OA-10?

Hey everybody!
Fascinating discussion on the OA-10 Warthog and the OA-10 Catalina.
The WWII OA-10s were, as Salbando correctly stated, the USAAC's PBY's with one major difference: The OA-10s were manufacturer by Vickers of Canada, ao everything was in metric, which caused countless headaches to the USAAC Aircrews. The OA-10s were equivalent the PBY-5, the OA-10As, the PBY-5A, and the OA-10Bs were the PBY-6A. They were used for the Standard PBY duties.
In either case, I like both of them, because thay have both played a part in My home state(Alaska!)(My personal favorite is the PBY), and they both are like the state itself: simple, rugged, and versatile.

Hey 72 Cuda,
The old 10th ARS up here in Alaska (the forerunner to my current squadron) flew OA-10's (the prop jobs so as to not confuse anyone) well into the late 40's and even early 50's for SAR. I've even got a photo of one on Elmendorf doing a JATO take-off.



The OA-10's were later replaced by HU/SA-16B albatroses. I'm planning on making a JATO OA-10 in 10th ARS markings. On another note, the JATO was supposedly used to get out of the many short strips, small lakes and for getting of the arctic ice flows and glaciers that they woould land on using only the hull (no wheels or skis). I've heard both sides as far as whether they reinforced the hulls or not.

On the O/A-10 Hogs, all I know is that we've had both designations for the SANDY role, and I was told that they're basically the same aircraft.

Roger 72cuda, the air is clear.

Hey Dice;
let's get the air clear here, first off an A-10 is a A-10 is a A-10, you work the airframe at Depot, so all the planes are the same to you & I in which I agree 100%, but some knucklehead appointed came up with a OA-10 designation for a limited number of the A-10 airframes, and most units I've been around had their older planes designated as the OA's and their newer planes where just plain A's, and the only thing that comes to mind with myself and all the fellow maintainers is that the reason the older airframes where redesignated was that they all had more upgrades(TCTO's) then the newer planes, like a minor update that was incorperated during manufacture but not on the airframes already in inventory and then they came out with an TCTO for the fix on the older plane, like I said before our unit's 1978 year planes where designated as OA-10's and now they are just A's as with most of our sister units have done with the OA's, but a power that was being paid more then both of our pay together(it might be the same person who came up with the F/A-18 & F/A-22 designation) who came up with this B/S designation because all Hawg's missions include the FAC Mission now but they want to get more taxpayers $$$ for a seperate weapons system, thus our confusion and the T.O's even stated the OA & A designations(but now gone), but all in all the planes are exactly the same (except for build dates and flightline & structual repairs) as said before a A-10 is a A-10 is a A-10, and for what I said the AF dropped the redesignation from the T.O.'s is more likely because of confusion of the line mechanic trying to do some T/Sing and didn't know the differences of who is calling what-what, and for the first question was that what's the difference between the OA & A's as going from my experiences working around the deployed units planes as with my units planes too, is why I said the older A's where redesignated as OA's,
On A Lighter Note: on the new upgrade to the C model version does it have the provisions for the LITENING II & III pods for both wings? or is it just for the rt side only?

QUOTE: Originally posted by 72cuda Hey Dice; When I got to this Unit the -6 stated the differances with the two airframes because our Guru on the plane showed the statements, and she also stated that the statements are no longer in the T.O.'s and just because you work Depot doesn't experss the complete knowledge of equipment, you just see the major mod's only and not complete mission functions, I should know I worked Depot level maintenance (Falcon Ralley, Falcon Sweep, Falcon Plane Update) and never seen any mission maintenance, until I got out of that level and back into the real world of aircraft maintenance with on hands problems and repairs, depot level will never see that type of maintenance only what is shipped in, and for the missions all the Hawg's I've seen (in OEF & OIF) all planes flew the same ordinance except for a couple of units with the LITENING II pods and that piece of equipment was the ONLY difference and to make the point then why did we leave our OA-10 planes states side and just fly our A-10's in both theaters, because our 1978 year planes where OA-10's and the rest are A-10's

72cuda, boy you don't take a differance in opionion ( or calling your "facts" into question) very well do you? So a "Grue" showed you, and told you, about the differance in the A-10 and O/A-10? Well all I can say is....she was wrong!

I guess I could list my qualification but I hate to do that because it's to much like playing who's thingy is bigger than who's. The only reason I came to this forum was to talk models and answer questions on the A-10 if I could. You seem more intent on being the A-10 "Grue" and defending your opinions than making sure you put -out the right info to the people here.

I will not argue with you but, I will tell you when and why you are wrong when I see it and let the good people here deside who to belive. If you, are anyone else here, what's to "check my facts and opinions" on anything I post here please feel free to go to an A-10 website forum and get a second, thrid, or fourth opinion. The "Warthog Territory" forums is a good one (link below) and it has Active, Guard, and Reserves, current and past, maintainers and pilots who would be happy to answer your questions or verify anything I say.

BTW if you don't want to join I can post the question and give a link later.

Main page
http://www.a-10.org

Forums
http://forum.a-10.org

Also the AF website lists the number of A/OA-10s in the inventory by command.

http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?fsID=70

Hey Dice;
When I got to this Unit the -6 stated the differances with the two airframes because our Guru on the plane showed the statements, and she also stated that the statements are no longer in the T.O.'s and just because you work Depot doesn't experss the complete knowledge of equipment, you just see the major mod's only and not complete mission functions, I should know I worked Depot level maintenance (Falcon Ralley, Falcon Sweep, Falcon Plane Update) and never seen any mission maintenance, until I got out of that level and back into the real world of aircraft maintenance with on hands problems and repairs, depot level will never see that type of maintenance only what is shipped in, and for the missions all the Hawg's I've seen (in OEF & OIF) all planes flew the same ordinance except for a couple of units with the LITENING II pods and that piece of equipment was the ONLY difference and to make the point then why did we leave our OA-10 planes states side and just fly our A-10's in both theaters, because our 1978 year planes where OA-10's and the rest are A-10's
as for the WWII Airplanes that had the same #'s where the PBY-5A's that where owned under the USAAC, the book USAAF-USAF Aircraft from 1911 to Present (1985) never stated the amount that the Air Corp's owned but did state that they dropped them around 1945-6 time frame and they also stated the uses the Air Corp's had for they where used mostly for Search & Rescue around the American Continants

72cuda, maybe your unit no longer uses the O/A (no longer has that mission) but the O/A is still alive and well both in funding and pilot requirment. As I said I work depot (for HQ/ACC) and belive me when an aircraft comes in for work I had better know which pot of money to pay for it out of. Also, as I said before, equipment installed IE radios (LARS), year model and such, has nothing to do with if it's an A or O/A 10, it's a bean counter thing and only affects the aircraft on paper and in pilot requiments.

BTW- the TO's title don't cover the O/A because it's only the mission flown and not the airframe itself. If there were differance in the basic aircraft then you would have to have different TO's for A and O/A's but there is no differance so you only need TO's for the basic A-10A. Also look at the cover page for your TO's and I think you will find the O/A covered there.

Note- the aircraft will become the A/OA-10C after the up-coming PE mod!

qmiester,

I think the "prop A-10" was the B-25's of the Southwest Pacific back in WW II. They just took the ole 25 and lowered the wing, slappled a couple jet engines on her spine, swapped the "75" or "50's" out for the mini-gun on steroids and called it an A-10.

Just so you guys know, the article in question was refering to the OA-10 as the jet hawg like 72cuda works on. I wish I could find that article. I'll look around and see if I can.

salbando
I stand corrected - didn't have that data on hand.

littlemoe
yep - talking about flying machines wit props and radial engines (which naturally leak oil but sound sooo great). Yes the current A-10 is a jet but its saving grace is that it hauls a lot rocks to drop on the bad guys and is a great mud mover (as a retired field animal, thats important to me). As far as a prop A-10 don't I haven't seen any thing on one. Is there such a critter??

Hey Dice
most of my INFO states that the OA's where re-converted back but have the same equipment, because the T.O.'s really don't cover the OA's anymore they call them just plan A's, and our unit did have 2 OA-10's (our 2 oldest planes 1978 year ventage) but now they are now called A-10's IAW T.O. 1A-10A-6

you guys are talking about the prop plane right???


Isn't there an A-10 jet plane also???

qmeister,
On the OA-10 Catalina, I stand corrected. They were in fact used by the USAAC during WWII, and afterwards by the USAF.
On the OA-12.....wrong. In 1948 the USAF was given 8 surplus Navy J2F-6's. Five were designated OA-12's and were sent to Alaska to serve with the 10th ARS. The remaining 3 disapeared from records and were believed to have been given to foreign governments as part of the mutual defense assistance program.

QUOTE: Originally posted by 72cuda Hey Guys; well the poop on the OA-10's is that they where the older A-10's (like 1977 & 78 year planes) updated to the newer standards (upgraded radios & Instrumentation) of the latest released ones, also there where OA-10's of WWII fame but we all know them as PBY's, OA-10 are no more because of the Hawg Updates and the AF really didn't want the confusion of which plane you where working on a OA or an A

72cuda, I'm sorry but this is wrong. As I stated in my first post the O desination has nothing to do with the aircraft itself but the mission flown. We also still have As and O/As in the current inventory.

salbando
If you check there were at least 230 OA-10As delivered to the USAAF between Dec 43 and May 45 and they were used operationally. (I think the majority were Canso's) I have also read in a couple of places of the USAAF borrowing PBYs from the Navy (Unofficially of course) at various times.
I think the same was true of the OA-12.

Hey Guys;
well the poop on the OA-10's is that they where the older A-10's (like 1977 & 78 year planes) updated to the newer standards (upgraded radios & Instrumentation) of the latest released ones, also there where OA-10's of WWII fame but we all know them as PBY's,
OA-10 are no more because of the Hawg Updates and the AF really didn't want the confusion of which plane you where working on a OA or an A

Thanks for the info guys.

As stated above there is no differance in an A-10 and an O/A-10 except the mission flown. the same aircraft can be flown in the morning as an A-10 and in the afternoon and a O/A-10. This is used by the "bean-counter" while doing war planing and they are funded a little different. There are still A and OA 10 in the inventory.

The two seat NAWs A-10 was the A-10B (only one built and it's at the Edwards muesum) but when the up-coming PE mod is completed on the Hog it will becom the A/O-10C model.

Correct. The two-seat version of the A-10 was called the NAW-10. I think two were built, one crashed and the version was never bought by anyone.
As far as the OA-10 Hogs, my understanding is that the only difference between the OA-10 and the A-10 was in the designation itself. Both aircraft are the same kinda like MH-60G, and HH-60G. Same aircraft, different mission. The OA-10's are used for FACs and we also used them in the Sandy role. I'm pretty sure they've been phased out and only A-10's are currently out there. But since there is no real difference (except for weapons load out) it's no great loss.
Historically speaking, my current squadron (210th RQS) was formally the 10th ARS. Up here in Alaska they flew OA-10 Catalinas. OA-10 is the USAF (Not USAAC) designator for the rescue Catalina. The 10th also flew the OA-12 which was the USAF designation for the J2F6 Duck. SC-47's, SC-54's, HU-16B's, SH-21's, and currently we fly the HC-130N/H3 and HH-60G.

The OA-10 is an A-10 equiped for the Foward Air Controller role. I'm not sure but I believe it has a few more radios and newer navigation equipment then the run of the mill A-10 but still is listed as having only one pilot. As far as I've been able to find out the two seater was an all weather experiment that never made it to production.

There's at least two kinds of OA-10's!
You're right, there's a version of the warthog called "OA-10".
Also the Army Air Force called their version of the PBY "OA-10".
Probably a search with Google will help you to find out more!?