Why no Japanese & Italian armor?

I'm not much on Italian armor (I like the M13/40, though!), but I do have a bunch of Japanese armor: Type 97 Chi-ha for WWII stuff, and modern JGSDF stuff like the Type 61, Type 74, and Type 90 MBTs. I've also done "Made in the USA" JGSDF stuff too: Sherman, Walker Bulldog, and Chaffee.
Looking forward to building Tamiya's new JGSDF LAV, too.

There are a few people here who dabble in the Japanese vehicles, but probably less do Italian armor.

Why? Dunno...perhaps the popular conception that both Italian and Japanese armor was under-armored, under-armed, obsolete, and inferior to everything it came up against has something to do with it.

But I still like 'em!

I think Japanese and Italian armour gets neglected because the Japanese and Italians neglected their own armor arms in WWII. (Most armour posted here is WWII vintage.) Thie tanks were, frankly, tiny and not very good.

But I've got a Tamiya Chi-Ha plus some resin AM pieces and some Friuli treads for it thatr I'm looking forward to building when I finish up a bunch of GB projects over the next two months or so (even though I really dislike Friuli treads).

The performance of the Italian and Japanese armor could also have some impact on how much the models are in demand. There were no large or small scale tank battles in the Pacific Theater, islands were not that big. The Italians were not very successful in their armor battles with the British. Also, I think that neither had anything impressive like T-34's, Shermans, Panthers, Tigers I & II.

I'd like to do an Autoblinda someday, if anyone ever makes a kit of it. If I remember correctly, the Italians also made the first tank destroyer.

It's not WWII, but my current project is Trumpeter's S-tank, which I will post pictures of as soon as it's finished. There will be a short delay, however, since I just discovered yesterday that Trumpeter made a big error in their painting instructions. It's supposed to be green, not gray, and I bought the wrong paint.

My next two projects are WWII American and German, but there's a Firefly and a Canadian Achilles and Kangaroo on my wish list. And most of the post-WWII stuff I wantto model is IDF, Chinese, or Russian.

Just don't expect to see them anytime soon. I'm poor, and can only afford to do about one project a month. Especially since my eyes are bigger than my budget when it comes to things like indy tracks, PE, aluminium barrels...

At this point, the Sherman is the only tank I want to do more than one model of, but I'm just getting started.

M.

I would love to do some Japanese or Italin armor but when I walk into the LHS everything on the shelf is from the big three - US, GB and Russia.

Like J-Hulk I do have a JGSDF M-41.

Tamiya offers a 1/35 Semovento M40/75. Well, I think it's M40/75. At any rate it is definitely a Semovento. It was the first kit I built when I started building again.

The fact that the major players don't really have any in production may have a lot to do with the lack of products out there. Tamiya and Italeri used to have the main Italian M-13/40 some years ago, but apparently stopped production. It would be nice to see something else. Of course their argument would be along the lines that they aren't popular products and would fail to cash in on them.

QUOTE: Originally posted by claymore68 I would love to do some Japanese or Italin armor but when I walk into the LHS everything on the shelf is from the big three - US, GB and Russia.

Now that's my kind of answer!

Honestly, thoughj, I think you left someone out of the group. Namely, the biggest one of all, the one there are eight billion kits for ....

QUOTE: Originally posted by buff Tamiya offers a 1/35 Semovento M40/75. Well, I think it's M40/75. At any rate it is definitely a Semovento. It was the first kit I built when I started building again.

Yeah, and the Semovente is actually the only Italian AFV in the Western Desert that was not a complete piece of garbage. The Germans actually took some of them and crewed them with panzermen.

Fine Molds makes oustanding models of Imperial Japanese Army tanks. While these kits are hard to find in the states, they can be had at better local hobby shops, eBay or from HobbyLink Japan (www.hlj.com). These kits are some of the finest 1/35 scale injection molded armor kits made. They are superior to most of Tamiya's latest kits. The largest kit is still smaller than a Sherman, about the size of a PzKpfw III and the smallest tankette is about the size of a 1/72 scale Abrams tank.

As was mentioned earlier, the Japanese army was still basically a foot soldier army during WW2 and they did not have a lot of armor. Fine Molds does carry most of the variants that were used by Japan.

Italian armor stopped being a factor early on in the war. Italeri and Tamiya do the same sets of Italian tanks, although Italeri's are vastly superior. Model Victoria does a few high priced Italian armor kits as well.

Both countries' armor just doesn't sell that well in the US and Europe.

There is a 40+ year old guy in my club that is mad on Japanese armour. He has also a fine selection of vehicles used by China in their tussle with Japan. He recently converted the Trumpeter Panzer 1 (I think) to represent a vehicle in this conflict.

The general population's demand is what drives the way the market goes. As he says, the cost of buying Japanese armour kits is horrendous, as the mainstream manufacturers are not interested in building for an unknown market. Models were originally marketed to the younger population, and the mystique of big and powerful tanks were big sellers. As we, the original young modellers, have gotten older, we have grown out of that phase and demand more, but that too comes at a price - the spiralling cost of new kits and the less mainstream products.

A perfect example was the display my club set up last August at Queensland's biggest model show. Australia's major opponent in the war were the Japanese and we set up a theme on this basis. Al set up all his considerable collection of Japanese armour at the main focus point of the 3 tables and had a Japanese flag and actual track link set up with them. The rest of the tables were a mix of Aussie marked vehicles, German, British and American armour with a few Israeli dios and a magnificently splinter camo'd Swedish 103C S tank as well. With all that to choose from what was the number one comment/question we were asked every day for the 3 days --- Where is the Tiger tank? That's right, we didn't have one on display and people walked away disappointed. That is the market the manufacturers appeal to.

Market driven..... No demand, no market, relatively no selection.
As was mentioned before, Japan and the Italians were not armor heavy in the so there is not alot of "history" on demand. No Japanese book or teatises on armor tactics taught in US military acadamys, nor are there any great Italian armor heroes. (Unless we go back to the middle ages, then we got some armor baby.....!)

Well, these are pictures of models of Japanese and Italian tanks and such that I have built. There are some I don't have pictures of, but for the most part, these make up my complete collection from these Armies.

All are in 1/72 or 1/76 scale:. First, the Italians:





Next, the Japanese, including two "made in America" tanks:












Although not quite armor, it is the only set of Japanese Artillery in 1/72 or 1/76 scale:



All I need now are models of a Japanese Type 69 tank and a Type 74 tank in 1/72 or 1/76 scale to complete the collection. Then maybe I can wish for some modern Japanese APC's and SP Artillery in that scale!

Interesting reading! Thanks guys for a peek inside the weird & wonderful world of armor.

When i completed this, nobody even knew what it was.. Italian armor is pretty random it seems.

Semovente


More pics at
http://www.andysmodels.com/Semovente.html

Here are the rest of my Italian and Japanese tanks I have in my collection, starting with my Semovente:



It's not nearly as nice as the one above, but I also had built it more than 31 years ago! I do have plans to 'refurbish' it as soon as my bench clears a little.

Here are my remaining Japanese, starting with the Chi-Ha medium tank:



Then, when they were in the process of upgrading the Chi-Ha, they finished upgrading the main hull (engine) first. So they fitted the new hulls with the old turrets as shown here:



They called them the Advanced Type Chi-Ha.

Eventually, when turret production caught up to hull production, they started sending out upgraded turrets to their tank forces in China and elsewhere to be fitted to the older hulls:



These were called the Chi-Ha Advanced Type. For some reason, changing the wording like that enabled them to tell the difference.

Finally, the fully modified tank, seen in my previous post in this thread was known as the Advanced Chi-Ha.

On to the rest.

This next pic is my Japanese M-24 Chaffee:



Followed by my Japanese Type 74:



Now, if I could only get a Japanese Type 69 tank, I'll have a complete line of Japanese medium and heavy tanks.

I think with the exception of the Type 69, and the Ko-Gata that covers the full range of 1/72 and 1/76 scale kits of Italian and Japanese Armor previously or currently offered in injection molded Plastic.

Here's a pic of a Semovente I did back in 1986, actually won the theme award at a chapter I was at.
http://img1.photobucket.com/albums/1003/cplchilly/?action=view¤t=semovente.jpg