8 New Vignettes

figure freak

I know i havent posted on these forums for like a year, but model maniac, i honestly like your models, regardless of historical accuracy. I especially like the one with the germans all pointing and looking in one direction

Thanks so much for your comments, figure freak! "Joh" has done his best building these figure sets into vignettes and I like them all.

zokissima

 

Model Maniac:

 

 

Jester75:

 

As I have stated in another post, if you will look back through his threads there have been multiple occasions where he as acknowledged advice that was posted and noted that he would pass it on to his builders. But you tell me, why would anyone want to respond to the garbage that you and others post in his threads?? I would ignore you and the "others" as well. I mean face it, your initial post was pure junk and contributed aboslutely nothing to anything did it not???

 

 

Thanks so much, Jester, for reassuring my acknowledgement and notion. My modelers did get some advice. You're right, why would I respond to those garbages. Comments from someone like Gino, aj and Bronto I don't bother even reading, let alone replying!

 

 

 

Well, really, you gotta understand both perspectives here. You've been posting on this site for a long time. I myself have usually just give you the positive comments to keep posting, especially since you are one of the ONLY sources of Soviet modeling that gets put here, and I appreciate that. However, I am curious, do you find the advice given to you as something that does not actually interest you, or are you just satisfied with a build, however it turns out, and don't really care to have them improve, or is there another reason?

Personally, even though the dios may have been inaccurate or whatever, some of the figs I thought were decently painted.

Well, apart from being "one of the ONLY sources of Soviet modeling that gets put here", I usually post most newly-released kits in finished form earlier than anyone else, and today I'll post more in the Armor forum. As said earlier, some advice had been relayed to my builder. Yesterday I told AI not to use too much glue in the windshield. I'm satisfied with most builds. Historical accuracies are of not much importance to me. You see, those who know that it's not historical accurate (maybe from experience) are dead or near dead now. So I better leave that to historians. For me, these military models - Land, Air and Sea - are just toys for my collection. 

Thanks for your kind comments on the painting of figures.

I know i havent posted on these forums for like a year, but model maniac, i honestly like your models, regardless of historical accuracy. I especially like the one with the germans all pointing and looking in one direction

Now  I totally agree with his posting it as a historical accuracy without researching the build or the background. If are going to label it as something set in a certain time in a certain place then by all means it should be painted and loaded out to match that.

The problem I see is the way he presents his diorama. He presents it like it has historical accuracy.  A few years back in another forum (IPMS BA), I told him in order to seized or reduced criticism on historical accuracy is not to use historic title. Place Science fiction, What if or reenactment on your title so no one will comment on Russian troops armed with AK-47 in the eastern Front, LVT in Normandy, Initial Tiger I with SS armed with MP44, Nashorn in the battle of Stalingrad, US troops in Berlin,  etc.

Another problem is he don't reply to all honest criticism but he always respond to all praises.

Model Maniac

 

Jester75:

 

As I have stated in another post, if you will look back through his threads there have been multiple occasions where he as acknowledged advice that was posted and noted that he would pass it on to his builders. But you tell me, why would anyone want to respond to the garbage that you and others post in his threads?? I would ignore you and the "others" as well. I mean face it, your initial post was pure junk and contributed aboslutely nothing to anything did it not???

 

 

Thanks so much, Jester, for reassuring my acknowledgement and notion. My modelers did get some advice. You're right, why would I respond to those garbages. Comments from someone like Gino, aj and Bronto I don't bother even reading, let alone replying!

Well, really, you gotta understand both perspectives here. You've been posting on this site for a long time. I myself have usually just give you the positive comments to keep posting, especially since you are one of the ONLY sources of Soviet modeling that gets put here, and I appreciate that. However, I am curious, do you find the advice given to you as something that does not actually interest you, or are you just satisfied with a build, however it turns out, and don't really care to have them improve, or is there another reason?

Personally, even though the dios may have been inaccurate or whatever, some of the figs I thought were decently painted.

Jester75

As I have stated in another post, if you will look back through his threads there have been multiple occasions where he as acknowledged advice that was posted and noted that he would pass it on to his builders. But you tell me, why would anyone want to respond to the garbage that you and others post in his threads?? I would ignore you and the "others" as well. I mean face it, your initial post was pure junk and contributed aboslutely nothing to anything did it not???

Thanks so much, Jester, for reassuring my acknowledgement and notion. My modelers did get some advice. You're right, why would I respond to those garbages. Comments from someone like Gino, aj and Bronto I don't bother even reading, let alone replying!

Like I have said before, I keep critiquing his work so other, new members especially, will see that they are not up to par and so they can learn how not to make models.  To those who focus on the negative side of it, I have posted that some of them have been good (when they were) and highlighted improvements.  Take it or leave it, I will not ignore the mediocre models that he plays off as expertly built by his "professional" builders.

I also agree with what bbrownii posted in the "Ukraine, Summer 1943" thread that everyone is all bothered about as well:

"...the guy takes a pounding in here, but he keeps on posting "his" work.  But I also certainly don't have an issue with comments like Gino's.  They are born out of YEARS of frustration with MM and his general unwillingness to participate in the forum beyond posting his latest purchase and acknowledging the 'attaboys'."

Participating here as an actual model building member would help his case in my eyes.  Until that happens, I will continue to have no respect for him.  If anyone has an issue with that, sorry, don't read what I post about it.  Just as some of you are asking why don't we who critique just ignore and not comment on MM's post.

Bronto

So how is someone treating him bad by not liking a model and point out ways to improve his purchases?   I guess in this PC world of today anything besides blowing smoke at someone is treating them bad.

lol are you serious? Honestly, I get your point about improvement, and all that. What my question to you and Arty are, why do you guys keep it up? I mean, c'mon, Gino's been here for a hella long time, and he knows it ain't gonna change. If you guys are the experts, why degrade yourself to the point of insanity; of which the clinical definition is one whom repeats the same action, expecting a differing re-action.

There was a huge thread of MM's making before that actually exposed much of his relationship with his builders, and if anything, his honesty created even more animosity towards the guy, save for a couple of members that withdrew since they clearly saw nothing was going to change.

Further, the typical aggravating comments just encourage more negativity. I find the threads dealing with MM to be an exposition of hypocrisy of the FSM community. We all somehow get our feathers ruffled at the very mention of "rivet counters", yet please someone try to tell me that it is something else entirely that goes on in these threads....

Not ignoring the obvious facts that over time, yes, improvements maybe should be made, should be even expected, as we are all modelers striving over time to improve our skills. However, some of the comments here are just borderline absurd in their complexity of destruction of the work posted. As with the guy on the 2nd page, calling up his whatever to verify that sniper teams work in twos, pointing out the incorrectness of shoelaces, etc etc. Pages and pages of this stuff. And most of the errors, as Gino pointed out many times, are ALWAYS the same, but we as a community have constantly elaborated in our methodologies of tearing down that which was posted. You think a guy who can't shave off a seam or fill a gap is going to give a flying **** about the tonal variation of a uniform, or the fact that the camo pattern may be off by some combination? Heck, he found a pic somewhere, copied it, and as far as he's concerned, its correct enough.

defcon1 and hellcat man - Thanks for your informative input. I have actually learned a bit last couple days about figures (Im a total figure newbie) reading your comments.

I guess that is *my*  worth... the feedback on MM posting may not be heeded by his builders, but serve as a lesson to readers of the thread. 

Oops! the 8 vignettes are done by Joh?

Well they're slightly better than Ai's builds but lack the reference and composition to pull it off convincingly. Please convey the remarks from Hellcat to Joh for him to improve. Please leave out "Nonsensical" in the interpretation.

Hope to see better ones from your guys. If they're the same then I've wasted my time. Life goes on.

Cheers,

Richard

Guys Guys Cool it.

I told myself not to get involved, but...

First, MM, although I'm not a fan of your acquired builds, you have the right to post whatever you have.

With the constant barrage of the same poor(for the lack of a better word) standard of finish even after many good advise can be somewhat irritating to others in this forum. Expect criticisms ... ignore them if you like ... reply if you can defend. I'd rather you defend yourself than have others do it for you as it has stirred a hornets nest.

There are instances where there is minute improvements in the builds which have been commended. Your group of builders can post their creations themselves although I'm assuming they don't speak the language and are afraid of being ridiculed on both counts. I hope you are conveying the advise from the forumers to your builders diligently. I would suggest you offer reference material to your builders to further improve their skill. They're not bad... it just needs that something extra... "effort" is the word I'm looking for rather than "you give me box, I build what's in the box, I follow picture in the box". Were those the instructions you gave your builders? 

I don't know AI but I think he has lost his passion building for you. Ask him what he would do if he was building it for himself.

I'm starting to believe the vignettes(not dios) are reviews of the contents of each box. It can be improved. Show it to us in the next build. Better to concentrate on one than many diluted builds. If quality hurts AI's rice bowl then ignore what I've just said. I don't want to come between his basic source of income.

Now can we get back to the light banter that we're accustomed to?

Cheers,

Richard

Better watch out Hellcat man, you're going to get yourself labeled an ***hole with the rest of us that don't like MM's models.

Alright, i've been watching this thread for a while and I feel that it is appropriate time for me to weigh in with some inside knowledge on Russian special forces and American ground forces in World War 2. Firstly the Spetnaz diorama makes no sense. A relative of mine was Ukrainian Naval Spetnaz  and after a phone call to him, Spetnaz Sniper teams work alone. IN TWO'S, not fours like the diorama. The two other guys look oblivious  to the snipers. They look as if they are on a separate unrelated mission and have no place being there. Secondly the Marines on Guam are Army, and if anything that camouflage looks more like some kinda SS camo smock not like USMC camo. Also in the Anti Tank team in Berlin vignette if you were assigned as the assistant gunner to a bazooka grunt you would never have a grenade launcher mounted on your rifle, because if you did and you were attacked your both practically useless against fast infantry with those weapons. Now onto the Russian spec-ops guys. The positions on the figures are none sensical, if you have two guys in cover, shooting at multiple enemies i doubt a operator would be stupid enough to stand in the middle of the combat zone and look through his bino's. He would be a bullet magnet, and more then likely get shwacked. I'm not going to pick sides, but in my opinion as a historian and modeler I have to take Gino's side in this argument. The figures are poorly done, poorly researched and don't make a lick of sense. But thats just my

As Gino said in the other thread we will jsut have to agree to disagree. I could care less if you like his work or not but I dont think your opinion of his work warrants being an ***hole. Especially when he has shown absolutely no ill will towards anyone here.

So how is someone treating him bad by not liking a model and point out ways to improve his purchases?   I guess in this PC world of today anything besides blowing smoke at someone is treating them bad.

OMG, don't you guys get it?? It's not about MM, its about anyone that would be treated they way you guys treat him! So because someone knows what they are talking about gives them the right to be complete jerks to another??? And besides that, there has been no argument about what you and the others point out in every build as flaws. It has nothing to do with criticizing his builds, but everything to do with how you guys are treating a fellow forum member  whos only "crime" in your eyes is not listening to your advice.

Jester75

As I have stated in another post, if you will look back through his threads there have been multiple occasions where he as acknowledged advice that was posted and noted that he would pass it on to his builders. But you tell me, why would anyone want to respond to the garbage that you and others post in his threads?? I would ignore you and the "others" as well. I mean face it, your initial post was pure junk and contributed aboslutely nothing to anything did it not???

I reckon that my posts contributed as much as yours have.  Perhaps MM would want to respond for the same reasons that you seem to feel the need to defend him?  Or perhaps because we (those that post the so called "garbage") might just have an idea what we are talking about?  I post what I do about the "builds" so other can learn from them, and maybe in the hope the information would get forwarded to the builders so they can improve?

As I have stated in another post, if you will look back through his threads there have been multiple occasions where he as acknowledged advice that was posted and noted that he would pass it on to his builders. But you tell me, why would anyone want to respond to the garbage that you and others post in his threads?? I would ignore you and the "others" as well. I mean face it, your initial post was pure junk and contributed aboslutely nothing to anything did it not???

But none of you MM supporters have said anything about how even in this post he has IGNORED any of the criticisms given on the models, just said thank you to his "supporters" for defending him. In not one reply has he even acknowledged anything that was not said by his support group.

acmodeler01

 

HeavyArty:

 

Lighten up, Francis.  If you don't appreciate honest criticism, don't read them, MM doesn't seem to.  As I said though, they are not intended for him as they will fall on deaf ears.

 

 

I do appreciate honest criticism. For me, that is not the issue. In fact, the critique offered on MM showpieces is quite useful to anyone who looks through the thread.

My problem lies with predictable comments like, "same ol' MM: it's crap." That does nothing to help out the OP or anyone reading the thread. Further, if you're going to post something like that, which by your own admission is not even directed to the poster himself, then why even bother? I'll agree with Jester, and say that those comments do nothing but take a reader's focus away from the builds.

That's another great comment that you've made, Jon! 

Jester75

 

ajlafleche:

 

 

Then you might want to avert your eyes when you see Gino's avatar turn up. Gino's "bashing," as you call it, honest critique is really more like it, is nothing that isn't well deserved.

 

 

Nope, its not honest critique, he is quite plainly being a jerk and his posts in MM's threads IMO are borderline harrasement.

Thanks so much, Jester! You're absolutely right! Those bullying and boorish comments can never ever be interpreted as "honest critique" in any way. They are borderline harassment as you said, made in an astonishingly uneducated fashion!

acmodeler01

I enjoy looking at MM's purchases, models, or whatever you like to call them. Some are better than others, but they are all nice to see. The same can be said of just about everyone that posts their own builds on this site.. some are great, some not so.

I can do without Gino's predictable bashing of the builds. That gets old.

Wow! your second paragraph is the best and greatest comment I've ever read on this entire Website! And I just can't agree more. You've made my day, I just can't thank you enough! 

HeavyArty

Lighten up, Francis.  If you don't appreciate honest criticism, don't read them, MM doesn't seem to.  As I said though, they are not intended for him as they will fall on deaf ears.

I do appreciate honest criticism. For me, that is not the issue. In fact, the critique offered on MM showpieces is quite useful to anyone who looks through the thread.

My problem lies with predictable comments like, "same ol' MM: it's crap." That does nothing to help out the OP or anyone reading the thread. Further, if you're going to post something like that, which by your own admission is not even directed to the poster himself, then why even bother? I'll agree with Jester, and say that those comments do nothing but take a reader's focus away from the builds.

JMart

1. random placement - what makes it "random"? To me, seems some figs in the same vignette are acting "hurried" (under fire?) while some are strolling along. Also seems all figs are placed symetrically; that is, same distance from each other.. this placement seems..not-random and forced... you agree? why yes/no?

I agree. Many figure model kits have various poses and sometimes it doesn't look good together. AI build it OOB and and builds everything in the box even though it doesn't go together. The only research material he has is the instruction and box art.

JMart

 

3. "Stuff under the boots"; I see space and "stuff" between the sole of the boots and the ground. I assume that the same way you want your A/C and AFV wheels flush against the ground, you want boots solidly on the ground? Or if you pose a fig striding, have a heel make contact with the ground simulating walking?

4. i see the seams, specially on the weapons... I also assume that I should bore out the barrel of any weapons I place in figures.

Agreed.

These are many things that modelers from here and other various modeling sites have told MM to fix for many years. If you go to his site and look at the first models you will see that it has the same errors. He has the same modelers for years. Problem like seams, injection mold marks, bent gun barrels, no weight impressions (specially snow), silver decals, models in the wrong time frame, unit in the wrong place, vehicle in the wrong theater, not enough rubbles in destroyed buildings, wrong color of vehicle, wrong title, model put together wrong, and goes on.

http://www.falconbbs.com/modelmnu.htm

I have said it again, bears repeating... I do like READING the critiques of MM postings, since I learn a lot from the mistakes that are pointed out....

Here are some true questions I had when looking at the figs, with the pre-amble that I have yet to complete a fig but I know it is a technique I must learn:

1. random placement - what makes it "random"? To me, seems some figs in the same vignette are acting "hurried" (under fire?) while some are strolling along. Also seems all figs are placed symetrically; that is, same distance from each other.. this placement seems..not-random and forced... you agree? why yes/no?

2. no "shadows" or areas of different light intensity on the uniforms; should they had been washed with some dark counterstain? Or maybe dryrbushed with a lighter shade of the uni color?

3. "Stuff under the boots"; I see space and "stuff" between the sole of the boots and the ground. I assume that the same way you want your A/C and AFV wheels flush against the ground, you want boots solidly on the ground? Or if you pose a fig striding, have a heel make contact with the ground simulating walking?

4. i see the seams, specially on the weapons... I also assume that I should bore out the barrel of any weapons I place in figures.

5. The grass in Kandahar and Bazzoka team looks like a noodle bundle; should the grass point downwards and at least appear to have "roots" in the soil?

Anyways, those are my "figure newbie" honest and objective observations for what is worth...

Lighten up, Francis.  If you don't appreciate honest criticism, don't read them, MM doesn't seem to.  As I said though, they are not intended for him as they will fall on deaf ears.

ajlafleche

 

Then you might want to avert your eyes when you see Gino's avatar turn up. Gino's "bashing," as you call it, honest critique is really more like it, is nothing that isn't well deserved.

Nope, its not honest critique, he is quite plainly being a jerk and his posts in MM's threads IMO are borderline harrasement.

acmodeler01

I enjoy looking at MM's purchases, models, or whatever you like to call them. Some are better than others, but they are all nice to see. The same can be said of just about everyone that posts their own builds on this site.. some are great, some not so.

I can do without Gino's predictable bashing of the builds. That gets old.

Then you might want to avert your eyes when you see Gino's avatar turn up. Gino's "bashing," as you call it, honest critique is really more like it, is nothing that isn't well deserved.