WW2 German Tank Track Numbers

"Fast executable" above probably better translates as fast running.

snapdragonxxx

Kgs 6110/380/120

Kgs is the weight the tracks will support, so Kgs 6110 is 6,110 Kilogrammes = 6.11 metric tons PER LINK

Sorry, this is incorrect. By that reckoning, a Panther track link Kgs 64/660/150 could only support 64kg!  :)

Kgs means (with rough google translation):

K = Schnelllauffähige Kette für Kraftfahrzeuge (Fast executable chain for motor vehicles)
g = Stahlguß aller Legierungen (Cast steel alloy)
s = schwimmende Bolzen (Floating pin)

As far as I can ascertain, the number after Kgs is simply a unique type number.

snapdragonxxx

Kgs 6110/380/120

Kgs is the weight the tracks will support, so Kgs 6110 is 6,110 Kilogrammes = 6.11 metric tons PER LINK

Sorry, this is incorrect. By that reckoning, a Panther track link Kgs 64/660/150 could only support 64kg!  :)

Kgs means (with rough google translation):

K = Schnelllauffähige Kette für Kraftfahrzeuge (Fast executable chain for motor vehicles)
g = Stahlguß aller Legierungen (Cast steel alloy)
s = schwimmende Bolzen (Floating pin)

As far as I can ascertain, the number after Kgs is simply a unique type number.

Yes, James, you answered my question concerning the political situation in Germany regarding discussions of WW II and provided me with a good amount of information on the Elefant/Ferdinand.  I was hoping that you may have run across an overhead view/picture of the engine compartment.  I have pictures of the engine and driver compartments empty and a plan view drawing of the tank interior but nobody seems to have a picture or drawing of the engine compartment from above with the engine and generators in place.  As you know we usually make do with what we have but we always like more.

But, it is the information on the tank track numbers for which I am most thankful.  I have asked numerous people and no one knew the answer.  I had given up searching and the post in FSM was my last try.  I was so impressed I sent your definition to Rich at R&J Enterprises (I had asked him and through him  his local IMPS the same question.).  He thought it an interesting question and, as he is a resin armor kit manufacturer, I believe he should know the answer..

 

Hi Mark,

I'll answer your second question first.

I was only researching colours that were being used, as the modern RAL system do not have those actual shades anymore. They were removed after the war.

During the development of the Tiger I, Henschel and Porsche each made a different chassis. Porsche had begun production on his chassis but the Henschel version was chosen. Porsche had 90 Tiger prototype chassis (Porsche VK4501 (P)) already finished. On September 22, 1942 it was decided to build a StuG with 200 mm armor and an 8.8 cm gun built on the Tiger(P) chassis. Alkett was to design and produce the Ferdinand with Nibelungenwerke supplying the completed chassis. On February 6, 1943, Hitler ordered 90 Ferdinands to be made available as soon as possible. This resulted in the Ferdinand to be completed at Nibelungenwerke. The conversions were done at the Steyr-Daimler factory at Nibelungenwerke and completed by May 8, 1943.

Here are some specifications for the engine compartment. It should be enough for you to research some more

Engine

Maybach HL120TR/TRM

Transmission

Porsche-Siemens Electric drive
Porsche/Siemens-Schuckert petrol-electric drive.
3 forward, 3 reverse.
Electric drive.
Gasoline-electric drive

Fuel

Petrol

Qantity

950 liters (used 833 liters per 100 km of road)

A right gas guzzling underpowered giant with a tendency to break down frequently due to the not very reliable tranmission(s). This is why the Tiger I contract went to Henschel!

Now I will answer the first question.

I take it that you haven't visited Germany. If you do you will find a very clean well run country. the phrase "Alles In Ordung" (all in order) is really the watchword. Anything to do with Hitler and his regime is banned and a taboo subject. It is taught in schools as part of their country's history but showing the swastika or the salute or even the goose step march is against the law. Doing so will land you in clink that fast your feet won't touch the ground. I think that it is an automatic six month sentence, a huge fine, and if you are a foreign citizen immediate deportation after the six months (no parole) and a lifetime ban on returning, even just passing through an airport to a different destination.

After WWII the country went through a de-nazifying process under the Allies and lots of documentation etc was just simply destroyed without the thougtht of preserving it for posterity. The allies just wanted to remove all traces of the regime. Stuff has survived though and is highly prised by museums and researchers as the technological advances made during those years were fantastic and did lay down basics for lots of stuff we see today.

The german people even today do feel very guilty about the third reich and what the regime did. Things are beginning to open up but it really is still a taboo subject in Gemany especially on the political front. you can have tours round munich that follows Hitlers footsteps, also you can also have a tour in Berlin that takes rou to buildings that housed the various Reich ministries and Gestapo HQ etc. You can even stay in Colditz, the WWII Prisoner of war camp.

So, why is this stuff politically sensitive? There are laws in Germany that make it so. I could ask the question, why, in the modelling world are WWII german military subjects the biggest sellers? Because the diversification and modification options make for interesting building!

Take a trip, visit some museums and do some tours. Ask the question - carefully. Listen to the answer, but also listen to not only what is said....... but what is NOT said.

Have I answered your questions?

James

Snapdragonxxx you are the greatest!  But, since you included the information, why is "stuff like this...politically sensitive?

Did these people have any information on the engine compartment of the Elefant/Ferdinand tank? I've searched everywhere for information even speaking with the assistant director of the Aberdeen, Maryland, Tank Museum (which is no longer in Aberdeen).  Their Ferdinand engine compartment was welded shut and no pictures of the interior were taken.  I'm at a dead end.

Further to answers already posted, here is the definitive answer.

While researching colours for Italeri's S-100 Schnellboot (don't start! let me finish!) I came across a wealth of colour and technical data for all three arms starting 1939 and ending in 1945. The owners of the archive have let me make copious notes and colour matching (you'll be amazed how much the Vallejo Model Colour Range matches exactly!) but no actual copies of the original material - stuff like this, while a modellers dream find, is still very politically sensitive.

Now, to answer your question.

Kgs 6110/380/120

Kgs is the weight the tracks will support, so Kgs 6110 is 6,110 Kilogrammes = 6.11 metric tons PER LINK

The Middle number is indeed the Length of the track in Millimetres - 360 = 36 cm

the last number is the track Width again in Millimetres - 120 - 12cm.

Now, to finish, The wider tracks you mention still have the same designation but are the wider winter tracks used on the models you have listed, and later standard ones on the later 1943-1945 Panzer IV tanks Later in the war the late Panzer IV's operating on the Easternfront were fitted with even wider tracks (Ost Kettern)

The overall weight (unloaded) of the Panzer IV was in the region of 20-24 metric tonnes. Track links are designed to more than support and spread the weight of the tank evenly over the ground as well as to grip and provide movement.

Does this help you??

James

This is a very interesting question and not one that I've given much thought to...but I can confirm that the middle number is indeed the track width in mm including the pins used to secure the links to each other. The Pz IV early variants had 38cm tracks vs. 36cm on the Pz III and later on they both standardized on 40cm tracks. Given the time period in question, the NbFz would have used the Pz IV style 38cm tracks. The second number I believe is the pitch or length of the individual track links. I'm not sure if the first number in the designation is meaningful or not aside from just an identifier. Am curious if someone else can shed more light on this.

I'm not familiar with the numbering system for German tracks, but I'm sure it follows some sort of logical progression. It's my understanding that early panzerIII/IVs had 36cm tracks and later models had 40cm tracks. I'm guessing, but I'd say the early 36cm tracks would be appropriate for a Neubaufahrzug.