Hellcat vs wildcat

That, I've heard of. There's actually a picture of one fitted in the Walk Around. I actually have heard of a full bubble top mod for the Hellcat, like the T-Bolt. I believe the story was that Grumman had the plans for it drawn up and wanted to do it. However, the F8F Bearcat, which has that feature, was beginning its production run and Grumman would've had to stop production to put the mod in place so the Idea was scrapped. I thought it was very intresting. I can't for the life of me remember where I heard this from though.

Rebel99,

As I understand it, the bubble top Hellcat was not a full bubble top like on the P-51D, but more like the bulged hood used on later P-51Bs and Cs, or on the Spitfire.

I've also read a bit that Corky Meyer wrote about the Panther. Great stuff!

Regards,

-Drew

I never knew there was an actual prototype bubble-top Hellcat. Presonally, I would've liked to have seen what the F6F-6 could do in combat. It had a Pratt & Whitney R-2800-18W and 4 bladed prop like on the Corsair. Corkey Meyer was also project test pilot for the F9F Panther, and recently wrote the first Panther volume for the Ginter series. Of course as soon as I saw that book I got it.

Yep, the Wildcat was a helluva plane. Look what it did at Wake Island. Sunk a Japanese (destroyer ?) with "scratchbuilt" pylons & release mechanism. That was one tough little bird, allright

The bubble top Hellcat had problems with the canopy exploding during dives. Corky Meyer has written about them in one of his articles for Flight Journal magazine. Meyer was a Grumman test pilot during the war. The Hellcat was eventually fitted with radar to serve as a night fighter, and even dropped torpedoes and bombs. It was a hell of a plane.

The Wildcat at first lost a contract competition to the Brewster Buffalo, but was given a second chance. The plane had its share of pilot traps (also written about by Meyer in another article in Flight Journal), but many of those were ironed out with the FM-2 version of the plane built by GM. Because of its small size relative to the Hellcat and Corsair, the FM-2 Wildcat served to the end of the war on escort carriers.

Regards,

-Drew

In regards to the Bearcat, I believe that the armament was 4 20mm cannon, not the 6 50 cals used on the Hellcat. There were plans for a bubble top Hellcat, but it was never put into production.

Its all about the history and sacrifces made. No radar, no simulators. Grumman made the Japs learn the meaning of payback by building solid machines. The wildcat and hellcat are simply amazing.

I am partial to the Wildcat over the Hellcat because the Wildcat had more service on islands while the Hellcat was still on the carriers. The success of the Wildcat was from the tactics used and pilot training.



Anyone intersted in Wildcat service history can do a simple google search for the following words:
Henderson Field
Joe Foss
Guadalcanal


Good luck, have fun,

I love both planes. You'd think from what you've read about the
Wildcat, that is was outclassed by the Zero, that's false. The Hellcat was a great fighter, but it never flew against FW 190's.

Bearcat supposedly had a great time to altitude, and was to be a point defense for the carriers against kamikazes?

As to where the Bearcat fit in - it was designed to be the follow-on to the Hellcat, but the war ended before it got into action. Smaller, but with the same engine and armament. I understand the Bearcat was inspired by lessons learned studying the FW-190.

Sorry, I reversed the order.

Dash 3 had 4 - .50cal mg, and carried more ammo, thats why the fighter jocks prefered it over the dash 4 's folding wing and 6-.50 cal mg arrangement.

Anyone who cares.
rotary engines revolved around their crankshafts.WW1
Teise

Betiobob, the F4F-4 had a third gun outboard of the wing fold

Nsclcctl, Grumman made F4F-3s and F4F-4s. Once Grumman was ready to begin the manufacture of F6Fs, General Motors began manufacturing F4F-4s and subsequent variants as FM-1s and FM-2s. In British service the F4F was called the Martlet before being renamed Wildcat.

Also, if you think the F4F looks like a beer keg, you should look at the Brewster F2A Buffalo!

OOps . . .duh ! I hadn't had enough coffee before I replied ! (at least YOU knew what I was trying to say !)

Pix,
Radial engines...Rotary engines were used on many First World War fighters
Ray

the first F4F Wildcats used the Pratt & Whitney "Twin Wasp" 14 cylinder R-1340 radial engine.

The Dash 3 had a non-folding wing and carried 6-.50 cal. MG,

The Dash 4 had a folding wing and carried 4-.50 cal. MG.

I think its the old "form follows function." The Grummans were dependable and solid ("Grumman Iron Works"). Rotary engines were more servicable at sea. Two other manufacturers, however, produced sleek rotary engined aircraft. The Mitsubishi Zero & the Focke-Wulf 190 (w/ BMWs)

I am just surprised that both these planes were so successful. Looking at them they appear to be beer kegs with wheels. The corsair is so sleek as is the P51 mustang. I guess the Thunderbolt to me is another enigma. A flying tub.

I've seen that plane at the Lone Star Flight Museum! It's an amazing place, well worth checking out if you can make it to Galveston. They have tons of great planes, and they're all working models.

I'm an F-4u man myself, but I do love the Hellcat as well. It did everything pretty well, and nothing badly.

madda

As soon as Grumman started getting large orders for the Avenger and the Hellcat, General Motors took over Wildcat production, building FM-1 and -2s. The FM-1 was the same as the F4F-4, but the FM-2 was a revised version featuring a newer more powerful engine and prop, taller tail fin, and exhausts. Grumman consulted many Naval aviators who had flown the Wildcat in combat and gathered a great deal of information on how to improve the Wildcat and come up with a design that could meet the Japanese on even terms. That's why the Hellcat did so well. It was also simple, rugged, and easy to maintain and fly which is why it beat the Corsair into fleet service. More aces flew the Hellcat than any other type of aircraft (including the P-51!) and shot down more than any other type. The U.S.'s third highest scoring ace (and the Navy's "top gun"), Captain David McCampbell flew the Hellcat and scored all of his kills in it. I was lucky enough to sit in a real one at the airshow here a couple of years ago. It was Lone Star Flight Museum's bird in the markings of Lt. Alex Vraciu. I looove that airplane!

Yes they were all Grumman and the Bearcat (F8F) followed the Hellcat. The F7F Tigercat (twin engine and a very narrow fuselage) was sandwiched in between them. These were folowed by the F9F Panther/Cougar, the Cougar was a Panther with swept wings.

Were they both built by Grumman, the hellcat to replace the Wildcat.

Secondly, where does the Bearcat fit in?

Hasegawa makes the best 1/48 scale Hellcat and Tamiya the best 1/48 Wildcat. The Hellcat is my favorite WWII fighter so naturally I've built a lot of them. Of all the different manufacturers that make 1/72 Hellcats I rate Italeri's as the best. The kit is also in Revell's catalogue, and it includes some very nice rocket stubs and rockets to go on them. I think the best Wildcat in 72 is Hasegawa's. Also, I believe the early model Wildcats were the ones that had four 50 cals., and from the F4F-4 up had six like the Hellcat. The Wildcat is much smaller than a Hellcat, an has a rounder cross section.

Excellent (in my best Mr. Burns voice)!

That all being said- who makes the best kits of these in 48th and 72nd scale?

Depends on which Wildcat variant you're discussing :)

The reason for the narrow track was that the Wildcat's gear retracted into the fuselage. I also believe the Hellcat had 2 more guns.

Great profiles. The only comment I have is that they appear to be the same length, when the Hellcat is actually a bit larger than the Wildcat.

Regards,

-Drew

On the top is an F4F-4 Wildcat
On the bottom is an F6F-5 Hellcat

Wildcat was the first monoplane fighter from Grumman, The second monoplane adopted by the Navy. It had a nine cylinder radial engine, and a narrow track landing gear. It fought the Japanese for the first 2 years of the war. The Hellcat was a major improvement on the Wildcat, with a 2 row, 18 cylinder P&W R-2800 engine. More powerful, it powered most of the radial engined fighters of WW2. The landing gear is wider, giving it better deck handling. It is larger than the Wildcat. It was easier to fly and land on Carriers than the Corsair, so Navy pilots ran up bigger scores because it went to sea earalier.