Need help w/ tamiya german figs.

MAJ Mike

The most amusing diorama I saw produced by a "serious builder", was an early model Panzer IV (short 75mm gun) transporting SS troops in 44-dot camo smocks and armed with MP-44 assault rifles.  Supposedly, the scene depicted the invasion of France in May 1940.  I could see the camo, because the SS was the first organization to widely issue camo gear to their combat troops.  But figures were wearing gaiters and low quarter shoes and the MP 44/Sturmgehwer were apparently used because they "looked cool".  That's not counting bolt holes in the Panther D vs the Panther A, that's just science fiction.

I remember something similar in a build article in FSM a couple of years ago. Featured a nice Hetzer on a dockside i think surrounded by trroops straight out of the battle of France 1940. All had M36 tunics, jackboots and not an MG 42 or other late war weapon in site. Shows how a good build can be ruined by a lack of basic research

Yep I looked all through that link. Sorry for the inconvenience

Have you looked at the website I cited eariler in this thread?  Look at www.atthefront.com  Here, this is the second time I've posted the link for you.

Thanks MAJ Mike.  I'm having a hard time finding configurations in the site. I thought it would be under 'Historical Reference', but could not find any pics of gear attatched to the uniforms

The German map case was made of leather (either black or brown) and was most often seen attached worn on the officer's belt.  I've never seen one with a shoulder strap (like ours).

Again, I recommend checking the At the Front website for material colors, configurations, and detail.

Nice pics Oddmanrush.

Spamicus (or anyone), where would the map/case normally have been attatched to the squad leader do you know? It turned out that the personal gear configurations in Tamiyas instructions did not indicate it but rather a second canteen or somethin'. I presume it would have been clipped to the front left hip on the belt, not sure.

Thanks.

Yeah Mike, I agree with your assessment. I like to see a scene where not every one is carrying the same equipment or wearing the same uniform. I'm pretty awful at figures any way so I generally avoid them but this is an interesting conversation.

Those photos range in date from late 1939/early 1940 to April of 1945.  The SS troops with all of their equipment is from a propaganda photo of the earliest hours of the Ardennes Offensive.  One the photos is from Stalingrad, another from the defense of Berlin.  The troopers with snow camo and heavy loads is probably from winter 1942-43.

The amount of equipment carried by soldiers will depend upon the time period depicted and the mission in progress.  Unnecessary baggage was collected by company-level personnel and carried either in trucks or horse-drawn wagons organic to the unit.  Such equipment would be returned to the troops when things settled down.

The most amusing diorama I saw produced by a "serious builder", was an early model Panzer IV (short 75mm gun) transporting SS troops in 44-dot camo smocks and armed with MP-44 assault rifles.  Supposedly, the scene depicted the invasion of France in May 1940.  I could see the camo, because the SS was the first organization to widely issue camo gear to their combat troops.  But figures were wearing gaiters and low quarter shoes and the MP 44/Sturmgehwer were apparently used because they "looked cool".  That's not counting bolt holes in the Panther D vs the Panther A, that's just science fiction.

Like I said, load up you models and figures with as much AM ash-and-trash you want.  Your money, your time, your figures.  However, if you see an answer you don't like, don't start asking for OKW or OWH field gear manuals and directives.  Some of these "serious builders" are a real PITA.

Cheers. Make it a good day.

EasyMike

You can configure personal equipment any way you want to.  An infantryman will not carry anything he feels he doesn't need.

 

Hey guys, I'm certainly not expert on German infantry but I thought I'd chime in with a few pics for discussion or reference purposes....Adding equipment to troops is always my least favorite step to the process and I've always wondered about discarding pieces or mixing and matching. I guess it would depend on what the troops are doing in that particular scene....If they are making a small attack or raid, I can see how they'd be lightened up, not carrying every piece of kit they own.

Here are some interesting pics.....You can see, these guys are stripped to the bare minimum....

Of course, I can't claim to know the accuracy, date or circumstances of the photos but I thought they'd be interesting....

On the other hand, these pics shows troops carrying most, if not all, of their gear....

Just something to think about is all....

Thanks gentlemen. I can now progress with the diorama. Will post pics soonish in a new thread.

You can configure personal equipment any way you want to.  An infantryman will not carry anything he feels he doesn't need.

Discarded was a poor choice of words.  I see them less and less in photos as the war progresses.  Use of  gas, poison or otherwise, was rare to non-existant  during WWII for fear of retaliation.

I don't have an OKW directive in hand, but the gas mask cannisters are just not very visible after, say, early 1944.  Some may have been retained as dust masks for the Russian summer, but infantrymen tend to lighten their load whenever and wherever possible.  I'm going on over 40 years experience of observing WWII combat photos.

Regarding loss of equipment, combat losses are "written off" and replacement gear is issued, if its available.

Your figures/models/kits.  Load 'em up with whatever ash-and-trash you want.  Combat forces the participants to simplify their lives to the highest possible degree.  We can count rivets, road wheel bolt holes, and gas mask cannisters if that's your wont.  Personally, its just fly-s**t in the pepper to me.

Cheers.

Maj MIke: Can you tell me your source for German landsers discarding their gas mask containers?  From what I recall, each soldier was responsible for their entire kit unless something extraordinary happened.  Army bureaucracies around the world are similar, I'm sure.  Certainly some were separated from their owners but I think in most cases, one is better off leaving the canister with the soldier.

Most German Army infantry continued to wear the "early garb" through 1942, so you are good w/ the early uniforms for your situation...the biggest/most noticable thing to change in '43 was the low cut shoes replacing the high cut jackboots...also, the dark collar of the tunic went away as well and was the same color as the rest of the simplified tunic...

The cannister item is a gas mask carrier.  They were gradually discarded as the war progressed.  Check out this link www.atthefront.com   They are WWII re-enactor uniform/equipment suppliers.  Their replica items are absolutely atuhentic and accurate in color, style, type of materials used, etc.  Additionally, you get a much better close-up view than available elsewhere.  The owner also has links to other sources of information.

Worth looking at.

I'm no expert on German infantry gear and uniforms, but I'd guess you could go with the standard field gray uniform in 42 without much trouble. The set you're using is pretty old as I recall and newer figs might give you a better result. Typically in a squad of infantry the leader, either an officer or NCO  would carry the map case and bino's etc. The cannister thing is a gas mask carrier.