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Much better photos. :)

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  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Much better photos. :)
Posted by uilleann on Sunday, March 14, 2004 1:49 PM
I finally got some decent shots (with a good camera and macro lens) of my old Tamiya F-117A project showing some of the cockpit detail and lighting I had done. The cockpit includes a PE/resin kit upgrade from Verlinden as well as fiber optic panel lights and LED illuminated screens. The intent was to get the screens to have that 'greyed out' look that a normal CRT tube (ie: television etc.) has when the tube is off. When on, the grey disappears and the bright green of the monochrome tubes shines through.

The nav lights in the wingtips were extremely thin so I used lightsheet to get the illumination there (shines through top and bottom). The rotating beacons are assembled from two LEDs and a short bit of red acrylic rod. One LED is a soft steady on, and the second a brighter blinking to try and simulate the flash of the reflector each time is spins around. The LED blink is a little too quickand doesn't have the slight fade in/fade out you see in a true rotating beacon, but it gets the job done for the most part.

Anyway, this was the old kit, and my inspiration for the new project I've been researching here:

CRT screens (illumination off) and front panel:


Radio stack and switch detail on stick:


Seat detail:


Right side panel detail:


Left panel and my gimpy attempt at a scratch built throttle!:


Top down, side panels and seat:


Top down, illumination turned on:


Illuminated CRTs showing screen detail:


CRT detail 1:


CRT detail 2:


Fully lit cockpit tub:


Fuselage with external APU cart used to supply power to model:


Full fuselage with rotating beacon and nav lights:


Rotating beacon detail (acrylic rod):


Nav light (wingtip) detail:



Brian~
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
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  • From: and just won't go away.
Posted by Quagmyre on Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:03 PM
Wow. What scale?

These fiber optic lit models are so cool. Deffinately influencing me to consider doing the same when I get back to the bombers or maybe the night fighters in my stash. A lit B-24 Liberator, B-25 Mitchell, B-26 Maruader, P-61Black Widow, and A-26 Invader will look really cool on a shelf in the display case. That's at least a year away though. Too many blue planes to do between now and then.

Where can one learn more about fiber optics in modeling?


Current and Subsequent Projects:
1/48 scale Tamiya P-47 "Razorback" - Complete
1/48 scale Testors/Lone Star Models PT-22 Recruit - 20% Complete 
1/48 scale Monogram C-47 Skytrain - Not Started

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:03 PM
Wow, that is pretty awesome. I'm impressed... that really is a super cool effect. I can't wait to see the pictures of the new one in progress, and finished. Good luck getting all of the information that you need.
  • Member since
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  • From: A Spartan in the Wolverine State
Posted by rjkplasticmod on Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:05 PM
That is an incredible amount of detail for one cockpit. I admire your work very much. I have neither the patience nor the talent.
RICK At My Age, I've Seen It All, Done It All, But I Don't Remember It All...
  • Member since
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  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:09 PM
It's in 1:48. Quag, if you have any questions, I'd be happy to answer what I could. My introduction to FO lighting came when I worked at out local planetarium. We had a couple of guys do two AMAZING models from Star Trek. One was the Enterprise and another a Romulan Warbird (both from the Next Generation TV show). Anyway, these guys went so far as to drill out literally thousands of slots and holes etc., put in mini flurecent tubes for the engine nacelles and even a full size strobe light for the super bright blinking nav lights! All the light sources (except for the flurecent tubes) were housed in a large wooden base for each model, and then the fibers were run down to it through a hollow aluminum tube and then routed to their respective lights.

I've done about four models with lighting in them, from a Space Shuttle, to the F-117 you see here, and a couple other planes. It's not too hard to get them in and secured, but I'd also like to know others techniques regarding FOs.

Brian~
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: and just won't go away.
Posted by Quagmyre on Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:20 PM
I may take you up on that offer for helping with FO at a later date Brian. Thinking with enough FO cable I could run the lighting off of one light source. But I'm getting waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay ahead of myself. Back to the Bearcat (no lights).


Current and Subsequent Projects:
1/48 scale Tamiya P-47 "Razorback" - Complete
1/48 scale Testors/Lone Star Models PT-22 Recruit - 20% Complete 
1/48 scale Monogram C-47 Skytrain - Not Started

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:38 PM
I had (and still have) two big issues I hope(d) to overcome.

First, I wanted ALL the lighing and cabeling to be self contained.

Second, I wanted the lighting to last as loooooong as possible.

To accomplish the first point I needed to find a lighting source that achieved several things at once. First, it had to be small. Obviously you can't put much into it if everything is taken up by either a large light, or it's power supply. Second, they needed to burn cool. I didn't want to be melting holes inside my fuselage when it was all glued together. Lastly, they needed to be shock proof - or at least as close to it as they could be.

LED's fit the bill perfectly on all counts.

The second issue was solved by the choice of lights in the first place. LEDs can last for years even being on continually. I never wanted to have to open up a perfectly sealed and painted kit to replace one stinking lightbulb so that was great.

But there was one caveat that I couldn't get around. I could not figure out a means to provide power and still have the entire apparatus self-contained. So I came up with (what I though was anyway!!!) a brilliant idea. Most modern military aircraft are set up to use an APU or ground auxilliary power unit at some point. So I found a grownd crew kit (By Hasegawa I think) that had just this very piece of equipment. I was able to use the actual cables from this little guy and attached their ends to a miniature phono plug - much like the type on the end of your walkman's headphones.

From here I still had to get power into the APU so it could be transferred to the plane as well. This was solved by drilling a small hole in the side of the APU and inserting a plug for a 110v power supply that gives 9v DC at 100mA. Perfect for what I needed.

The lightsheet uses a miniature transformer to step up the voltave to the several thousand volts needed to start the fluorecence in the sheet itself. This transformer is REALLY tiny, probably less than 3/4 of an inch square. It fit beautifully behind the cockpit just in fromnt of the forward wall of the bomb bay and also served a double purpose of nose weight for this model.

The LEDs were all selected (red, yellow, green, and blue) and soldered to a small blank circut board. Then, each was covered with a tiny bit of heat shrink tubing to a height about 1/2 inch above each bulb. the fibers from the cockpit were then directed to each corresponding light and held in place with a small but of CA (superglue).

The beauty of the way this all worked out is that you can choose to display the model without lights and the extra ground equipment, or you can add it if you choose. Since the connector between the APU and the aircraft can be separated as desired. You can also unplug the power jack from the backside of the APU and still use it without power.

I still wish I could find a way to get a good solid and super bright light source to the three landing struts for each of their lights. Perhaps surface mount LED technology will allow this now. It was after all over six years ago I started the plane you see above.

Bri~
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
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Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:54 PM
Good problem solving there Bri. That was a great idea to route the power supply that way.
  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Sunday, March 14, 2004 3:19 PM
A few photos of the APU unit attached to the main model:





Where the wall adapter plugs into the APU model:


A shot showing the connection in the right main gear well:


Close-up of the connection jack between APU and plane:
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
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Posted by fightnjoe on Sunday, March 14, 2004 6:29 PM
awesome.

joe

Veterans,

Thank You For Your Sacrifices,

Never To Be Forgotten

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Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, March 14, 2004 6:44 PM
Very nice work, amazing.
  • Member since
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  • From: Newport News VA
Posted by Buddho on Sunday, March 14, 2004 6:51 PM
That is amazing work, Brian!

Thanks for posting...

Regards, Dan

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Monday, March 15, 2004 12:21 AM
Thanks for the kind words guys. I only hope I can finally get the next project to work out closer to what I had in mind. This first attempt was a great learning experience though. I wonder if I could do a brief write up for FSM if I'm able to photo-document the build this next go around. Anyone know what the submission and photo guidelines would be to do this sort of thing?

Anyway, as good as it may (or may not) have been I'm still desperate to find advice from others much more experienced than I am in regards to finishing the new kit off exactly right!

Bri~
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Harrisburg, PA
Posted by Lufbery on Monday, March 15, 2004 9:05 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by uilleann

Thanks for the kind words guys. I only hope I can finally get the next project to work out closer to what I had in mind. This first attempt was a great learning experience though. I wonder if I could do a brief write up for FSM if I'm able to photo-document the build this next go around. Anyone know what the submission and photo guidelines would be to do this sort of thing?


Based on your work on the F-117, I'd love to see a build-up article in FSM on doing that sort of thing.

I especially like how the MFDs look blank when the lights are off and have data on them when the lights are on! You completely achieved the effect you were going for.

Thanks for sharing! Now I wonder if that can be done with a Hornet cockpit in 1/72. Wink [;)]

Regards,

-Drew

Build what you like; like what you build.

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Piedmont Triad, NC (USA)
Posted by oldhooker on Monday, March 15, 2004 9:38 AM
Outstanding, Brian!!!

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Monday, March 15, 2004 10:41 AM
The screens were pretty fun to get worked out - though they weren't *quite* as clean as I would have hoped. Anyway, their basic construction was as follows:

The stock dash from the Tamiya kit is really pretty good and I found I liked it more than the photo etched set from Eduard. The first thing was to open up the screens themselves. This was simple enough with a micro dril and a sharp #11 exacto blade. From there I needed to figure out a means to create the screens and mount them to the kit part.

To mount the screens I figured I'd need a clear, thin surface. Sheet styrene was all too thick (at least what was available athe the LHS). So a trip to the theatre lighting and effects store downtown was called for. I returned home with a small sample book of theatre gels used to color stage lights. The book is small but provides samples (about 3/4 X 3 inches each) of probably hundreds of different colors and effects gels. What I came up with next was using the stock instrument decals from the Tamiya kit and cutting out each screen. Then each screen was cut from a crystal clear gel and the decals were mounted to this. To achieve the look of the greyed out screens when they were switched off, I used a transparent but slightly smoked brownish-grey gel over the decals, then over top of this went a lightly frosted gel. To finish off, each screen got a new "collar" from the PE parts.

With three miniature screens ready to go, I filed down the original buttons on the face of the Tamiya part to give me a smooth surface to glue the screens to. Once the screens were attached, the rest of the part was mounted and the lights were installed behind.

*click for larger image*


I hope to refine this technique on the future kit. The biggest thing that bothered me about using the decals is that when they are illuminated, the back isn't really black. Perhapd layering two or three decals on top of each other might accomplish this for me. Does anyone happen to know if you can order extra decal sheets from Tamiya directly? Do any of you happen to have an extra Tamiya F-117A decal sheet laying around and nothing to do with it? :D


I thought I'd also show what I did to try and simulate the rotating beacons. The diagram below shows the basic construct of the system I came up with. Each of the LEDs was glued to the acrylic rod with a bit of clear epoxy. I painted the outside of everything silver to try and capture as much of the light as possible and reflect it up and out the top 'button' on the end of the rod. The LEDs were wired together in parallel and together with a resistor are powered by a 9V power source.


Brian~
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posted by zokissima on Monday, March 15, 2004 10:56 AM
wow, absolutely amazing. I wish I had the patience to do something like that :)
  • Member since
    December 2002
Posted by joseaides on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 10:55 AM
Hi:

What are exactly the "theatre gels" you used for the screens?

I'm already building an 1/72 DC-6 with FO for the cockpit , leds for the landing lights and tail beacon, and four motors for the engines.


Amazing work!!

Jose
  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 11:24 AM
Jose, the "gels" (also sometimes referred to as "Gams") are the transparent cellulose plastic used to color stage and theatre lights. If you've ever been to a highschool play or rock concert, you've probably seen those paper-thin squares of plastic held in front of the lights by a thin frame. You should be able to find some at just about any local theatre/lighting shop. You may even want to check with a local rock guitar shop if they also carry lights. What I got was a sample book that has all the colors in one small little package. That way you can pick and choose which colors/effects will work the best for your application.



The books only measure roughly 1X3 inches, so each sample is pretty small - but it still was WAY more than enough for my first project...even with several mistakes.

Bri~

P.S. Wanted to add that there are a LOT of other things one can add to a model besides the standard aftermarked kits which you don't see everyday - such as lighting. With the way technology is advancing, the light sources are getting smaller, burning cooler, lasting MUCH longer and can be mounted just about anywhere. Add to the list all the effects you can create with things like these theatre gels and you can do some AMAZING things! Give it a shot - you may be supprized just how easy it is to do. Cool [8D]
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Brooklyn
Posted by wibhi2 on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 10:35 PM
'scuse me while I pick my jaw off the floor - wonderful work and highly informative
3d modelling is an option a true mental excercise in frusrtation
  • Member since
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  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 10:42 PM
Ya know - it's really not nearly as involved as one would think! I for one would think that polishing out a scratched canopy, or scribing panel lines would be MUCH harder than this was. I hope some of you might be inspired enough to have a go with some lighting effects on a future kit though. The results are almost always stunning!

B~
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
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  • From: United Kingdom / Belgium
Posted by djmodels1999 on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 1:23 AM
Very impressive! Thanks for sharing!
  • Member since
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  • From: Belgium
Posted by DanCooper on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 6:16 PM
I few years back I experimented with dashboard lighting myself, it was the 1/24 Tamyia Ferrari F50, but I must say, the results were certainly NOT as cool as yours.

Congratulations for this magnificent job Bow [bow]Bow [bow]Bow [bow]Bow [bow]Bow [bow]Bow [bow]Bow [bow]Bow [bow]Bow [bow]

On the bench : Revell's 1/125 RV Calypso

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Thursday, March 18, 2004 12:15 AM
What sort of layout did you use Dan? I found that he "multi-media" approach suited my needs best, as just using fiber optics alone was too limiting to achieve what I was after. Has anyone else here used light sheet before either? I'd like to find some more, but can't seem to locate a supplier right off (and of course, I've long since lost my order paperwork from my first LS purchase!)

Bri~
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, March 18, 2004 3:14 AM
There are new super bright leds(white) available now. Many flashlights use them.
A good place to check in California is Fry's Electronics.

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Thursday, March 18, 2004 10:09 AM
I'm going to be looking into these for this newest build myself. The two problems they had in the past were voltages being incompatable with the rest of the circuts and price. What I really need now would be good surface mount super bright whites that I could somehow mount in the landing light lenses on the three struts. Now THAT would be awesome!
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, March 18, 2004 8:45 PM
Beautiful work Brian. Excellent attention to both detail and realism.

Jack
  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Saturday, March 20, 2004 7:37 PM
SAWEEEEEEEEEET!!

Can I just say - "God Bless eBay!"

Just picked up my new kit for the upcoming build for $19.99 instead of the $52.00 retail - Let's just hope it makes it out here in one piece now!

B~
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
  • Member since
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  • From: Newport News VA
Posted by Buddho on Saturday, March 20, 2004 8:48 PM
Once again, amazing work , Brian.

If you get a chance check this out...
http://www.finescale.com/fsm/community/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=16993

You 2 have alot in common...lots of talent!

Regards, Dan

  • Member since
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  • From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posted by uilleann on Sunday, March 21, 2004 7:42 AM
Talent? Is that what they call it these days?! Laugh [(-D] Here I was always lead to believe it was called psychosis, or blunt force trauma to the head! Banged Head [banghead]

Seriously nice work there Jack! I think the Enterprise D I saw at the planetarium was what got me interested in lighting models myself years back. On an interesting side note, I believe that very same also inspired AMT/Ertl to do the same thing. If I remember events correctly, the guys who built that first model took it to the AMT/Ertl guys and actually worked out the production kit (along with the Romulan Warbird) with fiber optics and all pretty much just as you see it in stores now. A little bit of modeling history. Approve [^]

Perhaps we need to start a *Lighted/Motorized Kit* group build next huh? Would any of yous guys be interested? I think it'd be cool to show as many aspects as possible covering mini-electronics. Just no R/C stuff. It would all need to be static display. But we could do lighting of course, perhaps some moving props, or gun turrets for the armor guys, elevators for the ship builders, fully functioning XM satellite radios for the auto nuts!Cool [8D] This could really take off!

Seriously, how many of you might be interested?

Bri~

P.S. Should I start a new thread on this?
"I may not fly with the eagles.....but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!"
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