Pave Low Question

Wow! So you guys are actually finding a use for my pics. I feel special...not special like having a fastrope between the legs...but special non-the-less.

Hey guys...UCI is over and it looks like we got an outstanding. Should be seeing more posts from me now that it's over.

Grant, I owe you an e-mail buddy. We're working up for the aforementioned vaction I mentioned earlier. I'll shoot you an e-mail later this week. Oh, and we're finally up to full mods on the Pavehawks. Should be able to send you some detail stuff on the external guns/bins.

Later guys!

Salbando

QUOTE: Originally posted by HeavyArty Stringers, come on Grant. Internal supports and framing. Like you see on the areas around the gunners' windows, horizontal stringers for support. Horizontal ribs on pillar between the gunner's window and cargo door in this pic you posted.

Ohhhh.. okay! I hadn't heard that slang used before today. Thank you Gino.

QUOTE: Originally posted by HeavyArty By the way, you posted the same link to Sal's pics that I did. There we go thinking the same again.

LOL! Yeah... I actually starting typing my reply before you did, but since I took my time looking thru Sals pix then got caught up looking thru the Pave Hawk pix on af.mil before I hit submit - I ended up posting the same pix 30 minutes later!

Thanks Guys!!!
You all are eing awesome about my stupid questions!!!
Gene

QUOTE: Originally posted by Trigger74 Stringers? Not sure I'm on the same page with you on this one. What do you mean?

Stringers, come on Grant. Internal supports and framing. Like you see on the areas around the gunners' windows, horizontal stringers for support.

Horizontal ribs on pillar between the gunner's window and cargo door in this pic you posted.


By the way, you posted the same link to Sal's pics that I did. There we go thinking the same again.

Stringers? Not sure I'm on the same page with you on this one. What do you mean?

Yes. The front cabin is black to facilitate NVG whereas the main cabin is gray. FS36251 Dark Gull Gray is the correct number here.





Complete set is visible at http://s96920072.onlinehome.us/AWA1/601-700/walk609_HH-60_Provenzano/walk609.htm

Should be medium grey in the rear, flat black on everything forward of the raised up cockpit area. Here are some walkarounds that show all the details.

From our own Sal Provenzano (Salbando) of his Alaskan ANG SAR bird. http://s96920072.onlinehome.us/AWA1/601-700/walk609_HH-60_Provenzano/walk609.htm

Another.
http://s96920072.onlinehome.us/AWA1/501-600/walk599_HH-60_Shirley/walk599.htm

External walk-around.
http://s96920072.onlinehome.us/AWA1/401-500/walk461_UH60_Spenard/walk461.htm

Okay guys more questions.
1) would there be stringers visible on the cabin walls?
2) Are the color callouts correct for this black for the cockpit and lt. ghost grey for the rear?
30Should the cargo area be painted OD
Thanks again guys!!!

Thanks for the help!!!
Gene

Mac's right; you'll get the best results if you research a particular airframe. Initially, back when MH-60G and HH-60G were both used as designations, HH-60Gs didn't have FLIR and were not quite as capable as the MH-. HH-60Gs were SAR aircraft and MH-60G were SOF support. These days, there are still some differences among airframes (even within a unit) as to which level of the latest Mod they're at (152 is the last I heard and even those Mods are being incorporated a few at a time), but those are minor and all are FLIR capable (the turrent may not always be installed - I've seen only a few examples where the turrent wasn't installed, but the cutout was there) and they all perform the same role. SAR is primary but they can still support SOF. Off the top of my head, at least three units perform peacetime civilian SAR also - AKANG, NYANG & 939th Rescue Wing AFRES, Portland OR. During the recent Katrina evacuations, Pave Hawks were just one of the types used to pull people off of rooftops and they also supported tsunami relief and provide SAR services for the Space Shuttle.

Now, when I say minor differences, I'm talking about things such as:
- position of the nav lights
- location of plume detectors
- number and position of chaff/flare despensers
- configuration of the consoles in the aft cabin
- location of the ammo drums
- antenna

It has been a while but the Academy UH-60A that I built was a disappointment. It was very basic and in some cases, inaccurate. I can't speak of the other kits in the line as the A kit left a bad taste in my mouth for this series. If you are planning a PAVE Hawk job anyway, most of the problem areas will be getting alot of rework anyway.

Based on info from a buddy that spent a few years in the 53rd SOS, I would suggest that you research the airframe that you are modeling. Only a handfull of the 60's actually went through the full PAVE upgrade. There are a few folks here that can confirm or deny the accuracy of that info (it is over 5 years old).

Mac

QUOTE: On a side note: I haven't worked with them myself, but I have heard some good things about the Italeri 1/48 MH-60G kit. Gino - what have you heard about these kits?

Everything I have heard about them has been pretty positive. The gunners seats and cargo area could use some work though. Looks like a good starting point though. I have heard the Academy 1/48 H-60 series are the best out there.

Looking for Pave Hawk info? You've come to the right forum! Out of the box, the Academy kit is a baseline MH-60G from the late 80s - it's more like a UH-60L kit with some extra parts (well, that's kinda what the HH-60G is anyway!)

To build an accurate model HH-60G (MH-60G and HH-60G are the same thing - a few years back they redesignated all Pave Hawks to HH-60G), you'll need a few parts from Cobra Company's 48031 set (MH-60L conversion for the Academy UH-60L) http://www.cobracompany.com/48031.htm
- FLIR
- Cockpit
- Doors & their frameless windows
- Ammo belts for the miniguns (forget the main door .50 cals - those aren't used operationally)
- Plume Detectors and RWR
And Chris is really good about selling just individual parts from a set.

Here are some pix of late model HH-60Gs





Our own Salbando sent in pix to ARC of a couple of his unit's birds. They were photographed a couple years back, but are still plenty good
http://s96920072.onlinehome.us/AWA1/601-700/walk609_HH-60_Provenzano/walk609.htm

We've started a USAF SAR reference site, but between my recent move and his unit's "silly season" and upcoming obligations, it's been a slow process.

Is there a particular Pave Hawk you're wanting to build, or just one in general?

On a side note: I haven't worked with them myself, but I have heard some good things about the Italeri 1/48 MH-60G kit. Gino - what have you heard about these kits?

Thanks Heavy Arty!!! I guess I'll go tomorrow and purchase the kit!!
Gene

Check here for some good builds of it. http://s96920072.onlinehome.us/Gal-Fea%20Archives/helicopters/MH-60/MH-60.htm

I can't give you any pointers on the 1/48th version. I only build 1/32 and 1/35 helos. I am planning on doing the Academy 1/35 version to go along with my UH-60L and MH-60L DAP. You can see them in my Showcase III below.

Good luck on it.

Yep, That was it!! Having never built a helo before. Any good tips?? It'll be scratchbuilt add ons if something needs to be improved on. Any thoughts?? I'm on a budget!
Gene

Do you mean the 1/48 Minicraft/Academy MH-60G Pave Hawk? If so, I have heard it is descent. Academy/Minicraft's 1/48 H-60 models are the best in 1/48 scale.
MH-60G Pave Hawk


This is the MH-53J Pave Low III


Academy doesn't , nor anyone else, make a 1/48 MH-53J Pave Low model. To get a 1/48 Pave Low, you have to get the Revell 1/48 CH-53 model and the Cobra Company MH-53J Pave Low III Conversion set. Cutting Edge Modelworks also does an MH-53J cockpit and weapons set for the conversion as well.