Late war Tiger II

Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Late war Tiger II

Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, December 4, 2004 9:43 AM

I would like to reproduce a Tiger II like those produced in the late months of the war.
I found some info's but I need to solve some doubts I still have:

- late production gun mantlet;
- no zimmerit coating; (from September 1944)
- Interior painted in red priming color;
- base color in Dunkelgrun (from November 1944);
- little shield over the gunner sight; (from January 1945);
- single link KGs 73/800/152 tracks (form March 1945);
- I think to paint the tank in ambush camouflage pattern; Feldgrau was authorized in place of Dunkelgelb in the last months of 1944, but I don't know if it was actually used...
- from some late war photos almost all Tiger II seem to lack side and back mudguards: I'm wondering if late in the war the addition of these elements was discontinued;
- the track-links hangers in the side of the turret for the new track set (KGs 73/800/152 ), differed from those for the previous one?

Thanks a lot for all suggestions or info's you can provide.

Regards,
Luciano B.

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ridleusmc

Member since
July 2003
From: Cincinnati, Ohio

Posted by ridleusmc on Saturday, December 4, 2004 10:50 AM

a friend in the local hobby club lent me a book called "Modelers Guide to the Tiger Tank" from Military Miniatures. It helped me considerably with my Tiger I and it had all kinds of good stuff about the Tiger II. I'm sure it would answer all your questions about the Tiger II.

I do remember that the very late Tiger II's did have wierd spare track hangers on the turret. Instead of 4 sets of hangers per side (2 front, 2 back) there were 6 sets per side. 3 near the front of the turret, 3 near the rear, on both sides. The base color for the very late tiger II's was dark green. The tracks were single link.

I'm sorry that's all I remember from that book, but I'm sure that there are many Tiger II experts who can give you some better info.

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, December 4, 2004 1:58 PM

you could wait for the Late Kingtiger from Dragon

you would need Ribbed track guards
flat cornered rear hatch
Poison gas indicators
sheet metal guards over the cooling air intackes (experimentle)
three sets of hangers fore and aft of the turret sides
Five loops on both turret sides
single post on top of the left front periscope guard on the cupola(for anti air craft gun)

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, December 4, 2004 1:59 PM

This is what I have for final variant Tiger II modifications in addition to what you have listed;

Four vent lines for fuel system, deleted; jack, jack block, and track mounting cable, two locks for driver's and radioman's hatches, ribbed track guards on front, post mount for AA MG instead of ring, simplified rear turret hatch and 5 rings welded on turret sides for holding camouflage.
I'm not seeing any reference to the Field Gray paint though. Confused [%-)]

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spector822002

Member since
December 2003
From: Southern Maine

Posted by spector822002 on Saturday, December 4, 2004 8:31 PM

I believe the grey was used in place of the green , not the yellow . I may be wrong here . I don't know it it was ever used on any German armor however . Kind of hard to tell from B&W photos .

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, December 5, 2004 4:33 AM

I'm a bit confused about the hangers actually present.
I found a photo showing the Henschel factory just captured by the Allies, in which are shown some complete turrets; although those must be the very last turrets produced, they seem to have four pairs of hangers and no loop rings for each side, like early model turrets; I'm wondering if the solution with six pairs of hangers and five loop rings for each side was only a paper disposition never actually made or an "ad interim" solution...
...I'll be very grateful if you could provide photos of tank turrets with these late features.

Following the photo of the Henschel factory

[img.nr]C:\Documents and Settings\Bassotti Luciano\Desktop\KTiger-Turrets.JPEG[/img.nr]

Thanks again to all.
Regards,
Luciano B.

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, December 5, 2004 11:34 AM

At the moment, the only photo of a turret with six pairs of hangers and the camo rings I can find was not installed and is sitting in a railcar.

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, December 5, 2004 12:06 PM

QUOTE: Originally posted by Peridexion

At the moment, the only photo of a turret with six pairs of hangers and the camo rings I can find was not installed and is sitting in a railcar.

I agree... And I think it has been pretty much proven that the "6" hanger turret never actually saw production or combat service, just a few prototypes that were in testing..

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, December 5, 2004 12:23 PM

There is also a photo of a final variant turret sitting on a uncompleted chassis too, so there is at least two turrets built. This is heading off into hyperspace, if you know what I mean.....

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TMN1

Member since
October 2004

Posted by TMN1 on Sunday, December 5, 2004 12:46 PM

QUOTE: Originally posted by Peridexion

At the moment, the only photo of a turret with six pairs of hangers and the camo rings I can find was not installed and is sitting in a railcar.

Thats the picture I have infront of me. Is it from Thomas L. Jentz's book ??
And like you said .... this is heading into cyberspace. Hmmm reminds me of an old thread about zimmerit on a Jagdtiger.
There is no evidence of this turret entering service, there is only the 2 pictures in Thomas L. Jentz's book that proves it was built.
Also about the grey being used in camo, I haven't found any evidence that is was used only that it was allowed to use it.

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beav

Member since
May 2003
From: Ft. Sill, OK

Posted by beav on Sunday, December 5, 2004 12:52 PM

If that guy was able to get pictures, there are probably more of these kinds of tanks out there, in pictures or not. I would think, that prototypes in the last months of the war would end up in combat service regardless of production/prototype status. I would think you could do the x-tra turret work if you wanted to.

"First to Fire!"

Steven

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, December 5, 2004 1:51 PM

TMN1; That's is indeed the book I'm looking at. But I agree with Beav. Lots of things happened without any photos to prove it. The photo on page 142 of Germany's Tiger Tanks claims to be one of the last Tigers produced. It has the rain guard and the ribbed mudguards, but still has the MG ring and not the 6 pairs of track hangers or the camo rings. That sort of closes the gap a little tighter. Still, who knows?

As for the gray; The only reference I see for gray is allowing the use of PanzerGray in an emergency. I have seen a reference to Field Gray as being used as a minor overspray on a Jagdtiger, so I guess it is possible that it was used on KTs as well.

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, December 5, 2004 3:38 PM

So you dont want to know what the last Kingtigers looked like
why not get a photo of a late war Kingtiger like from Berlin and copy it, there were still some of the first Kingtigers about late in the war

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, December 5, 2004 4:25 PM

I just looked at some Berlin KT's from the 503rd, I didn't see the features in question on them. Got some more Jon? Don't be holdin' out on us now. Wink [;)]

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TMN1

Member since
October 2004

Posted by TMN1 on Sunday, December 5, 2004 10:51 PM

QUOTE: Originally posted by Peridexion

TMN1; That's is indeed the book I'm looking at. But I agree with Beav. Lots of things happened without any photos to prove it. The photo on page 142 of Germany's Tiger Tanks claims to be one of the last Tigers produced. It has the rain guard and the ribbed mudguards, but still has the MG ring and not the 6 pairs of track hangers or the camo rings. That sort of closes the gap a little tighter. Still, who knows?

As for the gray; The only reference I see for gray is allowing the use of PanzerGray in an emergency. I have seen a reference to Field Gray as being used as a minor overspray on a Jagdtiger, so I guess it is possible that it was used on KTs as well.

That was kind of the reaction I expected ..... and hoped for. All I said was there is no evidence of this happening, I didn't say that it absolutely did not happen ..... I was very careful about not saying that. Im just trying to make it clear that if you build a model of such a vehicle it will be more or less guess work, and that is perfectly alright.
Like you said .......... who knows??

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, December 5, 2004 11:56 PM

Luciano,
If you want to see what a very LATE Tiger II would have probably looked like, Pick up a great book called "The Modelers Guide to the Tiger Tank" a Military Miniatures in review book.. It has a "small" pic of a Late Tiger II and a good build up of what one might have looked like..
For you guys that have this mag, and I am sure many of you do, it's on page 92..
Hope this helps..

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