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Normandy diorama

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  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Normandy diorama
Posted by 101stAirborne on Tuesday, April 6, 2010 9:20 AM

Here is a diorama I made for the 2009 IPMS National Convention. It won Second place in the Junior catergory.

This 1:35 scale diorama entitled "one way out" features a German Tiger tank and some Germans cautiously aproaching a small village in Normanndy. The American infantry have to hold off the village form the Germans. Everything is scratch-built except for the Tank and figures. I scratch built the buildings from sheetrock drywall.

 

 

 

Here is the diorama that won First place.

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, April 6, 2010 9:30 AM

What level were these entered in?

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by 101stAirborne on Tuesday, April 6, 2010 10:29 AM

The Junior level. probably should have said that.

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by 101stAirborne on Friday, June 25, 2010 12:07 PM

Here are some bigger pics of the diorama

this is an over all view of the diorama

 The sink and cabinet were made from sheet styrene.

 

 This was my first attempt to put zimmerit on a tank.

 

 

 

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Massachusetts
Posted by ajlafleche on Friday, June 25, 2010 12:50 PM

Junior! Break that boys fingers! Big Smile JK

Excellent work and well deserving of your award.

 

Remember, if the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Friday, June 25, 2010 3:28 PM

I like it.  As Al said, this was entered in Juniors?  Jeepers... what the future holds...

One comment: what you are attempting here illustrates the challenge of 1/35th scale.  In your dio, all that action is happening withing about 30 - 40 yards.  In 'real life' the two forces would be several hundred yards apart.  At this point (in your dio) the Americans look like they are pretty much toast - they've let both the Tiger and the infantry get right on top of them and (from what I saw) they don't have a bit of anti-armor with them.  Trying to compress a scene and depict both sides in an action is really difficult to do.  The casual manner of the Germans would be more likely if they were well outside the village.  They'd be pretty cautious (and aggressive) approaching building that they did not know were clear. 

You've run up against the limitation of the 'medium' - obviously building a 8' long dio with a ton of empty space wouldn't be all that fun, so you made a nice compromise.  Well done.  You've definately got some skills.

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by 101stAirborne on Friday, June 25, 2010 5:43 PM

Thank you all very much. I would have liked to make the diorama bigger like you said bbrowniii but there would be a lot of empty space, but it would be more accurate.

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    March 2007
  • From: Michigan
Posted by tonka on Friday, June 25, 2010 6:59 PM

Great work!! cannot believe this is a junior build! Well on way to many contest prizes!

]

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Saturday, June 26, 2010 4:22 AM

101stAirborne

Thank you all very much. I would have liked to make the diorama bigger like you said bbrowniii but there would be a lot of empty space, but it would be more accurate.

No, I think too that you made a good compromise between space and story... Even though it's not visible, the anti-armor might be implied with the semi-prone rifleman and the other GI looking back... The Tiger's obviously just BARELY moving (the way I'm seein'  it, anyway), seeing as how it appears that the Soldat on the hull is guiding the driver through a tight fit, via the TC and his intercom, (GREAT job on tying the Infantry and the Panzer crew together, BTW) and the GI's are a simply a forward element of an anti-armor ambush.. At least that was my initial, first impression, here:

The scene is intense, there's drama readily apparent, and you just KNOW that there's some German Infantry who's life-span is being measured in seconds right now... Once the GIs kick off (by opening up on the Infantry the second that the "off-camera" bazooka rounds goes, they'll be dropping like flies...  The Tiger's in no position to fight off any GI's that close once the Infantry is dealt with... They're inside the tank's blind-area (the limits of the periscopes which is about a 10-15 foot between where a guy inside can see you and the hull) and the MGs can't depress far enough to engage them...   Gonna be taking it out the hard way, but I think the Tiger's toast in about 3 minutes, LOL...

This piece is outstanding...  Especially given it's in the Junior Category...  I've truely never seen a better armor diorama in the Juniors, and I've seen some "winners" in Advanced that don't  match that level of excellence... And I'm a "tough" judge... (read: Azzh*le to those "adults" that didn't place)

There's a couple small details that would improve it a bit more, IMHO, should you decide to enter it again in another competion.  One being the Tiger's tracks... They would benefit with more of the ground color on the tracks, tying them to the groundwork, and a bit more "dust" arond the ruins, especially the interiors...  LOTS of dust around & in bombed-out buildings, y'know...

I gotta say it again... This is truely an OUTSTANDING piece...

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by 101stAirborne on Saturday, June 26, 2010 9:35 AM

Thank you very much Hans I think you got the idea of the diorama down.

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Saturday, June 26, 2010 2:38 PM

Look, I've said it before and I'll say it again, this is a great dio, for any level.  A really fine piece of work.  I also hope, however, that  Ryan is looking for constructive criticism and not just 'attaboys', so with that in mind:

Sorry Hans, but I ain't buyin' it.  The story line you painted doesn't work for this dio.  Maybe it is because in his original post Ryan said:

"features a German Tiger tank and some Germans cautiously aproaching a small village in Normanndy"

and that statement gives me one vision in my head of what I should expect to see, and that is not what I see.  Let me explain:

-Intentionally or not, when you say Normandy, I think D-Day, or pretty shortly thereafter.  If the American troops were paratroopers, the scene would make more sense to me because the Germans might not have reason to suspect there are enemy troops in the area, but they are not.  So, being that this in on or about D-Day, and the Germans are moving towards a town or village that they don't know for certain is in their hands, their casual manner doesn't fit

-that brings me back to the above statement from Ryan's first post.  There is nothing 'cautious' about the way they Germans are moving.  They are not dispersed in the slightest, weapons are not at the ready, the tank is not buttoned up.  You've got an officer and a couple of troops on the right side of the tank just sory of standing there, watching what is going on.  They are completely unprepared for contact.  COMPLETELY.  They are begging to be ambushed. 

As far as the Americans, I got the impression that the soldier gesturing was doing so the the guys across the street in the other building.  If he is, in fact, gesturing 'off stage' then I could, maybe, see that as hinting at some anti-armor... maybe....  It could just be the camera angle, but you might consider angling him so that it is more apparent that he is gesturing to units off the edge of the scene.

That is where the scene doesn't work for me.  As compressed as it is, the Germans should be in a more aggessive posture.  If they are being cautious, there certainly wouldn't be a troop on the tank acting as a guide - they wouldn't really care if the squashed that wall, since the would be more concerned about potentially making contact.

Again, I'll admit it, maybe I am being too influenced by the description of the scene from the original post and should just focus on the scene itself.  Unfortunately, that description painted a mental picture, and the dio doesn't match it.

My final point - please recognize that I do intend this in a constructive way.  I am not trying to tear you down, just explain what I see.  Hopefully, my comments might be useful to you when you apply your considerable skills to a future project.

 

 

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by 101stAirborne on Saturday, June 26, 2010 2:54 PM

Ok guys I'll  explain what I wanted to appear to have going on, the German soldiers are approaching this village and think it is safe to move through it thats why some of the figures are so relaxed. the German soldier on the tank stopped the tank because he saw some movement in the village. He is talking with the officer and the tank commander about what he saw.

Meanwhile the Americans are getting ready to attack the tank. Think about it, the Americans have the advantage. They could mow down all of the infantry, move up to the tank because it has little space to manuver and throw grenades inside like in Saving Private Ryan. Hope that helps.

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Saturday, June 26, 2010 3:07 PM

Ryan

OK, that is a good explanation.

One thing to keep in mind, however.  The 'story' of a dio should be apparent to people looking at it.  In this case, what that soldier is doing on the tank is not obvious (as indicated by the fact that you have to explain to us what is happening).  And, from the point of view of the Americans... if they realize their 'cover has been blown' by that soldier the tank who is pointing out their positions to the Tank Commander, then they start shooting NOW, before any advantage they have is lost.

Also, despite what the movies show, it isn't likely the Americans will 'mow down' all that infantry, particularly because it does not appear that the Americans have any automatic weapons (I don't see a machine-gun or BAR.  There looks to be one tommy gun).  They might get most of them, but a few are still likely to survive and fight back.  Also, again, despite what you saw in SPR, if that Tank Commander buttons up his tank, there is very little likelihood that Americans will get the hatches on the tank open to toss in grenades.  Also, keep in mind that the Tiger in SPR had already been immobilized (remember the sticky bombs) so it could not manuever.  Unless they have something to use to knock a track off, that tank is going to be able to move quite well.

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Saturday, June 26, 2010 3:10 PM

By the way, I just went back through and looked at your photos again.  I really have to commend you on all the little details that you have included - the picture on the wall (most people pose pics on blown out walls at an angle - there is something cool about the way yours remains straight), the table with the book on it... your sink and tub.  All those details really bring this dio to life.

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by 101stAirborne on Saturday, June 26, 2010 4:40 PM

thanks again

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Saturday, June 26, 2010 5:08 PM

Well, for one thing, I didn't read the text, Brownie... Just the thread title.... I purposely avoid reading any and ALL narratives for dioramas for the very reasons you point out.  I don't wanna be influenced, or "contaminated",  by the builder's intent, or what he "explains" to us as viewers, just what I see...   Morever, since the GIs were 'legs, I knew it wasn't D-day, and I figured it was probably along the lines of D+ 15 or even D+30... The Normandy breakout itself (Operation Cobra)didn't occur until late July, about D+49, after a number of delays caused by bad weather.   "Normandy" is an  entire French region, not five beaches... However, since you bring it up...

Given that  Anglo-Canadian operations had bogged down several times (Monty was supposed to have captured Caen ON D-Day and Cherbourg by D+15, remember), small unit actions in the Bocage country among the hedgerows were the mainstay of  German/US contact during that time-frame and a certain amount of complacency is bound to have set in in some sectors. By the last week in June, offensive operations were pretty much halted altogther short of Saint Lo...  But all that is beyond the scope of what's going on here...

 I don't know which one we're looking at here, since the US unit isn't recognizable, and German units in the US Sectors were composite units in many places, I don't think that Ryan put all that much into exactly where and who we're dealing with here, and it's not all that surprising since it's a merely a generic "snapshot" of a moment just before a firefight breaks out, not from a training film on Small Unit Tactics...  None of the things that you or I, as Warriors, would call obvious are in play here, IMHO... 

I DID give some license to the fact that it was a Junior build as well...  I don't "bang heads" too hard on those, histoically speaking, unless it's called out as a specific Point of Order and an historical event is a key part of the storyline that the builder wants to convey to the viewer...  My focus was more on the technical aspects of the diorama's layout and postioning, balance, attention to detail, etc...  Were this an "adult" build, I likely would have been a bit more "unforgiving" in my observations and critique...  

In other words, "give the kid a break" seemed to be in order, since he likely doesn't have 10 or 20 years of diorama building to draw from and an unlimited (relatively-speaking) bank account, along with several years of military service to influence the "mindset" of the figures...  I've seen adult builders that use figures almost as an after-thought quite regularly, looking like they got "blinked" into existance on the spot by Barbara Eden...  The Soldat on the tank, although maybe a bit exaggerated, still functioned well in tying the Infantry to the Panzer crew and that's a detail that MANY, more experienced builders overlook time and time again...  However, there's still room for improvement, and we'll see how his next project goes...

 

 

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Saturday, June 26, 2010 6:26 PM

Hans,

We definately do NOT disagree on the technical aspects of this build.  My SOLE critique is related to the composition/story.  And, as I said in one of my recent replies, my comments are also intended to be constructive - I don't think he needs to change a damn thing with this dio.  It is fine the way it is.  I'm just offering a perspective for him to keep in mind for his next one - so that he can start building up that 10 to 20 years of experience.  I certainly am not trying to tear him down.  I don't really think 'the kid needs a break' only because his skills are on par or superior to many of the adults whose work I see (heck, I'd have a tough time putting together such a complex scene as he has done).

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    April 2004
  • From: Boston MA
Posted by vespa boy on Sunday, June 27, 2010 12:52 PM

Thanks for posting the build. I don't know a thing about military stuff so I won't say anything about that...I'll leave it to the experts.

What I do know, and you can use this detail for future dios, is that cast iron does not bend under stress, it snaps as it is very brittle...this applies to things like lamp posts, man-hole covers, drain covers and some street furniture. In your dio, instead of a bent lamp post, you would have found a snapped stub,...seems strange but its true. If you want bent metal there are many options, like I-beams.

Please keep building and sharing your models on the forum.

http://public.fotki.com/nkhandekar

This ain't no Mudd Club, or C.B.G.B.,
I ain't got time for that now

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Sunday, June 27, 2010 1:36 PM

No sweat, Brownie... I'm trackin' with ya...  Especially about future builds... Toast

  • Member since
    July 2008
  • From: Florida
Posted by Railfan 233 on Sunday, June 27, 2010 2:17 PM

This whole diorama is just exelent. I can say, it looks like the Germans are in for a deadly suprize. Are you sure your in the "Junior" category? It looks better than what I have seen in some dioramas displayed at my local hobby shop. Exelent work

  

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpgRed, White, and YOU! group build of 2010

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by 101stAirborne on Sunday, June 27, 2010 3:13 PM

Thanks for all of the tips guys, now I know I need to brush up on my history, better pay more attention in class! Wink

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Sunday, June 27, 2010 5:26 PM

101stAirborne

Thanks for all of the tips guys, now I know I need to brush up on my history, better pay more attention in class! Wink

Now that's the spirit.  One final bit of advice (that has helped me TREMENDOUSLY) is, as you are doing your next project, post in progress pictures here.  You'll get a ton of feedback from people who might help you tweak things to catch some of the more minor details that you could otherwise overlook. Yes

That being said, what are you working on now?  I'd love a peek!

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by 101stAirborne on Sunday, June 27, 2010 5:39 PM

right now I am working on A dio called sewer rats, have you looked at the post yet?

Models on the bench:

Too many to count!

  

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: 41 Degrees 52.4 minutes North; 72 Degrees 7.3 minutes West
Posted by bbrowniii on Sunday, June 27, 2010 7:58 PM

101stAirborne

right now I am working on A dio called sewer rats, have you looked at the post yet?

Ryan

I had looked at it, but for some reason I didn't realize it was yours.  Nice work!

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' - Edmund Burke (1770 ??)

 

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Sunday, June 27, 2010 11:12 PM

101stAirborne

Thanks for all of the tips guys, now I know I need to brush up on my history, better pay more attention in class! Wink

Heh... History is one of those things you either love or hate...  Personally, I didn't care for it in school, but once I got out into the world, and started seeing some of the places I'd only read about, and actually walked on some battlefields, it took on a new meaning...   As my Army career progressed, it took on even more significance, and I started getting involved with WW2 re-enacting, collecting WW2 gear & uniforms...  This was especially helpful since I really had to dig into stuff to verify the authenticity of stuff I was laying out big bucks for, lol... Lotta unscrupuled "vendors" out there trying to pass of repro for real, and all I had to do was get burned ONCE...

  • Member since
    April 2009
  • From: Carmel, IN
Posted by deafpanzer on Monday, June 28, 2010 12:18 AM

Ryan, that was funny because I saw your diomara when I was there last summer.  I took few pictures of it and it was definitely one of my favorites at the show.  Here's my proof... sorry about the photo quality.  i got rid of that camera right after the show.  Congrats!  Yes

Andy

  • Member since
    July 2008
  • From: Florida
Posted by Railfan 233 on Monday, June 28, 2010 2:40 PM

Hans von Hammer

 101stAirborne:

Thanks for all of the tips guys, now I know I need to brush up on my history, better pay more attention in class! Wink

 

Heh... History is one of those things you either love or hate...  Personally, I didn't care for it in school, but once I got out into the world, and started seeing some of the places I'd only read about, and actually walked on some battlefields, it took on a new meaning...   As my Army career progressed, it took on even more significance, and I started getting involved with WW2 re-enacting, collecting WW2 gear & uniforms...  This was especially helpful since I really had to dig into stuff to verify the authenticity of stuff I was laying out big bucks for, lol... Lotta unscrupuled "vendors" out there trying to pass of repro for real, and all I had to do was get burned ONCE...

It's kind of funny, with school history lessons. You never get the true meaning/  understanding/ feeling of a historical event unless you accually go to the place where it happened, or se a re-enactment of it.

 It may also be partly with the fact that the teachers are on a time-line for their lessons, and they can't go super in-depth with a subject.

Let me tell you, if you want to fully understand a historical happening or event, nothing beats going to the site where it happened, or seeing a re-enactment, except for going into a time-machine and seeing it as the event unfolds (most likely will never happen)

[Side note- Do you think it may be possible to get a field-trip to a re-enactment or to go to a battle site?]

  

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpgRed, White, and YOU! group build of 2010

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Iowa
Posted by Hans von Hammer on Monday, June 28, 2010 3:33 PM

[Side note- Do you think it may be possible to get a field-trip to a re-enactment or to go to a battle site?]

Check the WW2 HRS website (World War 2 Historical Re-enactment Society) and The 20th Century Tactical Studies Group... They usually have shedules of Living History events posted.   Then it's just a matter of finding the one nearest your school and getting the school to get y'all there..

There're unit events as well, but those are battles that 're closed to the public...

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2008
  • From: Florida
Posted by Railfan 233 on Monday, June 28, 2010 4:41 PM

Thanks. I'll try to look into it. I'm not too sure if the school will be willing to send us off to see battle re-enactments, though. But, it's worth a shot. (not pun intended)

  

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpgRed, White, and YOU! group build of 2010

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