Good Old days...

I am an OOB kinda guy. I will be building a Tiger soon and I plan to use some Extra stuff on it. Most things though I cant really see the difference than OOB, but others I go, "WOW!" The main reason though, is I just cant see my self spending more than $80 bucks on every model. But there will be times when I really want to detail it up.

I usually build OOB. My local HS has sales everynow and than on its AM/PE items. Depending what is on sale I may buy an item to use. I also check my spare parts box to see if any of the contents can be used on the current project I am working on.

Just recently back from a 13 yr break in modelling. When I stopped PE was pretty exotic and almost unheard of. Still have some of my scratchbuilt stuff and actually like doing it the hard way. Almost feels like cheating to use PE. I suppose if I was to do an interior again I would purchase the kit since my skills aren't quite what they use to be (perishable skill) and cost really isn't an issue anymore. Still plan on going back to scratchbuilding though.

Up to this point I've pretty much been an "OOB" builder, and still em for the most part. Having flirted with trying too scratch build some items, I like the fact that much can now be obtained from AM and PE accessory kits. Moving in the direction of AM/PE accessories hac certainly driven costs up and reduced the number of kits I'd like too build. The trade off of course being a more interesting and detailed project. Some of what I consider my best work has been OOB. I know kind of an oxymoron statement? The most important judge of your work is your own self satisfation with what you have created. Semper Fi, mike

It never ceases to amaze me, but, we always get opinions about PE and aftermarket acc's, proposing that its not "real modeling". These comments are usually predicated by "I only build OOB and scratch build details". I can tell you that there is nothing "easy" about PE sets. If you build exclusively OOB -you can't appreciate it. The fact is, if you want added realism, you go for PE, but you still have to BUILD IT. I think the assumption is that PE and aftermaket are shortcuts ,and one can "buy" a masterpiece. This just isn't true. For some folks, the financial freedom to put money into a model is something that is earned, sometimes taking many years. I've been building since the sixties, and I can tell you that I am thankful for all the aftermarket thta is around these days.

Steve

I'm largely an OOB builder for a variety of reasons. The biggest is $. It's very hard to justify to myself spending $60+ in AM stuff on a $20 kit every time I go to build. I will on occasion (such as for GBs or special projects) actively look at AM stuff but for the most part the kit supplied items are put to use in the best way possible. I'll also occasionally kitbash parts or scratchbuild little items such as tarps or antenna masts but not much beyond that.

With the improving quality of kits and inclusion of aluminum barrels and PE grills becoming more commonplace they do get used on the build if they are included so in my mind that would still make them OOB.

I'm an OOB kind of guy myself. Seldom add AM stuff to my kits, but when I got into modeling there was no such thing, so old habits die hard!!

Blair

QUOTE: Originally posted by tediam Heavy Artty, I removed my post because I suddenly felt inadequate (well, downright stupid) for using PE. So my question is: can you perhaps post how to make tool clamps? I too would like to build from scratch, and am in the process of setting up my own PE production facility ( I suppose then it will be scratchbuilt). Until I get all this going, how can I make these parts without PE? Thanks so much for your help in advance. Ted

What type of clamps are you making, for what type/time period of vehicles? That will dictate how you make them.

For simple, snap-in type (where the tools are held in place like in a clothes pin) I simply wrap a small, rectangular piece of styrene (ususally 0.20 thick) around the tool handle in a "U" shape, with one end open that the tool slides into. Then crimp around the tool handle so that it looks nice and tight in the holder. Also, don't put the tool all the way to the bottom of the "U", it should be about half way down, so there is still an open area below, between the hull and the tool. You can also use some masking tape cut to length and width as a tie down strap across the open end of the "U" as well.

For more modern holders where the tool is strapped down in place, I use 0.10 rod and bend it into a tiedown bracket and attach it to the hull where the tool gets tied down. You need two, one on either side of the handle or tool. Now simply thread some masking tape as a strap to hold the tool down, just like on the real vehicle.

Hope those give you a few ideas. Basically, with a little strip and rod styrene, a good plan, photo, or drawing of what you intend on building, and a little patience, you can build anything from scratch.

Good luck.

Heavy Artty,

I removed my post because I suddenly felt inadequate (well, downright stupid) for using PE. So my question is: can you perhaps post how to make tool clamps? I too would like to build from scratch, and am in the process of setting up my own PE production facility ( I suppose then it will be scratchbuilt). Until I get all this going, how can I make these parts without PE?

Thanks so much for your help in advance.

Ted

I mix them up. Occasionally I just need to do a simple, profanity-free and PE-free (synonyms!) build. this month I am doing a King Tiger with PE, indie AM tracks, aluminum and resin barrel with figures AND a Sherman right out of the box (although I may add a couple AM figures.) When the Tiger changes my build from a G rating to NC-17, I will switch!!

I kind of fall in between the extremes. In the 1/72 world, its usally straight out of the box, limiting the mods to simple fixes such as drilling out the ends of the gun barrels. Sometimes just assembling a kit without killing myself on the detail is a nice change of pace. I just got done with the 1/72 Bradley that was reviewed in this month's FSM, and built it almost straight from the box.

For 1/35, I do like the effect of photo-etch and will continue to use it in the future. I'm not real keen on buying after market parts unless it for something that is truly not feasible to scratch build, such as tracks. With a little creativity, a pile a Evergreen sheet styrene, and some patience, one can fabricate almost anything. Recalling the article in this month's FSM on the Sherman Firefly, I would have used the two piece kit gun barrel, spending the time to carefully join the halves, sand it, and fill it rather than plunking down the cash for an aluminum one.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Michael Ellis I'm bringing this to a halt before it goes any further. Both Armormaster and romelio had politically motived items in their posts (Armormaster in his signature and Romelio in the post itself.) Both have been removed because this is not a place for discussions about political endorsements, this is a place to discuss modeling. If someone would like to spin this particular discussion back to the question of how many build armor kits out of the box, feel free. If not, we'll lock it and move on to something else.

Micheal,

i apologise; i wrote my response just as yours was going on, otherwise i would have kept away.

sorry if i appear to fan flames.

HeavyArty, please, let's be friends.

heavyarty

you have missed my point entirely, and also perhaps that 2 well established contributors recently left because they got into "off-topic" stuff instead of focussing on the modelling side of things.

let me explain myself so you don't think i've gone PC mad etc etc

if people want to talk politics all day long, that's fine with me, but shouldn't we be doing it it somewhere else?

given what's happened here on this forum in the recent past i'm surprised that others don't think so.

personally, i don't mind if someone says "i support so-and-so", even if their political bent is not mine...i think my political views are robust enough to justify to all and sundry.

this forum is for modellers to talk about modelling and have fun, not to advertise or promote their political beliefs.

you guys seem a little paranoid on the censorship front: it's just courtesy or etiquette as far as i'm concerned.

the "Off Topc" forum was removed basically because people couldn't behave themselves.

happy modelling to one and all

kind regards,

NIcholas

Good Old Days...Good Old Censorship...Gotta love political correctness on what are supposed to be open forums. Glad we allow one dissenting voice to change what is viewed by many. Now back to modelling.

I'm bringing this to a halt before it goes any further. Both Armormaster and romelio had politically motived items in their posts (Armormaster in his signature and Romelio in the post itself.) Both have been removed because this is not a place for discussions about political endorsements, this is a place to discuss modeling. If someone would like to spin this particular discussion back to the question of how many build armor kits out of the box, feel free. If not, we'll lock it and move on to something else.

I personally don't like to use AM and PE stuff. I think it is all way overpriced. I can make most, if not all the details I need from scratch. I like the old style of build it yourself too. Granted, once completed, the super PE and AM models look great, but they usually end up costing 3-4 times the original kit price. I also think you need more skill to build it from scratch yourself, I respect the modelers that build it themself more, as opossed to those who buy an add-on AM kit and lots of PE to build their "masterpieces".

QUOTE: ED, how come you didn't block this?

The answer is called censorship!!

Don't know what romelio had said, but, Armormaster has done nothing wrong by posting a picture of an election sticker. And you seem to be the only one offended by it. He did not write anything in the post about who to vote for or why/how you should vote. Blocking the post is called censorship, thats why. Maybe we should block your post just because we don't like that you are from England, or because that your sig banner has a red/white cross flag on it.. That is about as absurd as blocking this post for an election sticker.
Lets not get petty on how these forums operate. If you are too offended, don't read the post.

nmayhew: I don't think is "bad" to add what I think, armormaster probably likes bush and I respect that, and first, you live in London and I live in the border with the USA and we are free to say what ever we think, and I'm not saying nothing bad.

Don't panic is the last time I'll do it.......

And keep on modeling....

Gabe....

On armor I almost always use PE, almost always use aftermarket tracks (that really depends on the kit), ocassionally use metal barrels, and ocassionally use resin parts.

Of course, my basic rule is that the AM pieces must be substantial improvements over the kit parts, supply details omitted in the kit, or provide parts to convert the kit to the version I desire.

I still do both. I tend to detail stuff where it needs to be, but my last award was for best OOB kit (it also won 1st).

For me, it's about a 50/50 split and it really depends on the kit I'm building. Some of the AM stuff that's available make the basic kit look so much better that it's hard not to want to put they on every build. However, every once and a while a straight OTB kit is a great way to "cleanse the pallet" and just relax during a build.

i build mostly oob,i still like the other kits bit i find them to costly.

gdarwin[roy]

romelio

i'm not sure this forum is the best place to advertise your USA election perferences...

we try to keep politics out of here, as things tend to get a bit heated when people don't agree.[:0]

ED, how come you didn't block this?
regards,

Nicholas

Armor Master: I do Tanks out of the box sometimes is more great to wait until the PE get to your mail.......and that's the old way, the best!

Gabriel Salazar



Keep on modeling!!!!

I mostly build out of the box. I do use AM parts when I want to build a special project or when I want to correct errors in the kit. My first choice of aftermarket parts are engine deck grills and metal barrels.

Wow, quick response Eric! -Oh yeah, I forgot to mention, the only AM I every use is PE brass grilles. Your post reminded me! The grilles aren't Eduard or Verlinden brand, their just genaric Architechture brass supply items. I also make my own tow cables from copper wire...

I am basically an OOB Builder. I sometimes do some minor modifications but that's as far as I go. I don't really buy AM/PE parts because of budget constraints.

And at this stage, I am still happy building OOB.

I generally use 1-2 AM pieces (grilles and tracks). Dragon fortunately takes care of that problem, at least anymore. Otherwise, it depends on the additives needed. I try not to spend more than the kit on AM parts.