice since it can be 'cleaned' as you go by rinsing...) wrapped around a handy sized (literally, sized to fit your hand comfortably) block, stroked *along* the part edge (cross-wise sanding really removed material - too fast for just tweaking) will give you some "eye & hand" practice that is very useful as you go along.  I usually 'bridge' across both sides so my sanding has a symmetric effect both top and bottom.  In all cases, frequent 'stop & fit' is required to 1) ID where the further work is needed and 2) to evaluate the effect of what you've done.

This will obviously remove the alignment pins, but no worries - that gives another 'practical skills' opportunity, namely 'progressive joint gluing and alignment' practice.  Many modelers will forget the parts are *plastic* and as such are flexible; so they can be bent, flexed and otherwise manhandled to exactly where they need to be...many an aircraft wing root has gone astray because the builder didn't realize the fuselage has 'flexed' from it's proper (design) position, causing it to not mate to the wings correctly.  However, a little sprue brace applied to the interior to 'push' the roots out and viola! all is rainbows... ;^)

That aside, Airfix's new tool kits have been basically flawless, such that their new tool Spitfires (like the PR.19), their Javelin and Scimitar, are all wonderful kits and excellent value for the $$.  And for the 1/48 scale modeler, their British 'Gulf Warfare' vehicle kits are super.  So, don't give up on Airfix. they are currently doing a great job - just watch for some of their kits being 'classics'!

R/ Robert

  • Member since
    January 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Tuesday, October 7, 2014 9:54 AM

Cdn Colin - the Hurricane kit is dated from 1979. Back then after I was pointed out in another forum, Airfix was notorious for terrible molds fits and flash. It's enough to drive me nuts and say to heck with it. LOL!

  • Member since
    April 2004
  • From: UK
Posted by Jon_a_its on Tuesday, October 7, 2014 4:50 AM

to Quote Mark

One of the things I most enjoy about the hobby these days is going back and building some of my favorite kits from the 60's with my (hopefully) improved skills and techniques.  To each their own, I suppose. "

Yes, that's a good point Mark.

I bought the Revell re-pop of the M60 (A-slick) AVLB, knowing it was out of scale, old, toy-like, blah blah... BUT it was fun!

I like to try something new every build, so I blogged it, replaced all the hydraulic rams with aluminium (Al-Yoo-MiN-Ium, Wink ) & made it workable.  I also got comments about the 'Toy Story' Figures that were in the box when I displayed it on my Club table.

#hashtag fun, (whatever that is...) 

I collect (& ahem.. intend to build) the kits I did as a yoof. Mostly 1/72-1/76th Airfix

My twist is this: I sold my 1/32nd a/c (never going to be built) & am replacing them with their 1/48th versions. with a/c I go for best-known examples, regardless of Mfr, Revell, Airfix, Sword, HaseGawamiTam, etc...  

 I'm replacing the 1/72-1/76th vehicles with 1/48th & 1/35th, as above...

& reminiscing about the essential foodstuffs of your yoof is NOSH-talgia Wink

East Mids Model Club 32nd Annual Show 2nd April 2023

 http://www.eastmidsmodelclub.co.uk/

Don't feed the CM!

 

  • Member since
    January 2012
  • From: Barrie, Ontario
Posted by Cdn Colin on Monday, October 6, 2014 9:18 PM

My Hurricane went together OK.  You should give it a shot.

I build 1/48 scale WW2 fighters.

Have fun.

  • Member since
    January 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Monday, October 6, 2014 7:12 PM

I bought a kit a long while back and it is a freakin' nightmare before a single drop of paint or glue has even touched it. Guess what kit it is? 1/48 scale Airfix Hawker Hurricane Mk.I  Too many minor flash, ill fitting parts that will need gap filling. I don't need that kind of stress and work. Looks like I'm in the market  for a new Hawker Hurricane Mk.I brand kit. This old Airfix kit is going in the trash... unless someone wants it. LOL!

  • Member since
    May 2006
Posted by Rob Beach on Monday, October 6, 2014 3:11 PM

Hey, I think I am building that same kit!  But mine is molded in 'bubble gum pink' plastic, complete with 'flavor swirls' molded in!

Perhaps I can take a picture to show what I am doing to it - once I finish converting a Monogram P-38 into a Mansyu Ki-98 (experimental Japanese fighter...)  ;^P

Regards, Robert

  • Member since
    May 2006
Posted by Rob Beach on Monday, October 6, 2014 2:55 PM

"Teejay", I think the use of 'crap model' in this context refers to kits that aren't up to the current standard of very precise tooling you see in the latest releases from (most) modern manufacturers.  Though, technically, being a recent tooling does not preclude a kit being 'challenging' to construct to a high modeling standard.  In short, 'crap' is something used by experienced modelers!

To me, a 'crap' kit is one that requires a whole lot of correction for accuracy's sake.  I can almost always deal with molding and fit issues successfully, but having to cut out and correct large portions of a model simply to make it 'right' is (in this day of internet-based research resources & large online modeling communities) just unforgivable.  So, just because it is "new" doesn't necessarily make it better.  To provide an example (which I must unfortunately 'name names'), the new tool 1/48 scale P-80C kit from HobbyBoss, which is a wonderful example of the mold-maker's art yet is still an inaccurate representation of the aircraft.  A more accurate (and consequently to me, better value for the money) is the quite old Monogram (NE Revell) P-80 kit which features more accurate shapes, dimensions and panel lines (although they are raised panel lines...not quite the 'sin' it seems to be these days.)  Essentially, HB failed on basic research - an apparently common issue with many Chinese kit makers.  I suspect the high reliance on computer-based design work, relying almost exclusively on images (often web-sourced) is the cause of these problems.  Without proper basic research, images alone will easily lead a CAD designer astray (as proven time and again.)  If the draftsman (as we'll call these techs...) has never even *seen* an aircraft, it must make it hard to interpret and just 'understand' the structures they are attempting to 'reverse engineer' in their 3D drawing spaces.

So, back to your original question.  I feel that the label of 'crappy kit' will be different for every modeler because everyone has their own modeling 'profile' that develops from their own experiences, skill-set and expectations.  While some will expect the 'shake & bake' kit every time and be disappointed otherwise, others will see the potential in a kit.  Everyone has their own unique set of 'rose colored glasses' when it comes to kits.  My friend Dennis often says '"Life is too short for crappy kits"' because he is 'destination oriented' (that being a finished model.)  I am more someone who appreciates the 'journey' and so-called 'crappy kits' can provide quite a modeling journey.  To me, the hours that simply fly by while I am in 'the zone' at the workbench is where my fun happens.  Once they are finished, however, I'll probably not spend hours looking at them!

Philosophy aside, however, there are definitely kits to avoid when getting back into modeling (or doing it for the first time) just because of the frustration potential.  Adult modelers in particular will observe the results being had by others and unfortunately develop expectations of similar results for their own modeling.  The key concept is 'experience.'  Someone who has been practicing the craft for many years will have better results than anyone who is just starting out.  Some of this can be 'shortcut' by reading up and going to local club meetings to learn, but regardless, it still takes practice (like anything.)  With that in mind, I would recommend getting some of the so-called 'crap kits' and using them for just that practice of the basic skills required to turn out well built plastic models (if indeed that is your desire - modeling should, at it's core, be low stress and fun, so don't 'self-induce' problems...focus on the journey, as it were, and you can't go wrong.) Calvin & Hobbies comic strip illustrates the basic quandary of the new modeler:

4.bp.blogspot.com/.../calvin-and-hobbes-model.gif

So (not knowing your interests) I'd say Lindberg & Glencoe produce kits that offer, while of older tech (and consequently typically suffer from poor fit and have molding quality issues) low parts count, some unique subjects and plus, they are cheap.  The Pegasus Hobbies range of kits are excellent modern toolings, being good value for the money and of some unique subjects.  Moebius Models' kits are also good for the same reason, though some of their kits (like the 'Batman Begins' Batmobile vehicle) are very complex.  HobbyBoss has a range of 1/72 scale aircraft that offer low parts counts and quick construction, though as noted, may also have accuracy issues.  And so it goes...

Regards, Robert

  • Member since
    January 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Monday, August 25, 2014 2:43 PM

I ordered a kit from Zvedza and it, too, has some flash on the parts. There are some pretty delicate small parts I just know they're going to break on me once I try to remove it from the sprue. Just to be on tha safe side, I'm probably gonna need a case of beer before I even attempt to remove them with a sprue cutter. LOL!

  • Member since
    January 2014
  • From: Nampa, Idaho
Posted by jelliott523 on Monday, August 25, 2014 11:25 AM

^^^^^  Agree 100% with that!

On the Bench:  Lots of unfinished projects!  Smile

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Cameron, Texas
Posted by Texgunner on Monday, August 25, 2014 8:05 AM

jelliott523

Gary,

I totally agree, I think its possible to turn this into a beautiful model, its just going to take patience and skill and maybe some elbow grease and Tylenol.  LOL

Yeah, I have also turned to Kentucky bourbon in times like that! Big Smile


"All you mugs need to get busy building, and post pics!"

  • Member since
    January 2014
  • From: Nampa, Idaho
Posted by jelliott523 on Monday, August 25, 2014 7:34 AM

Gary,

I totally agree, I think its possible to turn this into a beautiful model, its just going to take patience and skill and maybe some elbow grease and Tylenol.  LOL

On the Bench:  Lots of unfinished projects!  Smile

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Cameron, Texas
Posted by Texgunner on Sunday, August 24, 2014 9:40 AM

Having both the F-102 and F-106 1/48 Monogram kits, I think they are both quite nice.  Ah, "beauty", that is all in the eye of the beholder, eh?  In all honesty though, my versions are both 20 years old I guess and perhaps more recent versions could have more issues.   I can't see many problems with the kits I have; both should build into nice airplanes, if I do my part.Wink

Gary


"All you mugs need to get busy building, and post pics!"

  • Member since
    January 2014
  • From: Nampa, Idaho
Posted by jelliott523 on Sunday, August 24, 2014 9:20 AM

Now that it seems that we are finally back "on-topic", I want to see if anyone else has run into the same quality problem that I have.  Recently I purchased the Revell/Monogram F-106 in 1/48.  I was super excited to build this one again; I had previously built this exact model about 25 years ago as a kid and thought I'd like to see how (crossing my fingers) how my skills have improved.

After opening the kit I realized it was going to not only show how well my skills have progress, but also, how my patience has progressed as well.  To be honest, I was very disappointed in the quality of the kit.  There is a ton of flash around the parts, the joins from the sprue to the parts is HUGE!  So much so, that I am going to have to do a considerable amount of sanding and filling just to get rid of the "canyons" left on the parts.  I had to use a combination of sprue cutters and razor saws to get some of the parts off the tree.

I'm not sure I would truly call this kit "crap" but, it is definitely going to be a challenge...one I am, for some twisted reason, looking forward too.

On the Bench:  Lots of unfinished projects!  Smile

  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: Pineapple Country, Queensland, Australia
Posted by Wirraway on Sunday, August 24, 2014 2:49 AM

OzMac- you definitely made a silk purse out of a sow's ear on this one.  Those prop blades look 'orrible.  PS:  Next time you come across FREE models, zip some up to Queensland, will ya ?

When I got back into modelling, I cut my teeth on the old Zhengdefu kits that Crazy Clarks used to sell for $7.99.  (Not bad for a 1/48 jet)  And if I screwed up, at least it wasn't on a $40-$50 kit.  Nice work on the Yak.

"Growing old is inevitable; growing up is optional"

" A hobby should pass the time - not fill it"  -Norman Bates

 

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  • Member since
    August 2014
Posted by Ozmac on Sunday, August 24, 2014 2:30 AM

By "carp" models I presume you mean those of fishy quality?

Well, as a beginner to modelling (started last year), I appreciate a good kit can make life easy, but then again a poor kit can steepen up your learning curve. Here's my candidate for truly dreadful kit, so bad I don't know the manufacturer's name.

This is the kit in its totality...

These are the nice prop castings...

And while this ain't no tour-de-force of model-building, it taught this beginner lots about using putty, shaping pieces, painting basic camouflage etc, so it was a memorable model for me.

The kit, by the way, is Russian. It came in a box marked with a completely different plane on the label, and the box in fact contained five of these kits (of a WWII Yak-3, one of Russia's best fighter planes of the war). The good news is that I wasn't ripped off. It was free, as the Russian trade delegation people here in Sydney were tossing out dozens of model plane kits (some of much better quality than this, thankfully). A mate of mine grabbed as many boxes as he could, and so I built two Yak 3s for him, one for me.

So it all comes down to how you define "carp", and like beauty, it's in the eye of the beholder in the end.

  • Member since
    October 2003
  • From: Southern California
Posted by ModelNerd on Saturday, August 23, 2014 11:15 PM

I took a chance several years ago on a Lindbergh Curtiss Goshawk kit I got off EBay for five dollars. Knowing nothing about this very old kit previously, it was a rude awakening to see how much work it would need to make it a decent model. One thing led to another and I ended up engineering and casting my own aftermarket resin kit for it. But yes, I do love the stinker kit! It's a great opportunity to expand my modeling skills and use the oil' noggin.

- Mark

  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: California
Posted by SprueOne on Saturday, August 23, 2014 9:44 PM

I'm at the end of a Tri-Build of T-55 armor tank series kits by SKIF in 1/35.

I bought them for the unique subjects; FAVORIT Driver Trainer Tank, BUBLINA Mine Clearance tank, and SLA APC modified from an IDF Tiran.

That [SKIF] was a major learning experience Bang Head Dunce Black Eye Toast 

Anyone with a good car don't need to be justified - Hazel Motes

 

Iron Rails 2015 by Wayne Cassell Weekend Madness sprueone

  • Member since
    March 2005
  • From: near Nashville, TN
Posted by TarnShip on Saturday, August 23, 2014 5:11 PM

I think this will be it for me.

I don't like the way the post was worded,,,,,it was clearly NOT meant as some sort of compliment.

And then the follow-on posts that say I somehow don't understand English, well, those don't exactly give me any warm and fuzzy feelings.

What I do know is that if I had said it,,,,,it would be taken as an insult.  But, since I am the first to react to it,,,,,I am supposed to just "take it" and then "let it go"

Me am drag stooopud self off to wallow in my skill-less builting up of stuff, now.

almost gone

  • Member since
    June 2004
  • From: 29° 58' N 95° 21' W
Posted by seasick on Saturday, August 23, 2014 3:00 PM

I just finished a F-100C from some brand I never bout before and will never again buy. I finished it up because I was tired of fixing all the problems: tons of flash, poorly fitting parts, a canopy you can't see through. I just gave up.

Chasing the ultimate build.

  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: Sarasota, FL
Posted by RedCorvette on Saturday, August 23, 2014 12:32 PM

I think there were some posts in this thread that drifted a bit off topic may have been misinterpreted.  Just some friends expressing some different opinions.

Mark

FSM Charter Subscriber

  • Member since
    January 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Saturday, August 23, 2014 10:07 AM

As I said - let by-gones be by-gones. Let it go.

  • Member since
    August 2008
Posted by tankerbuilder on Saturday, August 23, 2014 8:15 AM

Hey TarnShip ?

Where you going good buddy ? You ain't gonna " Bug - Out " over this are you  ? I saw nothing that you said as wrong . Maybe like some, you were mis-interpreted  .Look how many times it's happened to me ! Stick good buddy , we need you .      T.B.

  • Member since
    June 2013
  • From: Jax, FL
Posted by Viejo on Saturday, August 23, 2014 1:12 AM

Pretty much any model I work on turns into a crap model.

But I still have fun doing it.....

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Saturday, August 23, 2014 12:36 AM
TarnShip

57 here, 49 years of building since age 8,,,,,,,no break,,,,,,I even volunteered to "pull the duty" so that I could spend 48 hours modeling while guarding the hangar.

Disregard what was here before

Since I will probably be gone on Monday anyway, there wouldn't be any way for me to send that kit to someone with "more skill" than I have, in order for them to show us how great it could turn out.

Rex

Please tell me you're not gonna pop smoke over this... I seriously doubt that you're gonna get a warning for your post, let alone canned. And seriously the whole nature of this thread is so based upon preferences... blondes, brunettes, or redheads? Slender or voluptuous? Virtuous or scandalous? Take your pick.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    February 2006
  • From: Smithers, BC, Canada
Posted by ruddratt on Friday, August 22, 2014 10:47 PM

BlackSheepTwoOneFour

Bronto - you typed this:

There are no crap models, just modelers that don't have enough skill to make a good looking model from these kits.

Well, that WAS me way back when, but it ain't me now.  Personally, I don't see the insult.

Mike

 "We have our own ammunition. It's filled with paint. When we fire it, it makes pretty pictures....scares the hell outta people."

 

  • Member since
    March 2005
  • From: near Nashville, TN
Posted by TarnShip on Friday, August 22, 2014 10:25 PM

57 here, 49 years of building since age 8,,,,,,,no break,,,,,,I even volunteered to "pull the duty" so that I could spend 48 hours modeling while guarding the hangar.

Disregard what was here before

Since I will probably be gone on Monday anyway, there wouldn't be any way for me to send that kit to someone with "more skill" than I have, in order for them to show us how great it could turn out.

Rex

almost gone

  • Member since
    January 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Friday, August 22, 2014 8:20 PM

I'm 49 and have done model kits since I was 6 or 7. Only difference is I just recently returned to this hobby a year ago or so ago after 20 plus year absence.

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