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Best way to attach biplane wings?

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  • Member since
    March, 2005
  • From: West Virginia, USA
Best way to attach biplane wings?
Posted by mfsob on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:16 AM

Hey you WW I guys and gals, getting ready for final assembly of my 1/72 Fokker D VII and am puzzling over the best way to attach the upper wing - glue the struts to the lower wing and then try to line that up with the upper wing; glue the struts to the upper wing and try to align with the lower, or somehow do it all at once with some kind of jig?

I prefer to use CA glue so I don't have to scrape the parts clean (I know, not as strong a bond but I'm lazy) and am using the thicker, slower setting kind so I'll have a minute or two of wiggle room.

  • Member since
    January, 2003
  • From: Peoples Socialist Democratic Republic of Illinois
Posted by Triarius on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:38 AM
Carriage bolts??? Clown [:o)]Mischief [:-,]Laugh [(-D]

Sorry, feeling whimsical! I've never even heard of a way I'd consider easy—I'd love to hear from the masters…Headphones [{(-_-)}]

Ross Martinek A little strangeness, now and then, is a good thing… Wink

  • Member since
    July, 2013
Posted by DURR on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 11:09 AM

i turn the plane upside down place the top wing flat on the bench then on the ends i place decks  of cards then i place the fuselage on top

i put the struts in place and pull a card or two out at a time until the the struts are right then drop ca on them  

  • Member since
    June, 2003
  • From: Reno, Nevada, USA
Posted by Silverback on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 11:35 AM

Here's what I do:

1. Turn the top wing upside down, cover it with a piece of tracing paper, then mark the location of the strut attachment points.

2. Glue wing struts to the bottom wing and cabane struts to the fuselage.  Using whatever I have on the work bench to build a temporary jig, I suspend the fuselage/bottom wing assembly over the tracing paper, making sure everything is square, even, and lines up with its associated mark.

3. When all the struts are set (but not 100% permanently set), I set the assembly into the inverted top wing.  Sometimes, I need to work on a strut or pair of struts at a time to get everything perfectly lined up.  When I'm happy with the fit, I CA each strut into the top wing.

Just my way of tackling this problem.  Others may have ways that work better for them

Phil

  • Member since
    December, 2005
Posted by solid on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 12:06 PM

Make a Balsa Jig:........

1) Glue your Bottom wing

2) Measure the distance between the middle fuselage and upper wing

3) make a pattern of this in 1/4" balsa so it will hold the wing well

4) place wing on top of this and measure the distanse between the upper wing and lower wing
    where the outer struts go....make a pattern of this also longer than the width of the wings.

5) place the senter pattern and hold, place the outer patterns and hold with rubber bands.

    Now you have everything in the right place and true.......glue in your N struts first then the outer
ones, let dry well then remove the wood patters and your wings are perfectly aligned....

Been doing this for about 40 years on all my bi-planes (my favorite models) and never fails.Big Smile [:D]

  • Member since
    December, 2002
  • From: Harrisburg, PA
Posted by Lufbery on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 12:56 PM
Solid,

This is going to sound like a really stupid questions, but how do you keep the patterns you've made from getting stuck between the wings?

Regards,

-Drew

Build what you like; like what you build.

  • Member since
    December, 2005
Posted by solid on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 1:09 PM

Luftbery..............your are holding them tight, but not too tight!!!, with the rubber bands from the wide outer struts patterns. Once the glue sets just cut the rubber bands. If you are making 1:32 or larger models then the patterns are a little more complicated but are still held by rubberbands....no glue...if interested I will send you a drawing, just let me know.

  • Member since
    May, 2004
  • From: Aberdeen, Scotland
Posted by Colin Russell on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 1:56 PM
Read in a magazine the other day about an alternative way round this age-old problem.  Rather than using the complete wings, a builder (sorry, cannot remember his name) cuts the wing outer panels off both lower and upper wings.  He then sets about attaching the centre sections below the fuselage first - making sure everything is straight and true - then the upper centre section using such struts as are required.  He then drills into the sides of each and fits pins to take the outer wing sections one at a time.  This method allows him to get each of the four wing panels of a biplane set in place one at a time, making the whole job much easier, and allowing him to get at the fixing points for cabane struts much more freely.  Can't say I've tried it, but it's a thought......
  • Member since
    December, 2002
  • From: Harrisburg, PA
Posted by Lufbery on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 2:08 PM
 solid wrote:

Luftbery..............your are holding them tight, but not too tight!!!, with the rubber bands from the wide outer struts patterns. Once the glue sets just cut the rubber bands. If you are making 1:32 or larger models then the patterns are a little more complicated but are still held by rubberbands....no glue...if interested I will send you a drawing, just let me know.



A drawing would be great! I guess the patterns could extend a bit above and behind the top wing and below and behind the bottom wing to get the stagger right.

Thanks.

-Drew

Build what you like; like what you build.

  • Member since
    November, 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 3:20 PM

Solid,

Could I have a copy of your jig too?

Thanks

GG

  • Member since
    October, 2004
  • From: Colorado
Posted by StephenLawson on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 4:26 PM
Using childrens Lego blocks build a temp jig.  Glue your interplane struts to the upper or lower wing and add you top wing. Viola!  The Lego block jig allows you to leave it to dry.  Then just disassemble the jig.

 

Stachel...unconfirmed by Armee means unconfirmed!!!!

  • Member since
    December, 2005
Posted by solid on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 7:13 PM
Dre and GG  as soon as I have the drawing I'll PM it to you........I am not a "hot" artist but will do my best.
  • Member since
    March, 2005
  • From: West Virginia, USA
Posted by mfsob on Wednesday, January 18, 2006 8:50 PM

Oh ... my ... God ... *wonders if Fokker ever made a D VII monoplane*

Thanks for all of the methods, I may save this for the weekend when I have lots of time to screw up, I mean experiment ...

  • Member since
    October, 2004
  • From: Colorado
Posted by StephenLawson on Thursday, January 19, 2006 1:51 AM
Essentially yes. Fokker built low and high single wing experimentals with Fokker D.VII type fuselage powered by rotary and inline engines.  Fokker like anyother aircraft firm based their aircraft types on mathmatical equations.  One set of stats for rotaries another set for inlines.  Other concerns were max ceiling, wing load, weight and etc.  The "V" series ranged from 1 upto 38 versions  The ones we are discussing range from V.26 -38.  The characteristics of the company were maintained in each design.  (Thats why the Fokker Dr.I and the D.VI look similar.) 

 

Stachel...unconfirmed by Armee means unconfirmed!!!!

  • Member since
    April, 2005
  • From: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted by T_Terrific on Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:21 AM

 StephenLawson wrote:
Essentially yes. Fokker built low and high single wing experimentals with Fokker D.VII type fuselage powered by rotary and inline engines.  Fokker like anyother aircraft firm based their aircraft types on mathmatical equations.  One set of stats for rotaries another set for inlines.  Other conmcerns were max ceiling, wing load, weight and etc.  The "V" series ranged from 1 upto 38 versions  The ones we are discussing range from V.26 -38.  The characteristics of the company were maintained in each design.  (Thats why the Fokker Dr.I and the D.VI look similar.) 

Steve:

It was designated the Fokker D VIII.

Aurora made a model of it.

See this link:

http://ramonacafe.com/champlin/champlin%20FOKKER%20D8.jpg

Tom T.Cowboy [C):-)]

“Failure is the opportunity to begin again more intelligently.”-Henry Ford

"Except in the fundamentals, think and let think"- J. Wesley

"I am impatient with stupidity, my people have learned to live without it"-Klaatu: "The Day the Earth Stood Still"

"All my men believe in God, they are ordered to"-Adolph Hitler

  • Member since
    December, 2002
  • From: Harrisburg, PA
Posted by Lufbery on Thursday, January 19, 2006 2:45 PM
Tom,

It was also known as the Fokker E.V. Smile [:)]

Eduard makes 1/72 and 1/48 versions, and Roden makes a 1/72 scale version.

Regards,

-Drew

Build what you like; like what you build.

  • Member since
    October, 2004
  • From: Colorado
Posted by StephenLawson on Friday, January 20, 2006 11:40 PM
 T_Terrific wrote:

Steve:

It was designated the Fokker D VIII.

Aurora made a model of it.

See this link:

http://ramonacafe.com/champlin/champlin%20FOKKER%20D8.jpg

Tom T.Cowboy [C):-)]

 

Tom_T;  Its Stephen, and the prototype of the Fokker E.V was the V.28.  The Fokker D.VIII was the E.V airframe with factory modified wing.  The first E.V types were built improperly with the webs and gussets mislocated.  The Champlin (now Boeing)  Fokker D.VIII is a replica built by Ed Swearington D.545/18 was actually civil reg.NX7557U and was completed on 14 Sept. 1968. 

http://www.earlyaviator.com/archive/a/images/FokkerV28.jpg

Several companies have put out variations of the Fokker E.V / D.VIII.  Here are just a few in 1/48.

http://www.wwi-n-plastic.com/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=40

http://www.wwi-n-plastic.com/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=42

http://www.wwi-n-plastic.com/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=44

 

Stachel...unconfirmed by Armee means unconfirmed!!!!

  • Member since
    April, 2003
Posted by Butch8274 on Saturday, January 21, 2006 11:37 AM
The "Boeing" museum you refer to is the Museum of Flight located in Seattle.  It is completely seperate form the Boeing Co. although they donated the land and many Boeing employees, like myself, donated their time and money to the restoration of the "Red Barn" along with the rest of the museum.  It is one of the priemier aircraft museums in the world and is well worth the price of admission if you're ever in the Seattle area.
  • Member since
    October, 2004
  • From: Colorado
Posted by StephenLawson on Saturday, January 21, 2006 9:43 PM

 Butch8274 wrote:
The "Boeing" museum you refer to...

Just to be exact I said nothing about a "Boeing museum."  Boeing has been a large contributor if not the single most important one of the MoF in Seattle.  Just as Doug Champlin was the chief contibutor of  the "Fighter Museum at Mesa Az."  His business had investors just as the MoF.  I was just acknowledging Boeing's part in the operation. 

 

Stachel...unconfirmed by Armee means unconfirmed!!!!

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