ardennes diorama

Wow, sounds like an ambitious project.  Out of curiousity, what scale are you doing this in?  I think that, and this is just one guy's opinion, if you are doing it in 1/35th, then you might be trying to cram 10 pounds of poo in a five pound bag.  Three armored vehicles and infantry deploying to attack - that will take up a lot of ground.

Um, to your specific questions:

Infantry kits.  Well, again, scale is a key question.  Also, what do you want to depict - German infantry only?  German and US infantry mixing it up?  There are tons of figure kits from DML that have German infantry in all sorts of different activities (assuming 1/35).  You should be able to find a good mix there.

As to the tactics involved... wow, another tough question.  Terrain, mission, enemy threat level all play a role.  Are the Germans trying to take the town or just blow through it?  Are they facing stiff resistance or just a couple REMFs?  If there is no significant anti-armor threat, it is likely (obviously depending on terrain) that the Germans would just role on down the road and over-run the American positions.  If the need to deploy were to present itself, ideally, they'd do it under cover (say in a tree-line outside of the town) to allow the infantry to get set before rolling into the assault. 

Alternatively, you could depict them being surprised by the stiffness of the resistance and having to deploy 'on the move' as it were.  If you wanted to do that, maybe you have one of your tanks knocked out (as if just taking a hit) and the other tank and the track flanking out to deploy into the attack.

Lots of possibilities here, but you'll need to make a few specific decisions about what you want to portray.

sorry i gorgot to say its in 1/35, I wanted it to be as if there was an anti armor threat. But I have the fallschirmjager kits but they are kind of in a laid back mood. I kind of want it to be that their attacking then theirs infantry grouping in the forest as a second push, like the fallshirmjager would be hangn around waitn for orders to make their push while the halftrack is on the way with the panther then the panzer IV J is lwaitn in reserve. Does this make sence?

Tankluver wrote:

Alright im starting a diorama, but am having a few problems with finding kits and placing vehicles. I have planned for a panther and a panzer IV J, then maybe a halftrack. What I want to depict is the German tanks going off the road as in their coming off the road to attack a town by going cross country. But how should I depict this, should they go off the road into a flat area, or come out of trees like in the movie battle of the bulge. What are some good ifantry kits also for this.

Action is the toughest thing to portray in static models... A deliberate attack across a danger area (any wide-open area that gives the enemy an unrestricted field of fire) is even tougher to portray.  Given the vehicle-types you want to use, the first problem you'd run into is the size of the diorama... And they just get bigger, especially since you won't be able to model (on the same base) the threat that they're reacting to.....  If you want to suggest action, plus an anti-armor threat, with multiple AFVs,  I'd suggest having your subjects reacting to an anti-armor ambush, with one vehicle already (or just about to be) a casualty...  You'd be able to get your models MUCH closer together and the reaction would be easier to model with vehicles & figures posed off-balance and too close together...

How about if I was making them look like they are mving into position to begin an attack.

How would you show them reacting to an anti armor threat?

I prolly do something like this

basically, vehicles pulling off the road, as you suggested, then taking evasive action when spotting the AT position, with guns tracking towards target . Use tracks in the snow to show their previous route. Hope you get the idea

Andrew

Tankluver wrote:

How about if I was making them look like they are mving into position to begin an attack. How would you show them reacting to an anti armor threat?

First things first... Have you done a mock-up?  You're going to need (for 1/35th) a base that's in the ballpark of two x three feet or so, according to the one I just mocked up, and that's putting the vehicles unrealistically close together...  That doesn't leave room for any enemy forces, either... So if you want to add the US part, figure on 3' X 5' minimum, with a fair amount of "artistic compression".. 

So... Can you swing that size of a diorama?

Tankluver,

Consider what Hans is saying as you take a look at Konigswolf's drawing - space is gonna be an issue if you intend to show both German and US forces.  Even just depicting the Germans, you're going to be cramming stuff together.  Still, you might be able to get around that a bit without having to do a tremendous sized dio base.

As Konigswolf said, one advantage you might have is, if this is a winter scene, using the tracks in the snow to depict prior movements.  So here is my 'vision': three vehicles: two tanks, one track, moving down a narrow forest road.  Your scene will depict the start of the action: tank 1 has just been hit in the side by AT fire (if you clearly show the hit, it'll help the viewer 'see' the threat).  It has slid partly off the road onto the same side the fire came from (not entirely realistic, but we'll call it artistic license), and the crew is bailing out.  Meanwhile, tank 2 is swerving around behind tank 1 (again, this is unrealistic, because they should not have been that close to begin with, but work with me here), and its turret is swiveling around to bear on the target as the TC up in the open hatch is yelling and gesturing...  Finally, the track is still up the road (just a couple inches) from the knocked out tank.  It too has swerved towards the direction of the AT threat - the grunt on the MG maybe has already acquired the target or is in the process of opening up as the other guys are bailing out of the back.  Again, have a pre-requisite NCO gesturing or pointing in the direction the AT threat is coming from.

You'll still run into the problem of cramming way too much in too small a space, but you'd want to do that anyways or you'll end up with a bunch of dead space that needs to be filled with something.  It's gonna be tough, no matter how you do it, because (again, to quote Hans) depicting action, particularly extreme action - aka combat - is tricky.  But, heck, it's worth a shot, right?

Like Hans said, draw up a mock-up and post it so everyone can see what you have in mind...

Tankluver wrote:

Went and did a mock up and i was able to get it to be 14 1/2 inches by 14 1/2 inches

Personally, I don't think there any good sets... Usually, a set contains one or maybetwo figures that suit your needs and the others are useless in their poses...  The Tamiya German Panzer Grenadiers and German Machinegun Troops sets contain good poses, though you'll still have do some minor "surgery" on them...  The drawback is that they aren't wearing winter uniforms... Of course, neither are the dismounts from the 251 kit...  They're also modeled in M1938-40 uniforms more often than not... Ok for 1941-43 Russian Front and Western Europe prior to Overlord, but not very common after September of '44...

I'd suggest for you to just start buying figure sets every time you go shopping and build up your stash of figures... This will give you a good selection of arms, legs, and heads for a smaller amount of money.  You'll need to learn to convert figures at some point anyway, everyone does, in order to make your figures fit the story rather than the story fitting the available figures... (Although, Manny constantly pulls it off with his (mostly) stock figures, but not eveyone has his knack for that.) 

It'd be a lot easier to answer your questions on uniforms if you would tell us which unit you're trying to model... The Order of Battle for the 6 Panzerarmee as of 31 Dec 44 was:

  12. Volks-Grenadier-Division
LXVII. Armeekorps
  18. Volks-Grenadier-Division
  62. Volks-Grenadier-Division
I. SS-Panzerkorps
  9. SS-Panzer-Division "Hohenstaufen"
  560. Volks-Grenadier-Division
  2. SS-Panzer-Division "Das Reich"

As for using parts, the legs from the 251 kit figures are ok, but the boots aren't... You'll need to change them to the low-cut/gaiters (known as "Retreat Boots")...

Converting the 251 figures into winter uniforms is doable, but I wouldn't do it if I didn't HAVE to..  It's a LOT of putty work... You're better off researching a manufacturer's catalog, or going through the figure sets of some on-line hobby shops...

I'm not the guy to ask about figure sets though... I don't use stock figures very often but rather, I chop up pretty much all of them and "Frankenstein" my own...

Well, the troops would more likely be Panzer Grenadiers, which means that the Waffenfarbe would be green rather than white... Otherwise, the uniforms are the same as for SS Infantry... So any of the SS units named above will work..

Are the figures you have on hand just the 251 dismounts?  Have you taken my advice about looking through On-line hobby shop figure sets and getting an idea which ones you might want?