German Factory Hull Numbers

Ok, I punted on that one...     But if Mr. Byrden doesn't know what they are, I don't feel so bad.

Here are some more;

Byrden

"640", whatever it may be, is not the last 3 digits of that Tiger's Fgst. number. It's much too early a Tiger. David

 

What is your opinion as to what it is? You're the guy with the tiger.info site right? 

You're welcome. I'm glad I could assist you in your project. Happy Modeling!  

More great info! It is probably a good thing that I'm doing a paper panzer first, it'll give me some leeway to mess things up. Thanks again, you've been really helpfull.

I found some more info on Mig's model. The large number on the side is Nr54 16I45, this comes from the last 2 digits of it's fahrgestellnummer, 305054, and it's date of manufacture; 16 Jan 1945. (The "I" is actually a "J" in this font). I also found the decals for this number, they come with Dragon's Jagdtiger kit #6285.

The large numbers on the Hetzer are probably the last 3 digits of the fahrgestellnummer. Here is a Tiger under construction with (most likely) the last 3 digits on the hull;

 Most of the other markings are "words, numbers, arrows, warnings, figures and anotations"- (Mig)...many show locations were a particular part should be welded.

There are books on German tank factories, one I can think of is; OKH Toy Factory: The Nibelungenwerk: Tank Production in St Valentin, by Michael Winniger, ISBN-13: 978-3905944051. I don't own it...yet. But at $80, this may not be where you want to spend your hobby dollars, especially if it doesn't contain the info you want.

Usually when I am confronted with a problem like this, I simply look at the available period photos and copy what I see. Google "German tank factory" and examine the images. If this is a "Paper Panzer" project, no one can really be too critical of your modeling results.

Ok, you're right. Brush-painting can be enjoyable anyway. On the Hetzer I notice that the numbers are getting progressively larger from left to right...not very artistic at all I'm still curious what product these people are using though. In the MMI article ("Recovery Kingtiger" in the Sept. 2015 issue), the author definitely says decals, without telling you what product. I was thinking maybe homemade.

One last thing, do you have any idea what the numbers actually represent, or would there be somewhere I could find out ? Even if I'm building a paper panzer like the 45.02 Hintern, I'd probably like to have an idea of what I'm writing on my tank. 

Mig's build is featured in Euro Modelismo "Rarities", a step by step guide written by Mig. He states that he used white paint for the large numbers and a water color pencil for the chalk markings. This must be done on a completely flat finish for the pencil technique to work properly. I know my free-hand letter painting is not the best, but who is to say your's is going to look wrong? Add some drips and runs, it's not like these assembly guys were nit-picking artist types like us!

On a very cursory examination, I found these: 

http://www.scalemates.com/kits/219743-archer-fine-transfers-ar35148-soviet-turret-numbers 

The font looks about right, though there aren't any letters so I don't think they can be it. 

Lol....You're welcome. I hope folks find my rantings somewhat useful.

The technical term you are looking for is "Fahrgestell-Nummer" or as the compound noun "Fahrgestellnummer".

I think I've seen decals like this, but I don't recall where. My guess was Archer, but stumbling through their 69 page catalog yielded nothing.

Lol amazing post, it's like reading an encyclopedia entry! 

Mig's number font looks just the same as the Kingtiger I saw in MMI magazine, so I wonder if there's a product out there. 

The whole deal with red oxide vs zinc grey is pretty much what I assumed already (I.e. red oxide being used for everything except some very late war exceptions). BTW, I revel in arcane "quagmire" like that, so thank you!

I'm specifically wondering about that large number that Mig uses on his model....what would be the technical term for that number?

I can think of several examples of chassis numbers in various states of production off the top of my head, I'll see what I can find for photos. There may be decals, but I don't know which set/s they are... Try looking at Archer for starts.... Models I've seen built in this fashion have had hand-painted numbers.

Here is a Maus chassis;

Jagdtiger;

Hetzer;

Elefant;

These numbers appear to be painted. Chalked notes, location / alignment marks and numbers from various stages of production are common too.

Feel free to wade into the whole Lead Oxide Red vs Zinc Phosphate Grey and/or Black argument in order to determine which color you are looking at.....

 Most of the hulls you see are in Red Oxide primer, but not always.

An introduction into this quagmire;

http://www.network54.com/Forum/571595/message/1223453004/Re-+s.H.Pz.Jg.Abt+559+Jagdpanther+insignia

Quoting from the final paragraph of the above page;

"It should be noted there are plenty of wartime photos and surviving relic evidence of red oxide/red lead tinted primer coatings which clearly establish it as the most commonly used primer coating colour on Panzer componentry. Modellers in particular should note, however, there is arguably room for some variation in primer colours on their builds of late war vehicles."

 The chassis numbers, turret numbers and other component's serial numbers are also stamped into the metal itself, a quick search will show examples of these. Obviously, these would be found on interior surfaces.

I imagine the whole numbering / marking process probably starts with a welder's soapstone marker and progresses from there. Some chassis numbers were even visible on the finished vehicle, many Jagdtigers displayed them on their glacis;

Mig Jimenez's take on this idea;

http://www.missing-lynx.com/gallery/german/migjag.htm