Quality Control...Does It Exist?

Interesting - so now Tamiya is TOO perfect?!

I prefer Older (1995+) kits, because they are more difficult to build, and have around the same amount of detail. WHY 1337?!!??! ARE YOU MAD>????!?!? no, would you rather spend 20 minutes building a $90 tamiya and have no sense of accomplishment, or spending 20+ hours on building a $9 model of the EXACT SAME THING and detailing it, and feeling satisfied? My goal in modeling is to overwhelm. So much detail, that the viewer gets crossed eyed, more detail than the real thing, and ACCURACY! accuracy is very important. How many times have you built a part from plans, only to find out it doesnt fit the model you're building it for?

thats my rant

QUOTE: Perhaps our expectations have risen in proportion to the improvement in design quality.

Our expectations have also risen from the ammount of info avaliable. The internet has provided us with an unmatched research tool and a means for rapid communication that didn't exist in the 80's.
If 1 person is dissatisfied with a kit hundreds of thousands of people could know in hours.

We are really talking about three types of quality here: quality of the design, quality in manufacture, and quality of the complete final product.

The first type of quality is set in the "R&D" stage when the concept of the model is reduced to a concrete design. If the original design is flawed then the best plastic won't save it. It seems to me that design has distinctly improved in the better companies. Some manufacturers have recently recalled or replaced products with design flaws. I don't recall that happening 10-15 years ago. Modelers now expect more. It's not enough that a product generally resemble the 1:1 object, it has to have accurate details for the variant depicted. Perhaps our expectations have risen in proportion to the improvement in design quality.

Quality in manufacture is just what it says. Are the molds tooled according to the design? Are the parts warped or undershot? Quality at this point is set by plant managment and those working on the line, and is a compromise of quality and cost. Comparing the models I have from years ago with today's product, I think things have improved here too, but then again, maybe I'm just more savvy about which manufacturers to trust.

The third type of quality is the whole package: does the final product meet the customer's expectations? An incomprehensible instruction sheet or bad decals can undermine an otherwise good effort. Like someone else said, do these people ever actually try building the model before they ship it? As an outsider, this is a hard one for me to understand. Given that you have to print an instruction sheet anyway, does designing a good sheet really cost that much more than a lousy one?

The Trumpeter story is a great example. But see, what seems to be the underlying feeling is that "It's better than it was way back when!" But see, it's NOT way back when...it's NOW. I don't think any one of us would ever expect to purchase our next car if it only used 1960's technology today would we? There's no reason a manufacturer should try and force us to either when there are so many other choices available. Sure you can update, but you don't need to be locked into something, just because that's the way it was done 10, 20, 30, or 50 years ago. To me that argument just doesn't hold water.

As for the newer companies, there is a decision that should be made when they first decide to apply for their business license. "Will we be able to compete?" The world is driven by consumerism and once you decide to enter the market, there's a level of performance that will be expected. If a company doesn't do their homework to see what the current state-of-the-art is in their field, and then decide if they can reasonably follow it, then perhaps they should re-think their timing to join the business in the first place.

If you can't run, a marathon is a lousy place to try and learn how.

Get the kinks worked out BEFORE you open your doors (or start filling boxes with styrene) - don't expect your customers to do it for you...or worse, have to point them out to you. It only does a great disservice to modelers and particularly to newer modelers who may very well not know any better, to offer sub-standard kits.

While its true that the majority of companies will never meet the level of competence of the best molders out there such as Trumpeter, Tamiya, AFV Club, etc. etc., these are the comapnies that have raised the bar. The fact is there is a new level of expectation from the modeling community with the kits these comapines produce. We now know what CAN be done and shouldn't just be willing to eaccept what HAS been done in the past.

I will probably get hazed for this but here goes. Time is money and it doesnt grow on trees. It cost's a lot of money to make the tooling for a model kit and that cost gets passed to......... you guessed it US! I would like to have a perfect hassle free kit as much as anyone else but it aint gonna happen. Human beings are not perfect and mistakes happen some that shouldnt to be sure but its an imperfect world. I only recently got back into the hobby after 10-15 years but I can tell you one thing the selection available today is a lot better than what I had. And take into consideration the after market segment which has grown by leaps and bounds and shows no signs of abating. Now this is not to say that you shouldnt get what you pay for I think that instruction sheets should be as foolproof as possible so that younger modelers can start and enjoy this hobbie along with the rest of us cause when were gone whos gonna take over the reins. But I think that most makers are trying to do there best within reason, you only have to look at Trumpeter and there F4F kit, They redesigned it within months of releasing it to correct the fuselage. Well theres my 2 cents!!!!!

QUOTE: Originally posted by 1337 simply said, like you could do a better job

This is exactly the attitude that seems to me to allow poor quality and non-existant customer service to proliferate. If you let a company 'get by' with sub-standard product/service, then they'll keep on doin' it. I really don't find ANY excuse for not stepping up to the plate and doing it right from the start. We don't live in the early bronze age - or worse the jurassic!

There is plenty of technology available today to allow for really top rate quality control. There are also plenty of jobs available for people who WANT to do a good job. Even in dealing with our two LHS, there is one that has better prices almost all the time - yet I refuse to shop there when I can help it. Our more expensive shop may cost me more in the end, buy their service is second to none.

As has been pointed out before, in the electronic age there is no shortage of information or communication of thoughts, ideas and opinions. It would seem prudent - in fact now more than ever before - for modeling companies to take a look at what's happening around them. Competition is keen and the kits should be too.

Brian~

My :

1) With the sheer number of parts in a modern kit a perfect fit can't be expected so I don't mind a little putty work.

2) Some innacurate detail is acceptable considering what is necessary to research some subjects.

3) My bigest peeve is bad instructions (such as the Trump. JS-3M), The company needs to have somebody assemble the kit before releaseing it.
There is NO acceptable excuse for bad instructions

QUOTE: Originally posted by leemitcheltree Yeah, Chris - I also find it simply amazing that a company can market and sell an item that is, to put it politely, bloody crap. I'm responsible for Quality Assurance and R&D and my company - and it never ceases to amaze me just how many of our workers are happy to produce extraordinarily average work....... The thing that annoys me is that I'm the one that goes to trade shows and deals with the end users, deals with warranty issues - I'm the one that gets hammered by these guys, and the workers never have to deal with the purchasers of our machines on a face to face basis. Where is the pride in craftsmanship? Where is the company pride? Bloody well boggles the mind...........

I hear your pain. The happiest day at my current position was when they split quality control from my dept. It is amazing how hard it is to make people care about their jobs. I was told early on that what you do for a living and how you do is a good measure of your personal worth.

Word of mouth travels very fast these days and if the main players want to stay on top they need to do the utmost job of it. There are many new companies these days putting out decent products and sometimes their lower prices will sway buyers. I'd prefer to pay more for quality like a Tamiya over a cheaper copy by some Eastern bloc nation with many issues on accuracy.

simply said, like you could do a better job

I'll have to disagree to a certain extent here.

The question at hand is, "Does Quality Control Exist?" The obvious answer is, Yes. Of course it does. No model company in the world could remain in business more than six months without having Quality Control. The real questions should be, "How good is Quality Control for company X or company Y." and probably more importantly, "How much will it cost and how much are modelers willing to pay for a model that is 99 - 100% accurate to scale, has a guarantee that there are no errors in the instructions, and has abosolutely perfect fit on all parts?"

It has been stated here - and it is true - that it all comes down to money. Companies in today's market cannot get away with the things they did 10, 20, or 30 years ago when it comes to problems with quality. But even the best companies will have occational errors that slip through the cracks and must always balance their Quality Control efforts against their profit margin. After all, they are are not in business JUST to make good models. They have to make enough money to pay employees, acquire raw materials, pay for utilities, dedicate funds to R&D, pay for marketing and advertising...the list is very long indeed.

We've all either had a horror story or heard about one from someone concerning problems that should have been corrected in Quality Control. Problems that cannot be corrected simply by the modeler are not acceptable and should not be tolerated. Some problems are so bad that it's amazing anyone still buys the kits involved. But all-in-all, model makers today are doing a pretty good job (IMHO) when it comes to producing a quality model kits at a fair price.

Is Quality Control as good as it can be? It varies from company to company and dramtically varies when talking about kits produced 10, 20, or 30 years ago. Can Quality Control be better? In some companies, yes. It can and should be improved quite a bit. In other companies, Quality Control is pretty darn good and only needs a little tweeking periodically to keep the standards high.

Here is my own take the issue. I would personally rather buy a $30 kit that requires a litlle work than have to pay $100 or more for an absolutely perfect kit. Now, would I rather have a $30 perfect kit? Of course I would, but I don't think it can be done. Not in todays marketplace. For the prices I'm paying, I can gladly accept a few minor errors in the instructions or minor problems with parts that will require me to do a bit of sanding or filling. I am exceedingly pleased that many companies are now producing kits with virtually no errors for an amazingly inexpensive end item cost. I hope this trend continues.

QUOTE: Originally posted by 1337 Have you ever bought a kit missing the wings, fuselage, interior, landing gear, and rear empinage (sp) empty sprue's, full clear sprue, and not tampered with.

The worst I bought was an Airfix HMS Tiger Cruiser that was literally missing one-half of the two-piece hull! Kind of hard to put together that way! Maybe I'll have to make a "cut-away" model when my skills improve!

Have you ever bought a kit missing the wings, fuselage, interior, landing gear, and rear empinage (sp)
empty sprue's, full clear sprue, and not tampered with.

I also find it funny that some modelers will try and feed you the line about: "Well, if you want to be a modeler, learn to fix it or get out of this hobby. That's just part of the game."

BULLOCKS!

If it were part of the game I would never have started! I think a well made kit that slides together relatively seamlessly (pardon the pun) is a thing of joy, and I feel I am able to put much more of myself into it then. I am also able to ENJOY the build, rather than trying to figure out how to join that quarter inch gap along the wing root, or fit two halves of fuselage together that obviously must have come from two different planes.

I do think that there is a stronger call to the makers to watch their P's and Q's with the end users of their products now. However, there is still the mind-set with many companies that hs been mentioned here before - "We're the only one's who make this, and so you'll buy it with a smile - regardless of whatever tripe we put in the box!"

Sad. I'm not going to hold my breath that anything is changing anytime soon - but who knows. Maybe before I die??

trouble is , they have the attitude , they cant get this kit elsewhere , we got there money stuff them !
we will make another kit they cant get except from us , basically bugger you jack i'm OK

You would think that some of these companys never actually build there kits off the assembly line. Or even care, they just want your coins.

It is a shame that so many business have removed the word Quality from their vocabulary and replaced it with profit. We who build models are probably more keenly aware of poor workmanship than many other individuals. It's a sin how much models cost these days. And when there is no other game in town these suppliers continue to push out, as Lee said it "Bloody Crap!" When it comes to building I am no Swanny or Pix just to name a couple so I am satisfied to go back to the old standby Monogram - Revell and be satisfied with good enough. At least for the price the quality is not too bad. My two cents.

Richard

This is one of the things that is going to get better as time goes by. The reason for it is forums just like this one.

Years ago companies could count on being able to slap a pretty cover on a box and an expensive advertisement in a magazine and then sell a mediocre kit (or anything else since this also extends into areas outside modeling) for a ridiculous price and get away with it. If a person bought a bad kit he could tell his close friends, but the word spread slowly and the kit sold thousands of copies before the word got around to stay away from it.

No longer. One person buys one crappy kit and the next day hundreds of people stay away from it. The next day, thousands. Information is power and in this case the power is ours. Buy a bad kit, let the world know. The kit either gets fixed or it doesn't sell. Simple as that.

To answer your question, yes it truly does tick me off. I've got one in the basement that is not worth anything but melting down.

Quality Control? Everything I get issued is made by the lowest bidder, so I guess if it's something that I really want, in my line of work, I usually go and buy what I want with my own money and use what I can from Uncle Sam.

Oh, but on models? Yeah, I don't mind little inaccuracies, but when it looks like the company threw the whole thing together after a weekend bender in New Orleans,just to get it on the shelf, and advertise it like its the greatest kit since plastic was invented, then I have issues with that company and I'll hold a grudge for a long time.

Yeah, Chris - I also find it simply amazing that a company can market and sell an item that is, to put it politely, bloody crap.
I'm responsible for Quality Assurance and R&D and my company - and it never ceases to amaze me just how many of our workers are happy to produce extraordinarily average work.......
The thing that annoys me is that I'm the one that goes to trade shows and deals with the end users, deals with warranty issues - I'm the one that gets hammered by these guys, and the workers never have to deal with the purchasers of our machines on a face to face basis.
Where is the pride in craftsmanship? Where is the company pride?
Bloody well boggles the mind...........

faulty/really confusing directions really make me mad!
I built italeris 1/72 T-34/76 had no numbers on the parst sprue. luckily not alot of parts