Model Contests

I'm not sure the paper category is still there, as I checked the list for the 2021 Nats and could not find it.  But the first year that paper models had their own category, I saw some really eye-popping models!  There was this Fw-190 that was stunning.  A guy in the Hawaii IPMS chapter only builds paper ship models.  He doesn't use kits; he engineers all of them himself.  How the heck do you roll tapered gun barrels in 1/550 scale?

But back to the OP, yes paper models should be judged against other paper models, not plastic ones.

Real G

As for paper models, I believe they have their own category.  I have made a couple of simple ones, and they are HARD to do!  Even if the colors and markings are already printed on, it takes great craftsmanship to perectly join the pieces.  Imagine pre-painting and decaling an entire plastic kit and not being allowed to sand, putty, or retouch?

Wow!!! I never knew there was such a thing. Just learned something new. Thanks

the Baron

My point was not to say, "Don't go to shows".  My point is to say that competitions can bring out the worst in people-and they don't have to be people with poor social skills-and so, I choose not to compete.  Look at the frustration expressed in the original post.  I build for myself.

 

They often have a table set up for people who want to show their kits but do not wish to compete. Sometimes they are higher level winners, perhaps a national medal winner, and entering it in a local contest seems rather unfair, but he's proud of his work and wants to show folks a national winner.

Others like to show their kits but don't care about competing.

My point was not to say, "Don't go to shows".  My point is to say that competitions can bring out the worst in people-and they don't have to be people with poor social skills-and so, I choose not to compete.  Look at the frustration expressed in the original post.  I build for myself.

HooYah Deep Sea

My local VFW took a big hit, as many places did, due to the china virus situation. The normal income to do their mission of assisting veterans was cut to but a fraction of what is needed on an annual basis. So, I'm thinking, with the proper advertising, a model show might possibly bring in a few bucks (entry fees and admission fees, minus awards) and to help out. What do you folks think; would it be worth attempting or not?

Rob Gronovius

 

 

HooYah Deep Sea

I hope ya'll don't mind, but I'd like to take this in another direction .  .  .

I'm wondering if a model 'show' might be a way to make some money for a good cause.

 

 

 

Well, model shows are usually the primary way clubs earn money to operate outside of membership dues.

 

They hope they do well enough (meaning enough modelers enter and pay fees) to be in the black. Donations from local hobby shops for prizes, Squadron used to be good for some prizes. Revell or Monogram beginner kits for the kiddies.

I had gotten some online folks and model sites to sponsor various awards that my club gave. You get five guys to donate $5 a piece and you have one model award category paid for.

Shows are a lot of work and a lot of money up front. You have to rent a venue, tables, insurance (IPMS and AMPS have blanket policies for their affiliated shows), vendors rent tables and that adds to revenue.

It would be tough for a club to do a show and donate all that money to a worthy cause. They wouldn't have enough money to run their next show. They are, after all, non-profit organizations.

 

Many clulbs and even regional meets often have an auction.  They solicit unbuilt kits from members, local hobby shops and other vendors.  Income from auction goes to club.  It is one way to get rid of excess stash.  Must be unstarted, though, and preferrably unopened.  Many also have a flea market- people rent tables to sell some of their staff, and some local dealers will rent a table.  I always come home from a contest with two or three flea market kits.

HooYah Deep Sea

I hope ya'll don't mind, but I'd like to take this in another direction .  .  .

I'm wondering if a model 'show' might be a way to make some money for a good cause.

They hope they do well enough (meaning enough modelers enter and pay fees) to be in the black. Donations from local hobby shops for prizes, Squadron used to be good for some prizes. Revell or Monogram beginner kits for the kiddies.

I had gotten some online folks and model sites to sponsor various awards that my club gave. You get five guys to donate $5 a piece and you have one model award category paid for.

Shows are a lot of work and a lot of money up front. You have to rent a venue, tables, insurance (IPMS and AMPS have blanket policies for their affiliated shows), vendors rent tables and that adds to revenue.

It would be tough for a club to do a show and donate all that money to a worthy cause. They wouldn't have enough money to run their next show. They are, after all, non-profit organizations.

I've done local stuff, regional stuff, nationals and my favorites were Tamiyacon.  Whatever Mr Tamiya liked won.  End of discussion.

Our club is doing a parking lot swap meet and show next weekend.  Don't think they're doing any fees, just a people's choice award.  That might be a way to go, with several catagories.  No judging, just people's choice votes.

I hope ya'll don't mind, but I'd like to take this in another direction .  .  .

I'm wondering if a model 'show' might be a way to make some money for a good cause.

My local VFW took a big hit, as many places did, due to the china virus situation. The normal income to do their mission of assisting veterans was cut to but a fraction of what is needed on an annual basis. So, I'm thinking, with the proper advertising, a model show might possibly bring in a few bucks (entry fees and admission fees, minus awards) and to help out. What do you folks think; would it be worth attempting or not?

That's exactly how I feel towards contests now Rob!  I look at it more as a social event than a competition.  The local contests allow me to reconnect with modelers who I only get to see at these events. These forum chats, monthly Zoom meetings with my local model club, and the various modeling podcasts have gotten me through these troubling months.  Now that the Covid restrictions are being lowered it's time to get out and see some friends and great builds!

MR TOM SCHRY

Finally, paper models are accepted because their presence supports the IPMS, regardless that the "P" in IPMS stands for plastic.  We have resin,vinyl,photo-etched,metal, and probably more materials being used so everything is included.

Well, technically, resin and vinyl are both plastics.  OK...I know...nobody likes a smart-a**.  Hehehe.  

I prefer non competitive non judged shows with maybe people's choice.  You can show off your work and see what others are doing without competition and hard feelings. 

the Baron

Modeling contests only serve to angry up the blood.

That truly depends on the sociability of the modeler. Some suffer from some a lack of social skills. But most of us know that model #1 is better than model #2, etc. and can accept that others will build better than us.

It's just that the ones with less social skills are more vocal than those who are just there to see other people's kits and show off their own.

Some folks think their stuff is better and everything they build is a masterpiece. I assume my stuff is mediocre at best and happy to get any recognition, even if it's just someone who says, "Great job on that kit."

I go to the shows to see other people's works, most of which I think is better than mine, share some of my works, see other modelers and maybe put a face to an online name, and mainly to find bargains for kits I don't "need" and will probably never built from the vendor tables!

Oh, and if I win a raffle (or a trophy), it was an all round successful day. If I win a kit that I've loved to have but haven't gotten around to it, that's the cherry on top.

There ya go: sportsmanship, etiquette, and honor.  Nuff said.  We should send the Klingons to address any infractions, but this is polite society.

Heh-heh, my personal pet peeve are those guys who are always trying to game the Out Of The Box category rules.  "If you were Klingon, I would KILL you now!!!"

Modeling contests only serve to angry up the blood.

Hi Everyone,

I'd like to thank everyone who has replied to my questions for their feedback/opinions.  I've learned a lot!  Basically, it's up to each individual modeler to decide when a model should be pulled from competition, at least at the local level, due to the lack of enforcement of the IPMS rules, "good sportsmanship", or basic modeling etiquette.  A modeler may enter as many models as they desire regardless if they've been seen on the contest tables year after year, if they've won in previous years, or if they're coated in a layer of dust because usually the entrants' fees for multiple models entered support the local club's coffers.  Finally, paper models are accepted because their presence supports the IPMS, regardless that the "P" in IPMS stands for plastic.  We have resin,vinyl,photo-etched,metal, and probably more materials being used so everything is included.  Then how about changing the title from I.P.M.S. to I.M.S. (International Modelers Society)?  Just something to think about.

Abide by the rules of the contest you're entering. If they allow previous winners from that contest (I'm not aware of any), feel free to do so. If they do not allow regional or national winners, leave those home. As far as an "unwritten rule"of competing upwards, it's as valuable as the paper it's written on. I took a first at an IPMS national in Phoenix. At least one contest organizer asked me to enter in his local contest. I typically do the tour, though it's gotten a lot smaller in the last 20 years for any given kit. How many entries depends on how deep your pocket is. Organizationally, it's a double edged sword: more models means more money but more work for the judges. MOst clubs restrict each entrant to one award per category, i.e., no ssweeps, even if there are fewer that 3 entries, so the person with a dozen 1/72 WWII Navy fighters will take no more than one award in the 1/72  WWII Navy fighters category. He could take none, as well. 

Remember, each local contest is run by a local lclub who sets the rules. IPM/USA sets the rules  for the National Contest only. The club may hew as closely or loosely to the national rules...the club pays its money and takes its chances. 

Some years ago, IPMS/USA realized that an increasing number of models were more that 75% plastic and modifies that rule to simply encouraging plastic but mandating any percentage. Traditionally, the figure category was exempt as long as I can remember since most quality figures were white metal (before the influx of resin.) 

rocketman2000

As far as paper models, long time ago IPMS took their name very literally. But with the advent of aftermarket details of resin, then photo etch, demand rose to include more materials.  The first attempt was percentage of plastic required.  Later they removed materials rules.

IIRC, back in 2003 the IPMS Nationals had a contest category for paper models.  It was not well supported.  Currently paper models will be entered in their normal category (at the National level), just like resin, wood, metal, & 3D.    Material is not a defining criteria.

Local IPMS contests are pretty much free-wheeling but it is preferred that they sort of follow the National approach.   As you move toward regional contests there is more of an expectation that categories match the Nationals and judging.

Also remember that at most local shows there is a per-entry fee.   The first few may be included with your paid registration.   The guy who brings 40 models (we have one of those guys here in Texas) and pays 5 bucks per entry just dropped 200 bucks in the local clubs coffers.  I will take your money all day, paying 5 bucks for a lousy buck-fifty medallion.

And the old joke -- IPMS stands for International Plane Modeling Society

We have had people enter the same models year after year as have I.  Sometimes it's just to get some kind of award, and sometimes it's to increase the amount of entries, and then sometimes it's just so you can have a entry and feel like you are participating.  It varies for everyone.  I have seen some of my things get beaten by the same kit that was put together wwith less skill then others of the same type.   

Anyway, a model can go up the ranks as it wins, but once it hits the first prize in its catagory it's done.  It can be entered in a upper contest, like a regional or national.

First, how many times to enter a model- I enter a model only one time at each venue.  That is whether it wins an award.

As far as paper models, long time ago IPMS took their name very literally. But with the advent of aftermarket details of resin, then photo etch, demand rose to include more materials.  The first attempt was percentage of plastic required.  Later they removed materials rules.

When I was stationed in the Boston, Massachusetts area, there were plenty of shows and modelers brought that that year's crop of kits, and they took them on the circuit for that season.

There was a few guys that brought literally every model they ever made and you'd see those crappy kits at the various shows every year. I thought that was poor form, but it didn't seem like they won much.

The only time I would bring out an older kit is if I had one that hadn't won anything and it fit into the "theme" category for that show.

I know several of those shows had rules regarding previous years' winners not competing again.

As far as #2 goes, the "P" in IPMS is silent and they have long accepted other forms of material like white metal figures, photoetch, resin, wood, and paper/cardboard.

as mentioned winners in local contests can be entered in regionals and regional winners only in nationals. i tend to enter the same model, winner or not in most local contest within a year.  does not mean it will win again though i tend to build in lesser categories (1/35 and 1/72) like wheeled armor, artillery, RR, and civilian trucks though my entries tend to be converted military vehicles in civilian paint with photo backup. it rally annoys the car guys. i took the Roden 1/35 WW1 artillery tractor, found some civilian pics and did it in red with a big torquoise engine appropriately weathered. took 1st and Best of the Rest in a local contest before everything shut down.

a friend and i entered AFV CLUB Strykers, same color, pretty much same amount of weathering, OOB. in the first contest he took a 2nd and i took a 3rd. in the next contest i took a 2nd and he took a 3rd. ofc we thought the others' was the better build.

I might be wrong, but models that won an award at any National IPMS contest can't enter again.  Models can run again in local contests.  

Thanks for your insight/feedback Real G!  I'm not losing sleep over this issue, especially now since I've decided to decrease my entering model contests.  I was not aware of the IPMS rule about reentering a kit that had previously won.  All of the contests I was referring to were official "IPMS" run/judged contests both at the local level and regional level, so I guess I could bring it to the judges' attention at the next contest that I attend(as a spectator, but it probably wouldn't matter).  I guess I wouldn't call myself a "trophy hound" but it just rubs me the wrong way when you witness the same kits entered year after year just to garnish a trophy.

As far as paper models go, I totally agree with you about the skill and patience required to build them and like I said in my orginal post, I do appreciate them.  I even think that if paper models would have been around back in the "magical 60s" when I started modelinig I probably would have gone the paper way(much less expensive)  What I have seen at the contests in my state,at the local and regional level, paper models have been placed on the tables alongside the plastic entries and in a few instances the paper models have either won a first or placed in the top 3.  Just brainstrorming, what I would like to see is either a separate contest for paper models or a separate category just reserved for paper entries at the plastic contests. Just my 2 cents.

Glamdring

This is why I like the Chicago judging system, each model is judged on its own merits and awarded (or not) accordingly.

 

Ah yes, the 1-2-3 versus G-S-B debate.  Each has its merits.

This is why I like the Chicago judging system, each model is judged on its own merits and awarded (or not) accordingly.

Actually there is a written rule in IPMS which says if you place, you cannot re-enter it in the same category another year unless it is part of a Collection or Triathalon category.  You can enter going "up" the tiers, i.e. go from local to regional to national, but not the other way around.

Yes there are trophy hounds, but so long as they abide by enrty rules what can you do.  I have seen them too, but I really don't care about them.

Heh heh, that thing about entering dusty models is close to me, as I have taken old models when I could not finish the intended one.  But I always wash my kits with soap and water before hitting the competition room!

As for paper models, I believe they have their own category.  I have made a couple of simple ones, and they are HARD to do!  Even if the colors and markings are already printed on, it takes great craftsmanship to perectly join the pieces.  Imagine pre-painting and decaling an entire plastic kit and not being allowed to sand, putty, or retouch?

I recall the Great Slot Car vs Model War in the early 1970s, and it just shows that diversity and tolerance serve us better.