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Safety First (Long Post)

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  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: USA
Safety First (Long Post)
Posted by MusicCity on Friday, August 27, 2004 8:35 AM
This post is long but it contains some things that I feel need to be said. I have seen posts recently, both here and on some other forums I visit, that indicate to me that people aren't really being as careful as they should be. Things like "Is this glue really not toxic" or "Should I use a respirator / spray booth" or "How do I adjust my compressor". These are things that you should be aware of BEFORE you start using them, and it bothers me that people are taking unnecessary chances.

This is one of those hobbies that can be as safe or dangerous as you allow it to be. In my 40-odd years of building models, it can safely be said that I have done every stupid thing you can imagine. I have cut myself with razor knives and saws, I have ground myself with Dremel tools, I've painted most of my body at one time or another, I've breathed enough paint and glue to choke a mule, I've glued fingers together, parts to fingers, fingers to benches and tools, you name it. I was in the emergency room once as a kid to have a piece of styrene removed from my right eye that came blasting off the sprue when I clipped it. The sad thing is that every single one of these could have been avoided if I had been just a little bit more careful.

I'm sure there are dozens of safety-related stories that can be added, and I encourage everyone to do so. If we keep one person from getting hurt it makes it worthwhile.

CHEMICALS ...
We use a lot of different chemicals when building models; paint, glue, accelerators, soap, decal solutions, Future, etc, etc, etc. Some of these chemicals are labeled as being "Non-Toxic" but are they? Manufacturers are in business to sell their products. They would not sell many if they had labels like "This stuff will kill you dead!" so they sugar-coat it with ambiguous terms like "Safe when used as directed" or "Use adequate ventilation" or "Avoid prolonged exposure". Well, what is "Adequate" ventilation? A 10,000 cfm vacuum fan directly over your head with particulate and organic vapor separation? Or is it just simply opening a window? "Adequate Ventilation" is an ambiguous term and simply protects the manufacturer from liability. I can hear it in the courtroom now, "Well, apparently he didn’t use 'Adequate' ventilation." Same for "Avoid Prolonged Exposure". How long is "Prolonged"? A day? An hour? A Minute? Again, this protects the manufacturer without coming right out and stating that their chemical may be harmful. How about "Used As Directed"? Every sprayed Future on a model? That isn't "Used As Directed" for a floor product that was meant to be poured on a floor and then spread out with a mop.

Another thing to keep in mind is that in many cases the manufacturers have no idea what the long-term consequences of using their product are going to be. After WWII there were several deaths among women across the country. People across the country die every day so nobody thought much about it, but the cause of death of these women was unusual. It wasn't until several years later that someone managed to put the pieces together. All of these women had worked for the same division of the same plant during the war. When the war was over, the plant closed, and the women scattered across the country. The plant made watches, and the job these women had was to paint the numerals on the watch faces with paint that glowed in the dark. The numerals were small, so to paint them accurately the women normally licked the tips of their paint brushes to keep the bristles tight. The chemical that caused the paint to glow was radium and these women all died from radium poisoning.

The bottom line is this: If it's not pure water it is probably dangerous in some way. It probably should not be put in your mouth or breathed or spilled on your skin. Are glue fumes toxic if you sit there and breathe them all day long? Probably! Is acrylic paint non-toxic? It probably won't hurt to swallow a little bit, but acrylic is a form of plastic and coating the inside of your lungs with a coat of plastic is not a good idea! Should I be using a respirator or spray booth or fan? Yes, you certainly should be!

I'm as guilty as anyone else about not using my respirator all the time, but we should. The chemicals we use are not completely safe and we should all exercise caution when using them. Use your head. Keep a fan blowing to keep fumes away from your face. If you are spraying paint, do it outside or use a respirator or spray booth. If you use a respirator, check your mask and cartridges! They do no good if they aren't working.

SANDING AND GRINDING ...
Some people stop and think about this, most don't. Ever noticed that when you sand a bunch of plastic off a piece that there is a bunch of dust on your hands and the model? Of course you have. That dust HAS to be removed before you can paint the piece! Ever wondered how much of it went in your lungs? If it's in the air you are breathing it so part of it went in your lungs. How about your eyes? Your eyes are moist and snag dust out of the air all the time, so part of that plastic dust is getting in your eyes.

I've seen a lot of cautions here about sanding resin kits. People are good about cautioning people that the dust from resin parts is harmful and to use a particle mask while sanding it. That is very commendable, but I have yet to see a post that reminds people to clean up their workspace after sanding. You sit there happily sanding away on your resin parts for a couple of hours wearing your mask the whole time. You get done, take the mask off, dust yourself off, and go upstairs (or downstairs or whatever). When you started moving around you stirred up the dust that was on the floor and bench and your clothes, but you had already taken your mask off to. So why did you bother to wear it while sanding?

Clean up your work area when you are done. Vacuum it if possible, take some damp paper towels and pick up the dust. It doesn't take long and it makes wearing that dust mask worth the effort.

EYE PROTECTION ...
And of course there are the infamous Dremel tool stories. Everyone has one, everyone has seen their share of plastic shredded and cutoff wheels shattered. Everyone has also seen the labels that say "Use Eye Protection" but how many actually do?

Those of us who wear glasses feel that we already have adequate eye protection, but are your glasses impact and shatter resistant? Yes, you say? Notice I said "Resistant" and not impact and shatter "Proof". "Resistant" is yet another ambiguous phrase that manufacturers like to use. Define "Resistant". A plastic bag is "Resistant" to impact from a feather, but that's about all. By definition though, a manufacturer could claim their plastic bags to be "Impact Resistant" since they don't have to specify what impact is used. A cutoff wheel in a Dremel tool that shatters and slaps you in the face will most assuredly go right through an eyeball unless there is something there to stop it.

I shoot pistol competitions, so the reality of "Impact Resistant" has been shown to me. There is no telling how many times I've had shards of gilding metal bounce off my glasses when people are shooting steel, or chips of rock kicked up. I will ONLY use glasses made of polycarbonate because I know for a fact that it can withstand some pretty good impact. I have also used Lexan (polycarbonate) body shells on R/C cars that I used to race, so I have seen what this stuff can hold up to.

Get some safety glasses. Use them! The old adage that you only have one pair of eyes is just an adage until you lose one of them. Luckily I've managed to hold onto both of mine, but sometimes I wonder how. As I mentioned at the top of this post, I went to the emergency room once to have a piece of styrene removed from an eye. What really brought it home to me was an incident once. I was holding a small part with some tweezers and had just put a small drop of CA glue on it. It shot out of the tweezers, naturally. Luckily I found this piece. It wasn't hard. It was stuck to my glasses right in front of my eye. I have learned that wearing safety glasses is the best insurance I can possibly buy.

KNIVES AND SAWS ...
The only reason I include this section is because it is so obvious. I have been cut, gouged, sliced, sawed, hacked, and everything else. The sad thing is that every single incident could have been avoided if I had been paying attention to what I was doing. Do I even need to say that razor knives and saws are dangerous? Be careful with them, please.

COMPRESSED AIR ...
Those of us who airbrush are familiar with compressed air in one form of another, but we also tend to take it for granted.

I've mentioned this story a couple of times on this forum, but it bears repeating because it makes a point. My college machine shop had two patches in the concrete block wall. The first day of class the instructor made a point of telling everyone where those patches came from. The smaller of the two was from a horizontal milling machine that used a magnetic chuck to hold the material. Someone forgot to engage the magnetic chuck and the part he was milling was shot right through the wall. The larger of the two, about two feet square, was caused by an oxygen tank that someone carelessly knocked over. It hit a bench and broke the valve off. The pressure in the tank caused if to fly around the shop until it finally hit the wall and broke it.

Any gas under pressure is DANGEROUS when it is released. This includes compressors, hoses, fittings, CO2 tanks, propellant cans, even paint spray cans. Everything that contains any form of compressed gas has a maximum pressure rating, and that rating tends to get lower as time goes by. Hoses get old and brittle, tanks get rusty, and pressure limits go down. If you exceed the maximum pressure of a component you are probably not going to like the results of what happens.

Compressors normally come with an instruction booklet. This booklet has some important safety considerations included in it. Did you read yours? I didn't because I'm just like everyone else. Hoses and fittings have a pressure rating and if you exceed it they can rupture. Hobby-type compressors seldom produce enough pressure to cause problems, but general purpose compressors like many of us use are certainly capable of doing so. My compressor pressurizes the tank to 140 psi, but my hoses and fittings are rated at 90 psi. You need to check things like this because the only person who can insure that you are safe is you.

Rust is a common enemy of compressors and air tanks. Any time you compress air the moisture that is always present in air is squeezed out and condenses in the tank. If the water is left in the tank it will cause rust which will weaken the walls of the tank. Drain your compressor daily, or if you use an air tank, drain it each time you refill it. Check your hoses occasionally. Bend them into a tight loop and see if they look frayed or split. If they are, replace them. Compressor tanks have a safety valve on them. Check to insure that it is working properly on a regular basis.

AND FINALLY ...
Above all, use your head. Don't assume that everything is safe, insure that it is. Don't concentrate so hard on building your model that you forget to take care of yourself.

Everone feel free to expand on these topics and add your experiences. Knowledge is power!
Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page
  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Perth, Western Australia
Posted by madmike on Friday, August 27, 2004 8:49 AM
Thanks for that post.!

I try and sand wet, but you are right, a cleanup of my workbench is in order and I will check the cartridges in my respirator, before I use my airbrush this weekend.

Glue fumes do worry me, especially CA/Accelerator fumes. I think a fan on low will be going on whilst working at my desk.

Well writen and most thought provoking.

Cheers

Mike
"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use." - Galileo Galilei
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Friday, August 27, 2004 10:56 AM
I sleep in the room I model in, and that bugs me, alot...

Mostly think it's the sanding dust and fumes from stuff getting me -__-

But it's the only room in the house I can do this stuff in... And it sucks, alot... I've been trying to wet sand more often though, isn't that better or something?
  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: 37deg 40.13' N 95deg 29.10'W
Posted by scottrc on Friday, August 27, 2004 11:21 AM
Don't forget fire. Without ventilation, and proper storage of our chemicals, paints, and thinners, the hobby room could be likely place for a fire or explosion to occur.

Keep lids on tight, store combustibles away from areas where sparks and flames may happen, and be aware or the proximity of pilot lights. Keep dust, vapors, and fumes controlled. Make sure the smoke detector is working, and its a good idea to keep a fire extinguisher close by.


Kudos from Spot the FiredogBig Smile [:D]

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Canada / Czech Republic
Posted by upnorth on Friday, August 27, 2004 11:36 AM
NOTE: This is a post I've made before, just copied and pasted from the last time I made it.


Back in college, I picked up a book in the college bookstore about safety with all sorts of art supplies.

It was handy to me in college and an incredible materials and safety reference to me in modeling.

The book is:

Health Hazards Manual for Artists
By: Michael McCann
ISBN# 0-941130-06-1

Mine is the third edition and I understand its in either fourth or fifth edition by now.

It has extensive sections on all sorts of paints, solvents and adhesives as well as a very good section on resin casting materials.

Its a real eye opener and I'd say a must for any level of modeler, especially those who get into the more advanced stuff, like their own resin casting.

I think no serious modeler should be without a copy of this book. Safety is sadly under appreciated until one has to do some serious damage control.

I'd also keep the number of the local poison control centre, if you have one, near your workbench or phone nearest to it.

These are just those things that are better to have and not need than to need and not have.
  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Pensacola, FL
Posted by Foster7155 on Friday, August 27, 2004 12:54 PM
Excellent post!

While I don't agree with every statement, I do agree that people need to take safety seriously.

I'll probably take some heat for this, but here it is. I'm an "old-school" modeler who does not own a spray booth, respirator, or fancy ventilation system. Does that make me unsafe? It depends on your definition of unsafe, I suppose. Everyone must evalute their own risks realistically and apply safety precautions that they deem necessary to mediate those risks.

I prefer to use good old-fashioned wisdom and common sense. If my modeling ever begins to feel like a job because of safety equipment, checklists, and procedures, I'll be taking up a new hobby.

Once again, great post!

Enjoy your modeling...

Robert Foster

Pensacola Modeleers

  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: 37deg 40.13' N 95deg 29.10'W
Posted by scottrc on Friday, August 27, 2004 2:19 PM
I once worked in a bodyshop. The new guys would dress up in Tyvek bunny suites and resperators and go paint. The old guys (in their 40s and 50s) would just go into the spraybooth in their work clothes, no resperator, and spray away until only their feet could been seen through all the mist.

And everyone was a two pack a day smoker.....................Go figure.

  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: USA
Posted by MusicCity on Friday, August 27, 2004 3:16 PM
QUOTE:
While I don't agree with every statement, I do agree that people need to take safety seriously.

That was the whole idea behind the post in the first place. I wrote it, but to be completely honest I don't follow all those rules either. The goal was to make people think about some of the risks and then let them evaluate them in their own way.

My only personal absolutely cast-in-stone rule is eye protection. I like my eyes right where they are and prefer to keep them that way.

ScottRC your comments about fire are absolutely right. I store my paint right next to my gunpowder and primers Big Smile [:D]
Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page
  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: The flat lands of the Southeast
Posted by styrene on Friday, August 27, 2004 6:44 PM
Excellent, Scott!

Of course, I couldn't let this post go without a couple comments.

1. I have to agree with Foster. The one thing I used to tell my students when I taught Hazardous Materials courses was that "common sense is authorized". Sometimes additional informtion is needed to do a job safely, but there are times when there is simply too much information. Solid training, plus a healthy dose of common sense goes a long way.

2. As far as chemicals go, the one avenue of exposure that doesn't seem to get enough mention, but which has the potential to be the most insidious is ingestion. Scott, you made a good point about dusts; and to those who wet sand, there is significant dust reduction when that control is implemented. However, I , like many of you, like to nibble and snack during my time at the bench, and most of that is "finger food". For those who work with toxic metals such as lead (e.g., making your own fishing weights, reloading, the use of bullets in the noses of aircraft to make them heavier, shaping older ship fittings, soldering using 60/40 or 70/30 solders--and the list goes on), finger foods may pose even more of a problem insofar as ingestion is concerned.
The important thing is to wash your hands thoroughly prior to eating, drinking, and yes, even going to the bathroom. Fingers coated with different solvent materials (glues, paints, and the like) can transfer those potential problems to other, rather-uhhh-sensitive areas. Because skin pores in those areas may be more open due to the increased heat, they stand to offer a faster exposure route to the bloodstream, or possibly quicker effects (dermatitis) from simple contact.
Although this may be fairly unpopular, eating and drinking should take place in another area--especially if toxic metals are being used. But remember, common sense is still authorized.

3. On safety glasses: They are the number one piece of safety equipment any modeler should have on their bench or in their hobby box. Chemicals usually take years to show their long term effects, because our livers and kidneys can usually metabolize those products faster than we breathe them in--given the quantities we use, but our eyesight can be changed instantaneously; unfortunately, they quite often cannot be fixed. CA glues and flying particulates (particularly from motor tools) can cause serious problems quickly.
When selecting safety glasses, don't pay attention to language that talks about "impact resistance". Look for a label that mentions compatibility with ANSI Z87.1. This is the national standard for how safety glasses are to perform and be tested. True safety glasses will also have the ANSI label either on the lens somewhere or on the frame.

I'll probably think of more stuff later. Hope this helps someone.

Gip Winecoff

1882: "God is dead"--F. Nietzsche

1900: "Nietzsche is dead"--God

  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: USA
Posted by MusicCity on Saturday, August 28, 2004 5:48 AM
Gip, your input is always welcome, as is everyone else's, and very much appreciated. I actually hoped you would see this post because of your experience in this type of matter.

I've had a lot of diverse hobbies over the years in addition to modeling. In addition to breathing paint and glue fumes, I messed with electronics for many years so there is no telling how many miles of solder I've used and lead vapor I've inhaled. I've reloaded shotgun, rifle, and pistol cartridges for years, and once again there's that lead involvement. I've smoked for most of my life, so there is the hand to cigarette to mouth problem. I'm a "Child Of The 50's" so I grew up with lead paint everywhere, as well as asbestos insulation and all the other "Hazards" recognized today. A couple of years ago I was in the ER for a kidney stone and was quite surprised when the doctor asked what happened to my right kidney. Seems it's about the size of a peanut and only operating at about 5% of normal capacity. Is it related to that long term exposure to lead and paint? I don't know, maybe, maybe not. If it is, it could have been avoided.

This hobby is unique in that the ages or our participants range from young to old. The affects of exposure to some chemicals and materials is cumulative, as Gip mentioned, and hopefully this information will help prevent some of our younger members from having some problems as the get older.
Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, August 28, 2004 9:38 AM
i live in the tropics and so my workroom is my bedroom. my room fairly large, and i have 5X10 windows right next to my table. i dont use an airbrush (yet) . should i be worried about paint and glue fumes from bottles? also, when i spray from rattle cans, i usually go out to the balcolny where its pretty much 100% open air, save for waist height walls. i squat down to spray, and take frequent fresh air breaks to allow the propellant to dissapate. should i be worried about fumes from the rattle cans ?
  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: Hayward, CA
Posted by MikeV on Saturday, August 28, 2004 11:41 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by scottrc

I once worked in a bodyshop. The new guys would dress up in Tyvek bunny suites and resperators and go paint. The old guys (in their 40s and 50s) would just go into the spraybooth in their work clothes, no resperator, and spray away until only their feet could been seen through all the mist.

And everyone was a two pack a day smoker.....................Go figure.


Those are the guys who have or will have COPD (emphysema) too.
The catalyzed isocyanate clears used these days can enter the body through the nose, mouth and even eyes so that is why they wear the suits and use fresh air systems in a full face mask. My friend Scooter is old-school also and he has inhalers for the lung damage he sustained from 40 years of airbrushing in the automotive field.

Mike

Wisdom is the right use of knowledge. To know is not to be wise. Many men know a great deal, and are all the greater fools for it. There is no fool so great a fool as a knowing fool. But to know how to use knowledge is to have wisdom. " Charles Spurgeon
  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: USA
Posted by MusicCity on Saturday, August 28, 2004 4:31 PM
QUOTE: i live in the tropics and so my workroom is my bedroom. my room fairly large, and i have 5X10 windows right next to my table. i dont use an airbrush (yet) . should i be worried about paint and glue fumes from bottles?

I don't think so. Glue maybe, cyanoacrylate fumes can be rough. To be on the safe side, get a small fan fan and put on the side of your table blowing toward the window. Any fumes should be blown away.

QUOTE: also, when i spray from rattle cans, i usually go out to the balcolny where its pretty much 100% open air, save for waist height walls. i squat down to spray, and take frequent fresh air breaks to allow the propellant to dissapate. should i be worried about fumes from the rattle cans ?

As long as the breeze doesn't blow the paint in your face you should be fine, but I'm not an organic chemist. If I use rattle-cans I go outside as well. I always shoot a little bit straight up to see which way the air is moving, and then position myself so the fumes will blow away from me.
Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page
  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: A secret workshop somewhere in England
Posted by TANGO 1 on Saturday, August 28, 2004 5:06 PM
Well written post. I had a nasty episode with glue when I was a kid and had to learn the hard way, hopefully this won't happen to people who read your post. Many thanks for taking the time to write it.

Regards,

Darren.
Regards, Darren. C.A.G. FAA/USNFAW GB
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: NE Georgia
Posted by Keyworth on Saturday, August 28, 2004 7:14 PM
Scott, thanks for a well-written and thought-provoking post. I, too, have maimed, glued and painted myself into some interesitng situations when I was a younger model builder. The worst offense was using rattle cans and my airbrush in my bedroom without ventilation. I got lucky; no COPD, but I had gotten smarter, too. I don't start any build until the spraybooth/fume hood is on, the dust collector/filter setup I built is on, and the respirator is ready. Perhaps your comments and the followups others posted can save someone reading this thread from a lifetime of misery. Thanks again. - Ed
"There's no problem that can't be solved with a suitable application of high explosives"
  • Member since
    September 2003
  • From: New Zealand
Posted by nicholma on Sunday, August 29, 2004 3:23 AM
Yes its all common sense isn't it but there again sense isn't always common is it!? Its timely to have a reminder like this because we can all fall into bad habits. I always use a mask when I'm using a spary can. I can recall when I was first using them and had spent a long time painting several things without a mask. I sneezed at one point and the colour of the handkerchief was quite extraordinary! Since then always with a mask.
Kia ora, Mark "Time flies like the wind, fruit flies like bananas"
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