Only a handful of their early kits that included their Panther/Jadgpanther, Sturmtiger and the USMC AAV7A1. The Amtrac was reissued later as an all plastic kit as were the Panther hulled kits.

I did not know they made metal hulls, that is interesting.

My one on the Bradley  is plastic, so has to be a newer one.

I have already started assembly, will post a thread soon.

Thanx for all the advice and replies.

Theuns

Hey Theuns,

I wish I had posted a response earlier. Its important to support the modelers that take on builds in this scale, and you have done an excellent job. Hope to see you build more.

I've posted this a few times before but what the hey? A friend recommended auto store flexible trim and bumper paint as a primer/undercoat for flexible tracks. So far I've had no issues with it myself. This is the brand I've been using, not sure if it's available there or not but I'd think there'd be something like it in a South African auto parts store.

https://www.duplicolor.com/product/trim-and-bumper-paint

Theuns

I will keep it in mind thanx.

The tracks on the sherman was also a black soft plastic of sorts, I did have quite a hard time when I put them on that the mud fell out in places where it bends.

I primed them with tamiya primer and painted with enamels, dried completely and does not feel tacky, it is very hot and dry here or maybe I was just lucky!

Even when I had to stretch them a little to get over the wheels, they did not feel like they were about th crumble.

The tracks on the bradley is also the black stretchy plastic and feels nice and plyable sofar. However I will heed your warning and do this Irak Bradley with acrylics, maybe the weathering will als stick better.

 

Theuns

 

You're confusing the old issue with the original Dragon black vinyl tracks with the black vinyl tracks issued with your Trumpeter kit. They are most likely different types of vinyl and will not have the same issues. If you happen to buy an old Dragon 1/72 scale armor kit with black vinyl tracks, they may have an issue taking paint.

Likewise with the Dragon DS tracks. Some of my old kits, the tracks deteriorated, but on the newer ones, there is no issue. There is also a problem with some of the old diecast metal hulls of Dragon kits, but not all. Some of them have started to crumble and split as the metal starts to deteriorate, I have a Panther G that is crumbling, but a Sturmtiger built at the same time has had no issues.

The DS tracks on the Churchill worked better than I had expected after I had heard the same awful things about them. They did accept glue and paint without issues. 

Same on the M-103. Glued fine and accepted paint. Primed with Krylon. No issues.

Seems Tamiya is doing this now as well. The instructions for the new M4A3E8 mention that the rubber tracks can be glued. I have not tried it yet, however.

The same type of material is used in model railroads for the "trucks" on equipment. it's generic name is Delrin and it's hard to paint.

I built a 1/72 Trumpeter BTR and it was a nice kit.

I will keep it in mind thanx.

The tracks on the sherman was also a black soft plastic of sorts, I did have quite a hard time when I put them on that the mud fell out in places where it bends.

I primed them with tamiya primer and painted with enamels, dried completely and does not feel tacky, it is very hot and dry here or maybe I was just lucky!

Even when I had to stretch them a little to get over the wheels, they did not feel like they were about th crumble.

The tracks on the bradley is also the black stretchy plastic and feels nice and plyable sofar. However I will heed your warning and do this Irak Bradley with acrylics, maybe the weathering will als stick better.

Theuns

Depends; originally, Dragon kits came with black vinyl tracks that did not take paint too well and they remained tacky to the touch if enamels were used. Then later kits came with flesh colored Dragon Styrene ("DS") tracks. Some of these DS tracks crumbled into pieces either while painted and weathered on the vehicle or while untouched inside the box. Later DS tracks were better and didn't have the problem.

Most of the "bad" DS vinyl tracks should be around a decade old and if they were going to deteriorate, they would have done so by now. But on the safe side, just use acrylics to paint and weather.

Dragon black vinyl tracks should be painted and weathered with acrylics as well so the paint dries and doesn't have the tacky feel to them.

Thanx for the info on the idler wheel, too late to fix it now without messing up the paint :-(

I wont tell if you dont LOL

I got a 1/72 Dragon Bradley IFV today and already assembled the wheels and rear hatch, the level of detail is remarkable in such a small kit. 

Are the "elastic" tracks that we get with the kits these days vinal or rubber? I recall a 1/32 Trumpeter MiG 17 that had vinal tires and after a year or so it melted the plastic rims, do I need to take any special steps with these tracks before I put them on?

Theuns

Looks good, some of the Trumpeter kits are pretty good, others not so good in this scale. The rear idler wheel is solid metal and should not have a rubber rim. The Trumpeter M4A1 kit was well received as it was much better than the Revell M4A1(76)W that came out in the mid 1990s. It was overshadowed by the plethora of highly accurate Dragon Shermans.

One of the issues I remember reading about this particular kit was that the hull sides were too sloped as opposed to being near verticle. Not too big of an issue, but it was something that was compared to the Esci M4A1 kit of the 1980s (now reissued by Italeri). That old Esci kit has been disparaged for over 30 years; many say the combination of the 75mm turret and large hatch, wet storage hull didn't exist. Others say it was an extremely rare version that only saw use as the duplex drive amphibious tank.

Don't be afraid of 1/72 scale armor. The quality of the kits has greatly improved over the old Matchbox and Airfix kits of yesteryear. Sites like http://www.onthewaymodels.com/ and http://www.172shermans.com/ have great information regarding small scale armor.

Thanx lads, I have to say I dont mind lack of comment, I joined here to learn for the experts :-) And learn ALLOT I have , still loads to go though LOL

I am trauling my local shops for more 1/72 armor, I would love to do 1/35 but funds at the moment will have to  be managed carefully , besides 1/72 I can hide more of the mistakes LOL

The 1/72 Dragon Bradley IFV seems to be a nicely detailed kit, I might get that one .....

Theuns

I think the rest of just may still be stunned (like Monty Pythons parrot). I can't imagine working in 1/72 scale. One thirty-fifth is bad enough.

It's very well done!

Dang right he did a good job. Hopefully the lack of comments won't keep you from building more armor, Theuns.

Gee whiz guys, no one else going to comment? 

Forgive me Theuns but I'm going to kick this back to the top just so more people will see the great job you did here. 

Thanx, The guns are actually quite "silvery" you just cant se it in the pix.

I will embed the next project in thicker earth , on this one I try to show it on the hard earth, not as successfull as I had hoped but so we learn :-)

Theuns

She looks pretty darn good to me! 

Only real nitpick is maybe sprinkle some more of the sand material around the tracks so she looks embedded in it rather than driving on top of it. If the model is just sitting on the base and you haven't attached her yet just ignore me please! 

And you might try rubbing some pencil graphite on a piece of paper and then rubbing your finger or a cotton swab over it and then rubbing it on the machine guns to give them a light metallic sheen.  

I am calling this little Trumpeter M4A1 76 done. It represents the IDF during the 1961 conflict in the Golan  Hights.

Painted in my own mix (enamel) of IDF sand/grey.

I added the tarp on the back. I still need to make the little nameplate for the base later.

 I still have allot to learn about armour but this was a fun little build

Trumpeter 1/72 M4A1 76 IDF by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

Trumpeter 1/72 M4A1 76 IDF by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

Trumpeter 1/72 M4A1 76 IDF by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

Trumpeter 1/72 M4A1 76 IDF by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

Trumpeter 1/72 M4A1 76 IDF by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

Theuns

Pinwash look more severe than in real life, I now need to put on the dust and toutch up the tracks.

. by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

I found working with these rubberband tracs rather difficult :-(

Theuns

Yup, will do. I want the bottom of the tracks that are in contact with the ground to be more dirty with the "dew ground mud" than on the inner surfaces of them as the "mud" would only  be a few mm thich and not really ride up and over the edges of the tracks. I will however dirty up the wheels and hull aswell.

Theuns

She looks great to me Theuns. I assume you'll slather some of the same 'dirt' from the tracks over the running gear and the lower hull so it won't appear as rusty tracks? 

Hi Bill, I totaaly agree with that. The pix is actually missleading as the true colour is more of a desert yellow/brown than the rust in the pix.

I tried to simulate the dirt/dust that gets stuck in the tracks that might be if driven over an early morning dew covered field, not quite heavy mud that gets flung onto the hull, just a light "sticky" dirt - if that makes any sence.

Somthing like this

Theuns

Hi Theuns,

Great work on the hull and turret. But the tracks shouldn't have any rust. If the vehicle is running, everything is a wearing surface, in an abrasive environment.

Start with a dark gray neutral base, add black on the outside for the rubber pads and highlight bright metal on the horns and raised surfaces on the inside.

Bill

primer on

. by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

Then I added some dark areas wher it would be in the shade

. by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

You cant quite see it inb the pix but there is a slight "shading" in the areas I did before putting on my own mix of IDF sand grey.

. by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

Then for a first attempt at weathering the tracks I am fairly pleased.

. by Theunis van Vuuren, on Flickr

Theuns

Agreed! Modulation really works fantastic on armor. It just takes a little practice to get it where it subtle enough to make it look natural.

Adam Kozlowski has it down perfectly and I'd use his work for some reference. 

But Sun fading and dust is the right track to follow. You won't see much, if any, rust because the sand scrubs it off. Keep that in mind.

Yeah, your tank and the upper photo have the earlier VVSS running gear and the lower the later HVSS style. 

You can certainly pre-shade. You might look up colour modulation too. It's where you paint shadowed areas with a darker shade and upper sunlite areas with a lighter.  

Ok cool I will go look for those paints thanx.

As for weathering an IDF tank like this, I wouls assume faded paint and dust would be the place to start? Do you guys also preshade areas like hatches and pannels like on planes??

I will have to go google ways to weather the tracks, I think this might  be the hardest part of the build.

Theuns

Model master makes an Isreali armor sand and Tamiya has Armor Sand in acrylic. Pick your poison lol.

I've found the color to look as though it's a sand color with a grey tone to it. Pretty close to the color it's already molded in as I can tell from your pictures.

Should be easy enough to find, or replicate with a sand color, with a touch of grey added to it. Might take some experimentation to get it right if you make your own mix, but the color is available without having to do so.

Israeli Armor Sand Gray can be found in Model Master Enamel online.

The kit isn't the same as either of the photos you've got there. The one at Latrun Museum is at least a start.

The first tank is from the 1956 war.