Metal rotor blades?

Hello!

Weel you better not go all out on your first helo (not chopper!) build. Wouldn't it be better to gather some experience before?

Now metal blades is not something you see often (or at all) on scale helicopter models. If you are going for the blade sag (which might or might not be there, depending on blade and rotor head design), then it usually can be at the point of glueing the rotor together, sometimes by bending the blades slightly. Styrene will hold this bend and everything will be just fine.

If you go for metal, on the other hand, you get yourself a whole new bunch of problems. Like how do you retain the blade profile? I mean the sheet metal has to be really thin to stay flexible (that's what you are going for, right) and light - or else you are going to need a titanium rotor head for the rotor to stay one piece. With such thin sheet metal, do you plan to fill the blade with honeycom structure or something? Or how are you going to keep the sheet metal from being totally flat when you bend the blades? Not to speak of the problems of joining the sheet metal pieces together - CA glue might not be enough here.

So sorry for being so pesimistic, but my advice would be to forget the metal blades and concentrate on something else - maybe put some metal miniguns in? Anyhow, good luck with your build, don't forget to post some pictures, and have a nice day

Paweł

I agree w/Pawel above.  Aditionally, the rotor blades (not props) on an MH-60S, or any H-60 version, do not sag very much when sitting on the ground. A gentle arch bent into the kit blades will suffice to "sag" them.

If you want to try some super detailing, you can get the various Eduard PE sets for this aircraft.  They have a bunch of sets.  I did one a while ago with all the Eduard sets and some Cobra Company (CC) resin update sets.  Unfortunately, CC is now out of business, but Lone Star Models bought their masters and is slowly releasing the old CC products.

You can read about my build here: http://aeroscale.kitmaker.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=features&file=view&artid=6848&page=1

Pawel

Weel you better not go all out on your first helo (not chopper!) build.

Nothing wrong with the term chopper. Back in my young soldier days we used that term or “bird” for any rotary wing aircraft. “Helo” was not in US Army vernacular at that time, but was a Navy/Marine Corps word.

As far as the original concept of the post goes, to fabricate replacement rotor blades out of metal to get the droop, I really have no idea as how to do that.

Stik - since this is a Navy machine, I have posted this remark. I read that the sailors really dislike their "helos" being called "choppers".

Have a nice day!

Paweł

I think the air foil profile is the most important thing. Bending plastic blades is not difficult.

I appreciate all the advice folks. I apologize for the incorrect terminology. Like I said it's my first helicopter build, coming from years of nothing but tanks and planes and a smattering of cars (originally all I used to do was Warhammer 40k models for 15 years, but that's a whole different beast!)

I will take your guys advice and just work on actually building the kit OOB and having it look good. On a side note, mentioning the metal mini guns, I couldn't find metal ones, disnt know they made them, but I DID pick up some really nice resin Cargo Door M134D Mount ones from Live Resin.

Also I would love to post pics of my build, but I have no idea what service to use now since photobucket went to the dark side a while back. That's been the main reason for my lack of WIP posts, dont know how to show what I'm working on. Any suggestions for a good free hosting site or what you folks are using?

I use Fotki, $ 24 a year.No ads, easy to use, no dating ads when others link to my posted pictures.

Reaper420

On a side note, mentioning the metal mini guns, I couldn't find metal ones, disnt know they made them, but I DID pick up some really nice resin Cargo Door M134D Mount ones from Live Resin.

Pretty much all solid metal accessories have been eclipsed by resin.  The Live-Resin stuff is really nice.  I highly recommend them, especially thier helo gun sets.  You can find metal barrels to add to kit or resin guns though.  

An accuracy note, the M134 minigun is not authorized for use on the MH-60S.  They only use M240D window (door) guns and GAU-21 (.50 cal) cargo door guns on a specialized mount.  The mount was available in the CC set, but nowhere else. 

CC GAU-21 mounts in black.

HeavyArty

 

 

Reaper420

On a side note, mentioning the metal mini guns, I couldn't find metal ones, disnt know they made them, but I DID pick up some really nice resin Cargo Door M134D Mount ones from Live Resin.

 

 

Pretty much all solid metal accessories have been eclipsed by resin.  The Live-Resin stuff is really nice.  I highly recommend them, especially thier helo gun sets.  You can find metal barrels to add to kit or resin guns though.  

An accuracy note, the M134 minigun is not authorized for use on the MH-60S.  They only use M240D window (door) guns and .50 cal cargo door guns on them.

 

You caught me! I know they are not authorized, but I decided to do a not 100% accurate build, as most of you have realized about all my builds. I tend to go like 80% then add a twist and do something that I like how it looks. My Achilles heel I suppose. I can never do a model without adding my own flair to it, no matter how hard I try!  Dont tell anyone!

Pawel

Stik - since this is a Navy machine, I have posted this remark. I read that the sailors really dislike their "helos" being called "choppers".

Have a nice day!

Paweł

 

Thats what happens when you’re reading these posts at oh dark thirty... I see MH-60 and not MH-60S... MH puts me in that army aviation mindset... more coffee required...

Helo, chopper, whirlybird, bird, what’s the difference? They’re all the same rotor aircraft one and all. 

But isn't it interesting to you as a modeller, to get to know the mindset of the people who operate those machines daily?

stikpusher

 

 

Pawel

Stik - since this is a Navy machine, I have posted this remark. I read that the sailors really dislike their "helos" being called "choppers".

Have a nice day!

Paweł

 

 

 

 

Thats what happens when you’re reading these posts at oh dark thirty... I see MH-60 and not MH-60S... MH puts me in that army aviation mindset... more coffee required...

 

stikpusher

more coffee required.

Depends, if it's Coffee, Instant, Type I, then you really want is Cocoa Beverage Base, a packet of creamer, and a packet of sugar to get that Army Moccachino going

If it's the black package Maxwell House, just go ahead and scrape off the bottom of your boots into boiling water . . .

My daily is Brack Rifle Coffee Co Beyond Black Dark Roast (their medium and light roast are good too, I just happen to like my coffee as black as my beer).

Oh, and for 2¢, BRCC is veteran-owned and veteran-employing, along with veteran supporting.

Pawel

But isn't it interesting to you as a modeller, to get to know the mindset of the people who operate those machines daily?

 

Well the folks on the sea side of the house have funny words for everything...

ladder instead of stairs, hatch rather than door, deck as opposed to floor... even in a building on dry land... jeez can’t they speak plain English?

Just messing with y'all, my Navy Department comrades in arms...  

Cap’n, I drink whatever coffee mama buys for the house. It’s some Seattle Roast stuff currently. My days of C-rats & MRE coffees and Mochas in a canteen cup heated by various means are well past now. 

Overhead and neckerchief are good too.

Dad was an aero engineer. Stuff like performance of the last generation of prop airliners, Concorde evaluation etc, Knew his ***.

He always said that helicopters only pretend to fly.

Pawel

Hello!

Weel you better not go all out on your first helo (not chopper!) build. Wouldn't it be better to gather some experience before?

No. How is he suppose to gain experience building his first chopper kit? I say go for it. It's all about learning and knowing what works, what doesn't work.

It's no different than learning how to rig your first WW1 bi-plane. Having never done rigging before, I plan on tackling my first rigging of a biplane kit using AM eyelets and turnbuckles as well as EZ line. 

The point is, one can't gain experience unless you try. 

Excuse me, but I have the impression you thought a long time about this one...

OK, one can't get experience in building helo models without building helo models and one can't get experience in going all out without going all out, but one can get experience in building helo models without going all out. That was my point here.

Have a nice day

Paweł

Enough bickering. Good lord is there not a forum where I can get away from it? 

I tried to make a joke here, so please, no offence!

midnightprowler

Enough bickering. Good lord is there not a forum where I can get away from it? 

Really??  Who is bickering?  It is simply a discussion.  Everyone doesn't have to always agree.  Noone got nasty or insulted anyone.  Discussing differing view points is a good way to hear about different techniques and ways of doing things.  

Just to try to add a little perspective, over in Ships the following occurs quite often.

Some new ship modeler posts that they've bought a HECEPOB (hideously expensive central european plank on bulkhead) large, wood, three masted sailing ship model and that they plan to go all out with upgraded thread, blocks, etc. etc. etc.

Those of us familiar with these things also know that the kit will never get built, that the builder will shelve it in frustration and that it will leave a bitter taste for a long time.

It then only seems right to suggest that a first time ship builder start with something more manageable, to learn the "ropes" and to get the satisfaction of actually finishing something.

I think that's the right thing to do. My 2 cents.

Rotor Aircraft ?

 Well that's close to their actual designation . The original description was " Rotary Wing Aircraft ( I ) Bell model  "47" . That's where it all started for me  . The Hiller program birds notwithstanding .

 Leastwise that's my information as I write this . 

" G " 

 I like your Dad's thinking . Just think what would happen if those rotary " Wings " broke off in flight ? They do too ! Just saying . T.B.

Hey Stik ! 

 Remember us Marine types too . We use all them Navy words too ! I am just glad there's no word I know , for someone that transfers from the Navy to the Corps .

 I did it for rank ability progression . the Navy got rid of my M.O.S. Totally . Being a  "  Yardbird " didn't seem to be a good way to promotion in a reasonable time span .

 It was scarier in the Corps But it worked ! 

Tanker - Builder

Hey Stik ! 

 Remember us Marine types too . We use all them Navy words too !  

I didn’t forget you Marines... kinda hard not to at times. I did say “Navy Department types” ... As much as they hate to admit it, they are part of the US Navy. Department of US Navy, United States Marine Corps. Same funny talk, but in a different uniform