Rotor head plumbing ???

Howdy wayne,

I am building the exact same kit and have essentially posed the very same query in my own thread...just looking to add some detail :-)

If I come across any helpful info on the subject I will be sure to double back and share it with you as well.

Tread.

Semper Fi.

Its funny I saw a post on this same Rotor head done with plumbing and it looked great now I cant remember where It is

Sucks

If I find anything I will post it up here

Wayne

Hi Guys,

Just a suggestion, ive found some engine walk around for UH60 in prime portal. Maybe there's one also for CH-53? 

 Good luck.

 Vertex

Hey Guys,

Check out this old thread.  It's one of my old projects, and I'm quite proud of how it turned out.  I know it's not perfect, but it may be able to help you guys out. 

 /forums/717107/ShowPost.aspx

I used 0.015" Solder from Radio Shack for the multitude of size 4 hydraulic lines.  It's easy to bend and can be mastered in an hour or less.

Cobrahistorian, that's a great picture, but the rotor heads for the D's and E's are very different.  They are probably as different as the targeting systems between the Apache A's and D's.   

Semper Fi,

Chris

Chris,

Funny you mention that.... (whispering) the A and D Apache have used the same targeting system until just this past year! ;)

You're right, but that shot was all I had!  I do need to get some more refs for when i start my E model 53.  Still waiting on Dave Roof's new decals before I jump into my Sh!tter.

Jon

Hey Wayne,

A  /48 scale '53 would look pretty right with the hyd lines about the rotor head done in .008 wire. I haven't seen solder that thin so I used my local 'train' hobby shop for the thin wire. The tail rotor on CH/RH/HH/MH-53's[a,b,c,d,g,h,j,m] do have an oil transfer line from the rotary rudder oil reservoir to each individual sleeve-use .006 or slightly smaller wire**not sure about the E model but it is 'wet',too, so believe it incorporates like hardware . The origional type rotarywing(main rotor) called the 'wet-head', was used on Navy,Marine and Air force 53's. The CH-53E uses the same type(wet-head) rotary-wing[SORRY CHRIS] , though slightly beefed-up and times seven of everything. We started updating our D models in the early 80's with the ERH-Elastomeric Rotor Head, better known as the 'dry-head'. The dry-head has been incorporated onto the CH/RH 53'Ds and I have seen it in pics of Air Force birds. The fiberglass top on the rotarywing(main rotor) is called the beanie-ring. There is one hyd line running from the beanie-ring to each blade's 'damper asembly'. The remaining hyd lines coming off the beanie-ring to each sleeve and spindle assembly are used in the blade fold system. 

I would advise using super/zap glue to apply wire,whether thin copper or solder wire. Reference pics are available from the great site 'helicopter walkarounds'.

Brian

Anyone needing CH-53E reference pics can look at these. 

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v491/ridleusmc/CH-53E%20Reference/

Some of them are just stand off/look cool pics, but some are close up good reference shots.  53's Rock.

Cobrahistorian, that Apache thing is funny.  I would have figured that the A and D systems were entirely different and have been for a long time.  I guess I picked the wrong thing for an anology.

Brian, I'm going to have to disagree with you on the "Slightly Beefed Up" rotor head.  I'd say it's greatly beefed up.  (Another attempt at an analogy)  I'd say its like a Metro sitting next to a Lincoln town car.  BTW "wet head" is such a descriptive term.  Red hydraulic drops around the main rotor head is the norm.  How's the A&P coming?   

Semper Fi,

Chris

Hey CB,   After reviewing pics of an MH-53E(tail is the same as CH-53E)  the tail rotor does have oil lubrication. There are four tail rotor blades, each attached to a sleeve which allows pitch change and each sleeve attached to a hinge pin that allows 'flap' movemment. Thru internal passages oil travels from the tail rotor oil reservoir to the hinge pin and then to the tail rotor sleeve--one very thin aluminum line transferes oil from the hinge pin to the sleeve.

The origional CH-53 rotor head was called 'wet head', that was due to each main rotor sleeve and spindle assembly being lubricated by oil. The main rotor has six(upper and lower)hub arms, between the upper and lower arms is the vertical hinge pin, at the end of each upper hub arm is an oil reservoir, oil drains from the oil reservoir through the vertical hinge pin. Through each vertical hinge pin is an horizontal hinge pin, oil travels from the vert-to-the-horiz pin using  centrifugal action/pressure and then thru a narrow aluminum tube to each sleeve/spindle assembly. The CH and MH-53Es use the origional design x7 and are oil lubricated. As I said before all the lines from the beanie-ring to each sleeve/spindle are for blade-fold except for one which is to each blade's damper. Updated CH/RH/MH 53's(six bladed) with the ERH(Elastomeric Rotor head) do not have/do not need oil lubrication, vice being called 'dry-heads'.                    b.t.w.  someone wrote in another thread that the blades lag at rest...that's wrong, if the blades lag then there is a problem with the damper accumulator holding it's (850+psi)nitrogen charge and/or hydraulic fluid servicing.             

Chris..yes, you are right, the CH-53E rotor head is much bigger than I expressed-like a base ball player on steroids... hehe ...[I'm into Aircraft Drawings with a quiz this Monday, can't wait to get into Power Plants-actually sucks being a student again..not being the instructor].

Brian

Brian, it's great to hear you're on your way to being an A&P mechanic.  I hope you're as lucky as I am, and end up with a great job to show for your efforts.  Good luck on the job hunt, I doubt you'll have any trouble with the tests.  They really aren't bad. 

I have one thing to split hairs about, and I even broke out my old "C" school training book to check it out.  The 53E's blades do sit in the full lag position sitting in static.  The 53D's blade are at full lead in static.  It's just a funny little difference.  There's also a funny little servicing chart for E's so much PSI for such and such a temperature.  It's a nice little curve that ranges between 900 and 1100 PSI.  To be honest, we'd just service them to between 1000 and 1100 and service them when they went below 900.  

From what I've been told by a grumpy old Gunny.  The D's are real sweathearts compared to E's.  The D's didn't break as much and didn't need as much servicing.  Sikorsky is designing the K so it's not as maintenance intensive as the E. 

Semper Fi,

Chris  

hey CB,    I don't have anything new to advise about the plumbing besides prev posts, hope ya' excuse me for adding something else here....

yo Chris,thanks for the update about 'static blade positioning'-lag position, i.e. CH-53E. I can't comprehend/imagine what Igor's staff was thinking to reverse the blade damper positioning(at rest) between the D and E models. We shook our heads when the E  model came out with the 'wet head' and we were starting to upgrade our D's with the dry head. ....someone said more money for Igor to output the E models wetheads now then later contract the research and development/testing for the E 'dryhead' (notice no 7-bladed dryhead-to date). The D model dryhead was easier to maintain and MORE RESPONSIVE to input than the wethead.

*Chris, thanks for you pics w/pbucket--what hyd. reservoir is that in the MGB oil-cooler blower compartment? Oh yeah-check the other thread, NitroJunkie nn help w/ext -53E colors.

Brian          

This stuff makes me wish I had taken pics of the H-3's I served with!

We wish you had taken pictures too.  Gotta build a Sea King/Jolly Green sometime. 

Semper Fi,

Chris

dahut wrote:

This stuff makes me wish I had taken pics of the H-3's I served with!

I think we all agree with you ;-)

 Tread.

Semper Fi.

CHRH53D wrote:

*Chris, thanks for you pics w/pbucket--what hyd. reservoir is that in the MGB oil-cooler blower compartment? Oh yeah-check the other thread, NitroJunkie nn help w/ext -53E colors.

That's the first stage hydraulic reservour.  The first stage pump was located on the Main Gear box, so it only operated when the head was turning.  It would run the lower half of the main rotor servos, and the inboard side of the tail rotor servo. 

Semper Fi,

Chris

Hey, Great pics, thanks for sharing, and welcome to the forums.  That pilot looks familiar.  With a screen name like Hydro53e, I'm guess that you're an Airframer.  Welcome to the forums from an old HMH-464 airframer.  Aren't C-5 Breakdowns fun?

Semper Fi,

Chris