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Boeing 307 Stratoliner

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  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Boeing 307 Stratoliner
Posted by bondoman on Sunday, August 23, 2009 4:02 PM

There's a good article in the current Air + Space, which prompted me to get down the old 1/72 Maquette model. The kit has new fuselage halves, plus most of what appears to be a pirated casting of most of a B-17E model, guns, bombs and all.

The overall quality is so poor that I am tossing everything except the fuse halves, sending the bits to the spares bin and the bigger pieces to the dump.

So I need to get another -17 kit. Since the 307 first flew in late 1938, it would coincide with the earliest B-17s which were still in the prototype stage. The oldest model I can find is Academy's C/D, which looks pretty good and is cheap enough at $ 23. If any Boeing experts have any advice, experience with this, etc. I would be most appreciative. I'm not in a hurry to buy the kit as I'll be sanding and scribing the tube for a while.

Thanks, Bill

 

 

  • Member since
    November, 2004
  • From: Cat Central, NC
Posted by Bronto on Sunday, August 23, 2009 7:11 PM

The B-17E parts aren't pirated casts, they are from the old FROG molds.  I did the same as you are wanting, putting Academy wings on the Maquette fuselage, just be prepared for a lot of filling / sanding to get it to fit. Use the Academy B-17D kit, as you need the cowlings with the cooling fins for the late 307 fuselage in the Maquette kit.  There are a few other detail differences in the wings, I can look them up for you in about 2 weeks when I get back home.

  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:45 PM

That makes sense, in that Maquette I think is a spawn of Novo, which was the descendant of FROG. The Fortress/307 parts are really terrible and all flash. I do like FROG, I have a Whitley under construction as well as a Shackleton.

Why is the Maquette "late 307"? Weren't they all built at the same time? The only good photos I can find show no cowl flaps and no superchargers. Also the horizontal stabs seem, and it's hard to tell, to be the big triangular type. 

Thank you for responding, and any info is greatly appreciated.

I've filled in the windows, and will paint them back on. I've put tabs in one half. I'm figuring that I'll learn on this one how to make rivet rows!

Thanks, again.

  • Member since
    June, 2004
  • From: Tucson
Posted by cardshark_14 on Monday, August 24, 2009 12:08 AM
Bill, 

I'm interested in this build as well, though I think I'll probably use the Airmodel vacuform conversion.  I'd love to see more pics and a WIP thread of this one. Wink [;)]  What airline are you going to do?  I'm gonna do a camouflaged C-75, though a Pan Am bird would be tempting.

Cheers,
Alex
Never trust anyone who refuses to drink domestic beer, laugh at the Three Stooges, or crank Back In Black.
  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: North Pole, Alaska
Posted by richs26 on Monday, August 24, 2009 12:19 AM

You can also use Academy's B if it is still available.

WIP:  Monogram 1/72 B-26 (Snaptite) as 73rd BS B-26, 40-1408, torpedo bomber attempt on Ryujo

Monogram 1/72 B-26 (Snaptite) as 22nd BG B-26, 7-Mile Drome, New Guinea

Minicraft 1/72 B-24D as LB-30, AL-613, "Tough Boy", 28th Composite Group

  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Monday, August 24, 2009 12:23 AM

Great, Alex. I'm doing Pan Am, unless the prep doesn't go well, after all it's polished aluminum. The decals with the kit are no good, but I have all kinds of PAA decals around. Great to hear from you. Bronto may be a good source too. No interiors- painted windows and screen.

Good to have your company! Lot's of history here. Did you know what happened to HH's private one? I do, and it's close to you!

EDIT: B huh? I'll look for that. Landing gear looks early too.

  • Member since
    December, 2002
  • From: Northern California
Posted by jeaton01 on Monday, August 24, 2009 1:41 AM

Bill, all of the Stratoliners were rebuilt with later B-17 wings and engines, so it depends on the time frame, as usual.  I have a very good magazine article on the 307 history which I will try to get for you.

I have a vacform conversion which I plan to do "someday".

John

To see build logs of my models, go here: http://goldeneramodel.com/mymodels/mymodels.htm

  

  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Monday, August 24, 2009 2:03 AM

I'd appreciate that. Pre war in PAA service. I'm following the one at the Smithsonian, for what that's worth; NC 19903.

Here's a link to it's previous history. I can't tell if PAA ever actually had it in service, but I like the idea. There's a number of nice pics far down the page on this link:

http://www.air-and-space.com/Boeing%20307%20N19903.htm

I would like to hear back from Bronto abt his comment on the "late" fuselage. one thing is apparent now that I compare the castings to these photos. The model has a real dumb nose, which is obvious in the rendering on the box, but also in my photos. The actual aircraft looks a lot like a C-46; much more sharp. I'll have to think about that. Might not be too hard to fix.

  • Member since
    November, 2004
  • From: Cat Central, NC
Posted by Bronto on Monday, August 24, 2009 12:50 PM
Several of the first 307's had the small tail / horizontal stabilizers of the early B-17's.  The the terms "early" and "late" are my usage and not official terms.  Sorry for the confusion.
  • Member since
    December, 2002
  • From: Northern California
Posted by jeaton01 on Monday, August 24, 2009 7:56 PM

Bill, it looks like 19903 wore Pan Am colors until 1948 when they sold it.  Here are pictures mostly of 903 from four different sources.  It got a flag on the tail when it under military control but was flown by Pan Am crews.  The seedy looking cockpit photos are of it at Pima before restoration.  The really nice cockpit photos are from a book of Smithsonian cockpits.  I'll leave these photos up for a month or so, they are large files.  Only the TWA 307's got the B-17G overhaul in 1944 because they were all converted to C-75's during the war.  In that overhaul they got B-17G wings, landing gear, horizontal tails and lengthened tail cones to fit the more aft located tailplane.  The pressurizarion equipment was also removed on those airplanes at that time.  None of that happened to any of the Pan Am airplanes.  As to B-17 horizontal tails, the original 307's had B-17C horizontal tails, but as detailed in the photos, the span and area was increased prior to any airline deliveries, so until the TWA refits no 307's had B-17 horizontal tails in service, though some were built that way and then modified before certification.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

John

To see build logs of my models, go here: http://goldeneramodel.com/mymodels/mymodels.htm

  

  • Member since
    January, 2009
  • From: San Antonio
Posted by paintsniffer on Tuesday, August 25, 2009 5:54 PM

I wanna say someone made a 1/72 kit of  the B-17 "Swoose."

I think (without checking) Swoose is a D model.. I know it was a pre-war build and lacked the tail gun and a few other features that make up the B-17 we all commonly associate with. So my guess is that would be the best fit for wings and empenage for a 307.. Though it may not be perfect.

I think there was also a change in the prop design between the early B-17s (and the 307) and everything from the E onward. 

Excuse me.. Is that an Uzi?

  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: North Pole, Alaska
Posted by richs26 on Tuesday, August 25, 2009 11:54 PM
I believe that "Swoose" is a combination of several C and D models.  The major difference between a C and D is that the D has the engine cowl flaps as used by all later versions.  All models basically used the same Hamilton-Standard toothpick props until the F model which received the paddle blade props.  Academy makes all versions from the B, C/D, E, F,and G in 1/72.

WIP:  Monogram 1/72 B-26 (Snaptite) as 73rd BS B-26, 40-1408, torpedo bomber attempt on Ryujo

Monogram 1/72 B-26 (Snaptite) as 22nd BG B-26, 7-Mile Drome, New Guinea

Minicraft 1/72 B-24D as LB-30, AL-613, "Tough Boy", 28th Composite Group

  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 12:02 AM

I'm in the market for a B or a C. Earlier the better. I'm going to the LHS tomorrow (it's my birthday) and if no joy, then I'll order from online. Seems to be reasonable, at $ 23.00.

This has been a great response, gentlemen. Of course that  means a build is in order. I've scaled John's drawing at 1/72 and will be able to review the shapes from that. 

Maquette supplied a bag of flap actuator fairings in resin, but I haven't noticed that in any photos. No cooling flaps on the cowlings on the prewar airliners that I can see, no superchargers. Thanks for the prop info.

 

 

  • Member since
    January, 2009
  • From: San Antonio
Posted by paintsniffer on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 1:39 AM

According to the air and space article the 307 did have superchargers.. That is the only way they could cruise up in the thin air.

 

Now if they are the B-17 turbo/superchargers is a different matter. 

Excuse me.. Is that an Uzi?

  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 11:11 AM
 paintsniffer wrote:

According to the air and space article the 307 did have superchargers.. That is the only way they could cruise up in the thin air.

 

Now if they are the B-17 turbo/superchargers is a different matter. 

You are correct- no turbos.
  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: North Pole, Alaska
Posted by richs26 on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 11:39 AM
Pan-Am NC19903 is at the Smithsonian so you can find many photos of it.

WIP:  Monogram 1/72 B-26 (Snaptite) as 73rd BS B-26, 40-1408, torpedo bomber attempt on Ryujo

Monogram 1/72 B-26 (Snaptite) as 22nd BG B-26, 7-Mile Drome, New Guinea

Minicraft 1/72 B-24D as LB-30, AL-613, "Tough Boy", 28th Composite Group

  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 12:09 PM

Indeed, it's a good source of color photos. Thanks for the tip.

I'm debating the finish. I've never tried foil or buffing metalizer, and the a/c is big. I'm going to the LHS this morning on a birthday shopping spree and am going to pick up some buffing metalizer and try it. Any other suggestions welcome.

  • Member since
    January, 2009
Posted by Plainsman on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 1:21 PM

I've had this conversion/kitbash/project from hell sitting on the bench for some time now.  I'm putting 4 Aires Cyclone engines into mine as well.  Even though they may not have the correct nose gear case on the engines, its "good enough for me".  In addition to all the above you will need to add letter box slots to the outer wing panels, and if using the Academy wings you will have to move the exhaust from one side of the engine nacelles to the other.  B-17 and 307 were opposite.  You don't need the underwing flap actuator fairings for the Pan Am bird.  That only pertained to TWA.  Cowl flaps were also only a TWA feature.  I think it is also necessary to extend the wing root trailing edge fairing aft somewhat, as I don't think the kit is correct. 

 

Rick L.

  • Member since
    February, 2003
Posted by Jim Barton on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 3:32 PM
 bondoman wrote:

There's a good article in the current Air + Space, which prompted me to get down the old 1/72 Maquette model. The kit has new fuselage halves, plus most of what appears to be a pirated casting of most of a B-17E model, guns, bombs and all.

 

Thanks, Bill

 

 

 

I read that article just yesterday at the library in Tempe, Arizona.

"Whaddya mean 'Who's flying the plane?!' Nobody's flying the plane!"

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Friday, October 05, 2018 11:30 PM

I'm going to continue with Bill's kit. I have a lot to post and will do so in the next week. Stay tuned...

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